Adding an external transmission cooler and bypassing the internal, replace radiator?

[dbsoundman]

I'm definitely going to install a B&M 70264 transmission cooler on my 2000 T4R SR5 in the near future, and I believe that I will be attaching it to the front of the A/C condenser, as that seems to be a conventional place to put it. (If that's not the right spot, please tell me!) I'm also going to be completely bypassing the radiator's transmission cooler, so I'm starting to wonder if it would really be worthwhile to replace the radiator at this point. I have no reason to believe that it needs replacement, though it's probably the original, and I've now got about 148k miles on the odometer. I realize the radiator is relatively cheap, but I can also think of better things to do with $120 right now than buy a radiator I don't need to replace. Does anyone have any thoughts on this issue for/against replacing the radiator?

 

[FancyPantsMcGee]

This thread was 3 down from yours at time of posting:
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/107129-transmission-cooler-pass-radiator-not-pass.html

 

[dbsoundman]

I've been watching that thread too, but I was just hoping for a more straightforward answer. I do know now that the cooler goes on the front of the condenser for sure, and so I could replace the radiator at any time, I'm just not sure if it's worth it to replace the radiator at this point.

 

[Nelsonmd]

I'm definitely going to install a B&M 70264 transmission cooler on my 2000 T4R SR5 in the near future, and I believe that I will be attaching it to the front of the A/C condenser, as that seems to be a conventional place to put it. (If that's not the right spot, please tell me!) I'm also going to be completely bypassing the radiator's transmission cooler, so I'm starting to wonder if it would really be worthwhile to replace the radiator at this point. I have no reason to believe that it needs replacement, though it's probably the original, and I've now got about 148k miles on the odometer. I realize the radiator is relatively cheap, but I can also think of better things to do with $120 right now than buy a radiator I don't need to replace. Does anyone have any thoughts on this issue for/against replacing the radiator?

Yeah, don't go to that other thread, it is a bitter, non-sensical mess.

If you are bypassing your radiator, then no need to replace it, unless you want to replace it for better engine cooling. You can get B&M's instructions off their website and I think they comment on the efficiency of different placements. Sneak preview, in front of the condenser is the most efficient.

Also read their instructions for how to plumb it. There has been some disagreement on the best way to do that as well and I'd hate to see it become a non-empirical hissy-fit like the bypass thread. Just go by the B&M instructions. Good luck.

 

[zooroadbaja]

Why not use the money from the B&M and put it towards a new radiator, you're already half way there with the $60. Figure your radiator now has lasted 148k miles, whats another $120 for another 100k+ miles? That's only $14.50 a year, until you hit 100k again. Really not that bad when you think about it.

 

[dbsoundman]

I see your point. I was thinking that an external cooler would be best simply because I may tow with this vehicle, and living in Colorado I don't want to overheat going up a mountain pass. I then figured given the possibility of leakage/failure and the somewhat marginal difference between bypassing the radiator and running it in series with the cooler, I figured I could just install a cooler without using the radiator for the transmission at all. I then also figured I could possibly save some money and not replace the radiator immediately. But, I'm still not sure...

 

[zooroadbaja]

You could always get the new radiator. Get it out of the way since it's the more expensive item. Then see how it tows, and what the temps are. If you need the cooler then buy one.

 

[Drcoffee]

So what, you want to waste the $200 for a new radiator and cooler on fuzzy dice?????

Ever hear of penny wise, pound foolish.

Start by bringing your vehicle up to date on maintenance. Then start the mods. How cool will it look sitting in your garage with a blown engine or trashed tranny? Do you know how much they cost? You don't sound like you have ever wrenched before so consider what the cost of poor maintenance will be before doing this on the cheap. Nelsonmd, of course you have the final word on this discussion. I bow down to your immenseness. Thank you for blessing us with your wisdom. When nelsonmd speaks, there's nothing left to say.

:thanks:

 

[dbsoundman]

I purchased this vehicle fairly recently from a dealer, so as far as I know it's up to date on most maintenance. I can't know for sure but I have to guess that it's fine. I will most likely replace both, once I get to look at the existing radiator in the daylight to see if it passes a visual inspection. I just want to ensure that I'm not just wasting money on paranoia.

 

[Nelsonmd]

So what, you want to waste the $200 for a new radiator and cooler on fuzzy dice?????

Ever hear of penny wise, pound foolish.

Start by bringing your vehicle up to date on maintenance. Then start the mods. How cool will it look sitting in your garage with a blown engine or trashed tranny? Do you know how much they cost? You don't sound like you have ever wrenched before so consider what the cost of poor maintenance will be before doing this on the cheap. Nelsonmd, of course you have the final word on this discussion. I bow down to your immenseness. Thank you for blessing us with your wisdom. When nelsonmd speaks, there's nothing left to say.

:thanks:

Grow up and contribute something more than your uninformed BS opinion stated as fact. You have a problem with what I say, then back up your criticism with data or legitimate references.

 

[Drcoffee]

Grow up and contribute something more than your uninformed BS opinion stated as fact. You have a problem with what I say, then back up your criticism with data or legitimate references.

References?
I gave you an article from an expert who writes for Hotrod magazine with decades of industry experience on the designed ideal transmission operational temperature and the graphic charts from a pre-eminent oil manufacturer "Amsoil." You don't get to the top of the industry by hiring dummies. They are industry leaders because they have invested in R&D and refined their product to produce the best oil that the racing industry can rely on and be willing to pay top dollar for. So Nelson, I put more weight in their opinion than yours, even if their research conflicts with your anecdote. Maybe you should consult a grocery store for proper oil use. That way it won't be biased.

And when I pressed another member for his setup, it turns out that he bypassed his radiator with two coolers and an extra cooling fan. There's nothing wrong with it if you do it correctly.

What have you contributed for sources and data? "Me and my homies did it and it hasn't exploded yet"
:frog:

Really, do you believe that because you say it, it makes it fact or the preferred method. Show me something more than anecdote and then we'll discuss the merits of both ideas. As for now, you have nothing concrete to offer, well except for insults.

 

[Nelsonmd]

References?
I gave you an article from an expert who writes for Hotrod magazine with decades of industry experience on the designed ideal transmission operational temperature and the graphic charts from a pre-eminent oil manufacturer "Amsoil."

And when I pressed another member for his setup, it turns out that he bypassed his radiator with two coolers and an extra cooling fan. There's nothing wrong with it if you do it correctly.

What have you contributed for sources and data? "Me and my homies did it and it hasn't exploded yet"
:frog:

Really, do you believe that because you say it, it makes it fact or the preferred method. Show me something more than anecdote and then we'll discuss the merits of both ideas. As for now, you have nothing concrete to offer, well except for insults.

The difference is that I haven't made blanket statements of fact that aren't backed up by evidence like you did many times in the bypass discussion (http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...ler-pass-radiator-not-pass-2.html#post1050029), or use hyperbole scare tactic language like you have here:

So what, you want to waste the $200 for a new radiator and cooler on fuzzy dice?????

Ever hear of penny wise, pound foolish.

Start by bringing your vehicle up to date on maintenance. Then start the mods. How cool will it look sitting in your garage with a blown engine or trashed tranny? Do you know how much they cost? You don't sound like you have ever wrenched before so consider what the cost of poor maintenance will be before doing this on the cheap. Nelsonmd, of course you have the final word on this discussion. I bow down to your immenseness. Thank you for blessing us with your wisdom. When nelsonmd speaks, there's nothing left to say.

:thanks:

Read my posts again. All I do is point out opposing viewpoints (with the disclaimer that they are either opinion or common practice).

The amsoil chart you presented is a chart made by a for-profit company and touts the superiority of their specific product. Do you really believe that is a legitimate reference source for a big picture discussion? I have cited private companies before for information, but I have always stated clearly that they are a potentially biased source. The hot rod magazine chart is fine (though it is worth questioning the magazine's bias as they are likely sponsored by some oil companies), but it starts at 175°. Our discussion has been about temps lower than that, so by extrapolating that chart, we should see nearly infinite life at the 140-170° people have reported with the external tranny cooler, which is probably not correct.

I have cited B&M as experts not on items that prove their superiority over an alternative, only for non-competitive items like installation method/orientation.

I am fine with you making the statements you make as long as you disclaim them as your opinion, or give citation that isn't biased (or at least disclaim it as potentially biased). My problem is that you don't disclaim anything, you just tell us "here is how it is", and some of what you say is blatantly false.

 

[zooroadbaja]

Mods need to make a sticky about this radiator, B&M situation. Way to many post in the past few days about this.