5th Gen Steering

S

syndicate1

New member
Hey folks, newbie here and long time lurker. I owned a 2002 4runner which I bought new and sold in 2006 for a BMW X5. Both great SUV's, albeit I find the X5 a bit small for carrying my ski, bike and surf gear.

I'm looking to get back into a 4runner and recently test drove a 2011 Limited. I liked everything about the 5th Gen except for the steering. I felt the power steering was WAY to easy (loose maybe?) compared to the X5. I understand that I am comparing apples and oranges but would like a tighter feel if I am to buy the 5th Gen LE.

Is there a mod or change that would tighten the steering feeling when driving? I'm not an old lady that needs/wants super easy power steering :)

Thanks
 
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syndicate1 said:
Hey folks, newbie here and long time lurker. I owned a 2002 4runner which I bought new and sold in 2006 for a BMW X5. Both great SUV's, albeit I find the X5 a bit small for carrying my ski, bike and surf gear.

I'm looking to get back into a 4runner and recently test drove a 2011 Limited. I liked everything about the 5th Gen except for the steering. I felt the power steering was WAY to easy (loose maybe?) compared to the X5. I understand that I am comparing apples and oranges but would like a tighter feel if I am to buy the 5th Gen LE.

Is there a mod or change that would tighten the steering feeling when driving? I'm not an old lady that needs/wants super easy power steering :)

Thanks
Click to expand...

My wife also has an x5 and the steering is night and day between the 2, you cant even compare them. The x5 is very stiff and the 4 runner is on the easy side.
 
Is there a reason to want it/have it tighter? Not enough time for the gym, need to get a work out on the go?

As long as when the wheel turns so does the car does it matter? If there was 'play' in the wheel I could understand having issues, but the system is 'tight', just easy to turn. This is not F1, don't need the feedback.
 
I agree the above. My wife also drives an X5 diesel. I prefer the loose steering of my 4 Runner while she doesn't like the 4R steering at all. The BMW is stiffer in just about every way and has much more sensitive breaking. I'm very happy with my 4R but wish it could have the diesel engine of the X5. Way more power and better gas mileage. Can't beat that.
 
syndicate1 said:
Hey folks, newbie here and long time lurker. I owned a 2002 4runner which I bought new and sold in 2006 for a BMW X5. Both great SUV's, albeit I find the X5 a bit small for carrying my ski, bike and surf gear.

I'm looking to get back into a 4runner and recently test drove a 2011 Limited. I liked everything about the 5th Gen except for the steering. I felt the power steering was WAY to easy (loose maybe?) compared to the X5. I understand that I am comparing apples and oranges but would like a tighter feel if I am to buy the 5th Gen LE.

Is there a mod or change that would tighten the steering feeling when driving? I'm not an old lady that needs/wants super easy power steering :)

Thanks
Click to expand...

More positive caster in the wheel alignment makes a world of difference on the 5th Gens.Most come from the factory on the low end of the specs and the steering is light and touchy. Some people like it like that and it's a matter of personal taste I guess.Felt much lighter then my old 4th Gen.'s steering and the first thing I noticed when I test drove one for the first time.I had to pay attention to straight line steering alot more on the highway as the slightest touch had it wandering.

I'm not sure how much more pos. caster you can get with the stock UCA's as I changed mine before I had it aligned the first time. Maybe you can have the dealer service manager adjust it for max caster for free right off the bat. Just make him show you the printout.

I put aftermarket UCA's when I lifted it and ran it at +4.0 for the first year and have had over +5.0 for most of this year now with the range supposed to be +2.0 - +4.0 I believe. Works great,super stable on the highway,even tire wear and much firmer steering feel.Another plus is,no tire rub on the mudflaps with bigger 33" tires as it moves the wheels forward in the wheel well.In theory it gives up a little turning radius as it makes for a longer wheel base but not that noticeable,at least to me.

Here's a quote from Tirerack's caster explanation......

"Caster angle settings allow the vehicle manufacturer to balance steering effort, high speed stability and front end cornering effectiveness.

Increasing the amount of positive caster will increase steering effort and straight line tracking, as well as improve high speed stability and cornering effectiveness. Positive caster also increases tire lean when cornering (almost like having more negative camber) as the steering angle is increased.

What's the downside to positive caster? If the vehicle doesn't have power steering, a noticeable increase in steering effort will be felt as positive caster is increased. Other than that, the effects of positive caster are pretty much "positive," especially increasing the lean of the tire when the vehicle is cornering while returning it to a more upright position when driving straight ahead."
 
Last edited:
harper7 said:
More positive caster in the wheel alignment makes a world of difference on the 5th Gens.Most come from the factory on the low end of the specs and the steering is light and touchy. Some people like it like that and it's a matter of personal taste I guess.Felt much lighter then my old 4th Gen.'s steering and the first thing I noticed when I test drove one for the first time.I had to pay attention to straight line steering alot more on the highway as the slightest touch had it wandering.

I'm not sure how much more pos. caster you can get with the stock UCA's as I changed mine before I had it aligned the first time. Maybe you can have the dealer service manager adjust it for max caster for free right off the bat. Just make him show you the printout.

I put aftermarket UCA's when I lifted it and ran it at +4.0 for the first year and have had over +5.0 for most of this year now with the range supposed to be +2.0 - +4.0 I believe. Works great,super stable on the highway,even tire wear and much firmer steering feel.Another plus is,no tire rub on the mudflaps with bigger 33" tires as it moves the wheels forward in the wheel well.In theory it gives up a little turning radius as it makes for a longer wheel base but not that noticeable,at least to me.

Here's a quote from Tirerack's caster explanation......

"Caster angle settings allow the vehicle manufacturer to balance steering effort, high speed stability and front end cornering effectiveness.

Increasing the amount of positive caster will increase steering effort and straight line tracking, as well as improve high speed stability and cornering effectiveness. Positive caster also increases tire lean when cornering (almost like having more negative camber) as the steering angle is increased.

What's the downside to positive caster? If the vehicle doesn't have power steering, a noticeable increase in steering effort will be felt as positive caster is increased. Other than that, the effects of positive caster are pretty much "positive," especially increasing the lean of the tire when the vehicle is cornering while returning it to a more upright position when driving straight ahead."
Click to expand...


Thanks, I was already planning to try a bit of +caster when i re-align, now I'll probably go a bit further with it. My only complaint with the steering is that it doesn't track really straight on the highway, sounds like that should sort it out.
 
The steering on my 3rd Gen was stiff and when the new SR5 arrived, it was a delight to drive....really enjoy it now....tracks fine and is not tiring to drive long distances
 
westwind77 said:
Is there a reason to want it/have it tighter? Not enough time for the gym, need to get a work out on the go?

As long as when the wheel turns so does the car does it matter? If there was 'play' in the wheel I could understand having issues, but the system is 'tight', just easy to turn. This is not F1, don't need the feedback.
Click to expand...

I don't need a gym. I just like to drive with no hands. The X5 is tight and I feel safe letting go of the wheel on long straight highways to take a nap.
 
offroadingatc said:
Thanks, I was already planning to try a bit of +caster when i re-align, now I'll probably go a bit further with it. My only complaint with the steering is that it doesn't track really straight on the highway, sounds like that should sort it out.
Click to expand...

What you "might" be experiencing is an alignment which does not take the "crown" of the road into consideration. Since you are planning an alignment and an increase in Caster, I would suggest you go something like this: 3.0 to 3.2 on the drivers side, and 2.8 to 3.0 on the passenger side. This slight difference in caster will help you track straighter when dealing with crowned roads, and not effect pull when on roads without crown. Again, this is just an example, your actual numbers might be different depending on where your alignment caster is set now, how far you want to pull your wheels forward chancing the "rub", any lift, tire size etc. etc. Make sure you take it to a reputable alignment person/shop, not just your dealer!
 
New to the forum. Do not have enough posts to start my own thread but found this one which is relevant to my question. I have a new 2016 Trail. When I get her to highway speed it seems it takes a lot of attention to keep her tracking straight. Seems I have to constantly make small adjustments.

I know this is a truck, body on frame etc. But the steering just seems a little squirrely. Is this the nature of a new 5th gen?
 
Totally Opposite Problem Here

I cant believe I found your thread. I bought a new 5th Gen Trail, I have 2500 miles on it as of today and I was seriously considering trading it in to Ford for a new Explorer. The problem I am having is that the steering is so tight that my elbows hurt, as well as the secondary muscles in my forearm. Its like they are both strained from turning the wheel. I didnt know what else to do except get rid of the vehicle. I traded in my 2006 Sport and all I had to do to make a 90 degree turn onto my block was use my index finger. With my new Trail, just making tiny adjustments while driving, either in heavy traffic or an open highway seems to take more muscle. To the point where its hurting my arms. I thought for sure it was where I had my seat positioned or where I had my steering wheel positioned but NOTHING helped. I suppose from what I am reading that the caster has to be adjusted. Anyone want to chime in? Please feel free to do so before I trade this beauty in for an Explorer. HELP!! LOL.

P.S. I will put pictures up of the 4R when I picked it up with 55 miles on it from the dealer and the mods I made to it. This came to me directly from Japan. I hope that I dont have to trade this puppy in because I already spent a few hundred on mods. And that doesnt even count new speakers yet.
 
Just as a follow up, after reading this thread and posting my last message, I went over to the dealer and stated my complaint. They had the vehicle for 2 hours and found nothing wrong. They made no adjustments as a result. They tried to find another vehicle on the lot so Icould drive it and make a comparison but they only had a Limited with Bridgestone tires and a SR5 with another type of tire. They wanted too get the same vehicle with the same trim setup but didnt have one. I met with the head of the service department and the master tech. He did mention that the tires could make a difference so thats why they didnt have me drive one of the other vehicles. So I must mention that I have the standard Dunlops that came with the 4R. I always drove on BF GoodRich Trail TA's from my Camaros in the 90s all the way to my other 2006 T4R. I wonder if the tires, as well as tire pressure is causing my problem. They made note of the issue and would try to have a similar 4R on site when I have my first service. So with all that said, anyone have any advice? Anything to add? Greatly appreciated.
 
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