Aftermarket locking diff for 5th gen?

[KCcarguy]

I've got a new 2011 SR-5. It is both my DD and general outdoor utility vehicle, family hauler, etc. I've been researching aftermarket rear locking diffs. I have a few questions for you experts out there.

1) Do I need a rear locking diff? I don't do any serious rock-climbing, but I do drive a lot of muddy/ rutted roads for fishing, camping, etc. I also have to drive in to work regardless of weather.....sometimes deep snow. From my understanding, locking diffs are very useful on ultra-slick surfaces where ATRAC won't work.

2) Is an ARB air locker the best option? Is it appropriate for a DD?

3) Do ARB lockers work in extreme cold? I'm especially worried about the compressor or other mechanicals freezing-up.

 

[Edubsam]

You probably won't need a locker for the fishing trips, but if you get stuck it will be useful. You know what you will be driving on better than I do.

An ARB is great for a DD because it is selectable. That means it can be turned off and you will drive as if it wasn't there, which is the goal of a DD

I don't know on the extreme cold question. I would imagine it would have a little bit of an effect (or affect, can never keep those two straight) but not much of one, but I'm not sure.

 

[KCcarguy]

You probably won't need a locker for the fishing trips, but if you get stuck it will be useful. You know what you will be driving on better than I do.

I'm just thinking it would be nice to get me out of trouble in sand/ mud/ snow.

 

[Geolander]

I'm just thinking it would be nice to get me out of trouble in sand/ mud/ snow.

It's mostly going to be useful in rocks, in situations where you have a wheel (or two) off the ground. In sand, mud, and snow, 4 wheel drive will (almost) always be sufficient to get your self out, and I'm not sure that a locker would help in situations where you're still stuck with 4WD.

All the locking diff does is make sure that the two connected wheels turn at the same speed. With an open differential, power will be diverted to the wheel with the least traction,which is great if that wheel is on the ground and in contact with something, but entirely useless if it's up in the air. If you ever encounter a situation where you have the wheel on one side not moving while the other spins freely, then a locker would help. The only time you would need one would be if you had no traction on 1 front tire and 1 rear tire, while the other two tires are on a surface that would provide traction, but aren't turning. That's not a very likely set of circumstances for the type of driving you're talking about. That said, if you have $1200 or so to blow on an ARB air locker, it won't really hurt beyond adding a few pounds.

 

[KCcarguy]

It's mostly going to be useful in rocks, in situations where you have a wheel (or two) off the ground. In sand, mud, and snow, 4 wheel drive will (almost) always be sufficient to get your self out, and I'm not sure that a locker would help in situations where you're still stuck with 4WD.

All the locking diff does is make sure that the two connected wheels turn at the same speed. With an open differential, power will be diverted to the wheel with the least traction,which is great if that wheel is on the ground and in contact with something, but entirely useless if it's up in the air. If you ever encounter a situation where you have the wheel on one side not moving while the other spins freely, then a locker would help. The only time you would need one would be if you had no traction on 1 front tire and 1 rear tire, while the other two tires are on a surface that would provide traction, but aren't turning. That's not a very likely set of circumstances for the type of driving you're talking about. That said, if you have $1200 or so to blow on an ARB air locker, it won't really hurt beyond adding a few pounds.

I was under the impression ATRAC was a pretty good substitute for a locker in a wheel-in-the-air situation? I thought lockers were good because they allow some wheelspin in mud, sand, loose dirt, etc. Wouldn't a traction-control based system just freeze-up in the mud because of wheelspin?

The hill-climb in this vid is the exact kind of thing I might run in to. I thought I might be glad I had a locker.

‪Air Locker vs LSD vs Traction Control Part 1‬‏ - YouTube

Maybe ATRAC is all I need?

 

[Edubsam]

I can tell you that I have been stuck in mud holes in the work truck that I would have gotten out of easily if I had a locker. Just adding that in there... They can be useful in mud too. Or snow, sand, soft crap, ect.

 

[Thai]

If your money is not tight, then you know the old saying...better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it.

A locker makes a significant difference off-road...ATRAC is good, but it is no substitute. For mud, rocks, sand, etc., a locker will outperform ATRAC (given everything else being equal). A locker is "preventive" while ATRAC is "reactive" if that makes sense. Do you want something that prevents you from being stuck or something that only reacts AFTER you have been stuck or loss momentum?

 

[JohnsD90]

For the driving in snow which is all i can speak on, i have went through many 12+ inch storms and a couple 2 foot snow storms and have made it through each and every one with needing a tow or a pull or or crashing, while i found myself in sistuations where having both wheels getting power would have been helpful, it is not necessary from my expierence. I have regular 4wd no center diff, no locker, no traction control, just 3 pedals

 

[brian2sun]

My ARBs work fine in the cold. I don't know how "extreme" the cold weather is tht you're talking about, but I've used my lockers many times in without problems in 0-30* F temps.

 

[KCcarguy]

Yeah, 0-30 is more than reasonable. That's good to know, thanks for the info.

:cheers:

 

[Ross]

I have a lifted Jeep with very aggressive 33 inch tires with ARBs front and rear. I have a 2004 4Runner COMPLETELY stock. On ice snow covered roads the 4Runner is better. The 4Runner will move the power around where the ARBS lock it. On very slick roads lockers have a tendency to make you slip sideways. The 4Runner's system will keep you going straighter. NONE WILL HELP YOU STOP!!!!!!

If the snow is loose and/or deep the ARBS will do better. But unless the snow is so deep that I don't have enough lift to get over it I prefer my stock 4Runner to my modified Jeep.

For the most part lockers can get you’re though more stuff. But often the leads you into further down the trail and stuck worse.

My advice would be to get a good winch. Lockers are great for wheeling tougher trails, but winches you can still get stuck. A winch can save you butt, even when you lockers let you down.

I have used my ARBs in close to zero weather, they work just fine.

 

[Thai]

I have a lifted Jeep with very aggressive 33 inch tires with ARBs front and rear. I have a 2004 4Runner COMPLETELY stock. On ice snow covered roads the 4Runner is better. The 4Runner will move the power around where the ARBS lock it. On very slick roads lockers have a tendency to make you slip sideways. The 4Runner's system will keep you going straighter. NONE WILL HELP YOU STOP!!!!!!

If the snow is loose and/or deep the ARBS will do better. But unless the snow is so deep that I don't have enough lift to get over it I prefer my stock 4Runner to my modified Jeep.

For the most part lockers can get you’re though more stuff. But often the leads you into further down the trail and stuck worse.

My advice would be to get a good winch. Lockers are great for wheeling tougher trails, but winches you can still get stuck. A winch can save you butt, even when you lockers let you down.

I have used my ARBs in close to zero weather, they work just fine.

A locker can't replace proper tires! Your Jeep has 33" mud tires...of course, it won't don't well on slick surfaces!

Since his 4runner ALREADY has ATRAC, i think that a rear locker addition won't hurt...and may help him thru rutted muddy roads to his favorite fishing spot.

 

[Ross]

A locker can't replace proper tires! Your Jeep has 33" mud tires...of course, it won't don't well on slick surfaces!

Since his 4runner ALREADY has ATRAC, i think that a rear locker addition won't hurt...and may help him thru rutted muddy roads to his favorite fishing spot.

I have TrXus MTs which are great on slick surfaces, that is there claim to fame.

I do have experience with the 4Runner traction system and lockers and I will say, with confidence, that the 4Runner traction on icy snow packed roads works really well. Lockers are great and have there place. But if you are going places needing a locker you are going deeper down the trail where there is a better chance to get really stuck and. You need a plan (and equipment) on how you will get unstuck.
I would still go with a winch over a locker. The 4Runner already has traction covered pretty good.

 

[Thai]

I have TrXus MTs which are great on slick surfaces, that is there claim to fame.

I do have experience with the 4Runner traction system and lockers and I will say, with confidence, that the 4Runner traction on icy snow packed roads works really well. Lockers are great and have there place. But if you are going places needing a locker you are going deeper down the trail where there is a better chance to get really stuck and. You need a plan (and equipment) on how you will get unstuck.
I would still go with a winch over a locker. The 4Runner already has traction covered pretty good.

Well, i disagree to some degree...a locker is not just for severe trails. It provides positive traction (not just reacting to slippage) and thus give you a smoother ride off-road.

Now, for slick surfaces, i agree with you. Lockers are not for that. But, for off-roading, a locker is better under most circumstances.

And b/w Trxus MT vs. highway/winter tire, i will take the latter anyday of the week on slick surfaces, no matter what Trxus claims!

 

[Thai]

Winch is nice...a good thing if you off-road alone. However, a winch is not free. You need an aftermarket bumper for it. An aftermarket bumper is heavy...so, you need to lift your 4runner to compensate for the extra weight. Does he need all this just to get to his favorite fishing spot????

 

[Ross]

Winch is nice...a good thing if you off-road alone. However, a winch is not free. You need an aftermarket bumper for it. An aftermarket bumper is heavy...so, you need to lift your 4runner to compensate for the extra weight. Does he need all this just to get to his favorite fishing spot????

Not at all. A stock 4Runner with 4 wheel drive should be just fine for light wheeling down not so good roads or trails.

ARBs aren't cheap either. The OP asked if he needed a locker. For going fishing down rutty roads I would say no. If the ruts are deep enough a locker MAY help you from getting stuck but not always. Without larger tires you always run the risk of hanging up a diff or getting high center and at that point a locker may not help either. Mud is slick and in this situation where you high center or hung, even if you getpower to all your wheels won’t help if you don’t have traction. If you are so stuck winch wouldn't help you lockers will have been useless two. But you can be stuck when lockers are useless but a winch will get you out. There have been many times where lockers didn't get me through and the winch did.

If you get ARBs, unless you are a very competent mechanic, you will have to have somebody else install it $$$$. If you get into wheeling where you need a locker you will probably want larger tires, if you want lager tires you may want to re-gear. If all that comes together then getting a locker would make since at that time. Tis will save you allot of money in the long run.

Having winch will benefit a stock rig and also a modified rig. I feel it is better first mod and will benefit no matter what other modifications you do down the road.

A winch will offer more benefits in various situations than an locker will.

 

[Ross]

Well, i disagree to some degree...a locker is not just for severe trails. It provides positive traction (not just reacting to slippage) and thus give you a smoother ride off-road.

Now, for slick surfaces, i agree with you. Lockers are not for that. But, for off-roading, a locker is better under most circumstances.

And b/w Trxus MT vs. highway/winter tire, i will take the latter anyday of the week on slick surfaces, no matter what Trxus claims!

They are MY claims form having experience with both.

How many winters have you had your TrXus MTs through?

 

[KCcarguy]

Thanks for all the info guys.....much appreciated.
:thumb3:

 

[Thai]

They are MY claims form having experience with both.

How many winters have you had your TrXus MTs through?

So, Trxus MTs are good on ice?? Better than a winter tire? :wow: I stand corrected that it was your claim because Trxus would not be so bold to make those claims!

 

[Thai]

If you get ARBs, unless you are a very competent mechanic, you will have to have somebody else install it $$$$. If you get into wheeling where you need a locker you will probably want larger tires, if you want lager tires you may want to re-gear. If all that comes together then getting a locker would make since at that time. Tis will save you allot of money in the long run..

ARB is about $1500-2000 total cost if you let someone else install it.

How much for aftermarket bumper, lift, and winch total (including install cost)??