Alignment issues. Sanity check please!

jaredking733

New member
Ok, I'll keep this as brief as I can since it's kind of a long story. My T4R is a 97 SR5 4x4 3.4

About a year ago, I had a friend go through the entire front end of the runner. New CV axles, lower ball joints, upper ball joints, steering rack, shocks all around, and was even going to have him replace the tie rods, but he said they already looked new so he didn't do them.

He said that he got the alignment as close as he could, but that a complete alignment would be needed asap for the sake of safety and tire wear.

No problem.

I headed straight to Firestone the next day and signed up for the lifetime alignment. They checked it, made the necessary adjustments, and sent me on my way. I immediately noticed that the steering wheel wasn't straight, but it wasn't too far off, so I didn't think much of it.

Some weeks later, after doing some further reading into alignments, I found that the steering wheel should be straight as part of a proper alignment. So, I took it back to firestone and had them look at it. They aligned it again, but alas, steering wheel still wasn't straight. They spent about the next hour to hour and a half playing with it. Finally, they got it all good. The steering wheel was straight, the runner went straight on it's own, and all was great.

Fast forward to the next oil change.

Since I had the lifetime alignment, I thought I would have them check it since it was in the shop anyways. They checked it again, and informed me that it was off "quite a bit." Puzzled, I politely informed them that they were the last techs to touch it. I was assured that it was straight and sent on my way. Heading home, I noticed that the steering wheel was off just a hair to the left, but didn't think much of it since there is a certain amount of crown to the road and thought that's probably what it was.

Weeks later again, I found myself driving down a perfectly flat (and I mean flat as in water doesn't run off of it as it probably should) stretch of road. Now, the steering wheel is still to the left, probably a little more than before.

I asked around at work and was referred to a gentlemen that owns an alignment shop and has been there almost 40 years. I was told he was the best. Took the runner to him and he spent a while being very thorough with the alignment. He said that whoever did it last had the front passenger side wheel all out of wack, but he fixed it without issue. I thanked him for his time and headed home all smiles because now, the steering wheel was straight and the runner went straighter than ever.

That was about a week ago.

Suddenly, yesterday morning, I'm driving to work and out of nowhere, I notice that the wheel is off to the right! I mean, the day before, it was perfect! And not just a hair, but a considerable amount, probably 1/16th of a turn.

WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON HERE?

It's driving me crazy trying to troubleshoot this and nobody can give me any reason why this is happening.

Do any of you have any ideas? Sorry this is so lengthy. It's been hell trying to figure this out. Normally something like this wouldn't bother me so much, but I hate the wheel not being straight when going straight.

Is it possible for the wheel to just "fall" to one side or another?

I'm lost. HELP!
 
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Ok, I'll keep this as brief as I can since it's kind of a long story. My T4R is a 97 SR5 4x4 3.4

About a year ago, I had a friend go through the entire front end of the runner. New CV axles, lower ball joints, upper ball joints, steering rack, shocks all around, and was even going to have him replace the tie rods, but he said they already looked new so he didn't do them.

He said that he got the alignment as close as he could, but that a complete alignment would be needed asap for the sake of safety and tire wear.

No problem.

I headed straight to Firestone the next day and signed up for the lifetime alignment. They checked it, made the necessary adjustments, and sent me on my way. I immediately noticed that the steering wheel wasn't straight, but it wasn't too far off, so I didn't think much of it.

Some weeks later, after doing some further reading into alignments, I found that the steering wheel should be straight as part of a proper alignment. So, I took it back to firestone and had them look at it. They aligned it again, but alas, steering wheel still wasn't straight. They spent about the next hour to hour and a half playing with it. Finally, they got it all good. The steering wheel was straight, the runner went straight on it's own, and all was great.

Fast forward to the next oil change.

Since I had the lifetime alignment, I thought I would have them check it since it was in the shop anyways. They checked it again, and informed me that it was off "quite a bit." Puzzled, I politely informed them that they were the last techs to touch it. I was assured that it was straight and sent on my way. Heading home, I noticed that the steering wheel was off just a hair to the left, but didn't think much of it since there is a certain amount of crown to the road and thought that's probably what it was.

Weeks later again, I found myself driving down a perfectly flat (and I mean flat as in water doesn't run off of it as it probably should) stretch of road. Now, the steering wheel is still to the left, probably a little more than before.

I asked around at work and was referred to a gentlemen that owns an alignment shop and has been there almost 40 years. I was told he was the best. Took the runner to him and he spent a while being very thorough with the alignment. He said that whoever did it last had the front passenger side wheel all out of wack, but he fixed it without issue. I thanked him for his time and headed home all smiles because now, the steering wheel was straight and the runner went straighter than ever.

That was about a week ago.

Suddenly, yesterday morning, I'm driving to work and out of nowhere, I notice that the wheel is off to the right! I mean, the day before, it was perfect! And not just a hair, but a considerable amount, probably 1/16th of a turn.

WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON HERE?

It's driving me crazy trying to troubleshoot this and nobody can give me any reason why this is happening.

Do any of you have any ideas? Sorry this is so lengthy. It's been hell trying to figure this out. Normally something like this wouldn't bother me so much, but I hate the wheel not being straight when going straight.

Is it possible for the wheel to just "fall" to one side or another?

I'm lost. HELP!

Notice your in TN what part if don't mind me asking.
 
Take it back to the last person who worked on it last and see what happens.

Forgot to mention, I did that yesterday. He checked to make sure the steering rack wasn't loose and there was no play anywhere that shouldn't be. He couldn't find anything out of wack. He drove it (though a very short distance) and didn't see anything wrong.

Maybe I'll go back and tell him I'm not crazy, it's definitely off. I felt like it was just me but today definitely confirmed it.
 
You don't say how many miles...

How are your control arm bushings? Particularly lowers, but uppers too.
 
You don't say how many miles...

How are your control arm bushings? Particularly lowers, but uppers too.

224,000.

I don't know, but I can say that nobody that has looked at it has mentioned any play anywhere.

They've even raised the front and shook the front wheels every way and everything is tight and right, or so I'm told.
 
If the bushings have never been replaced double check them. I like to get under there, engine off, brake on, and have someone just wiggle the steering wheel enough to move the wheels a little while I watch the arms. Just don't get yerself squished.
 
Hmm puzzling so the tech who did the alignment checked it out and didn't think the steering wheel being way off was a problem that puzzling to me..
 
Hmm puzzling so the tech who did the alignment checked it out and didn't think the steering wheel being way off was a problem that puzzling to me..

I don't think he noticed it.

Admittedly, it doesn't really show up on the little street he test drives on. It's the interstates that really enhance the right hand leaning wheel.
 
What kind of machine is the alignment being done on? Camera (targets on wheels with circles or triangle pattern) or LED style with all the circuitry in the head that goes on the wheel? Just curious.

Even though our trucks have solid rear axles, the newer machines need all for targets on all four wheels to get an accurate alignment. I say this because you could have some shifting going on in the rear (control arms?) and when it shifts the alignment is essentially out in the front because the front is aligned to the rear for straight thrust angle. I used to see this all the time when diagnosing alignment machine problems because techs would ignore the rear even if it was showing half degree of toe but it was "grayed out" on the display because there was no spec. Basically saying don't ignore the rear.

One other thing it could be is the LCA bushings eccentrics (those things have to be tight) or tie rod lock nuts are not locked down, allowing things to shift. Do you have some alignment printouts you could upload?
 
when driving on the interstate in a straight line u are having to hold your steering wheel to the right correct.

Yes, to the right.

I don't have to hold it though. I just have to put it over there as if that were the center point. It goes straight as an arrow. If I center the wheel, it pulls to the left.
 
What kind of machine is the alignment being done on? Camera (targets on wheels with circles or triangle pattern) or LED style with all the circuitry in the head that goes on the wheel? Just curious.

Even though our trucks have solid rear axles, the newer machines need all for targets on all four wheels to get an accurate alignment. I say this because you could have some shifting going on in the rear (control arms?) and when it shifts the alignment is essentially out in the front because the front is aligned to the rear for straight thrust angle. I used to see this all the time when diagnosing alignment machine problems because techs would ignore the rear even if it was showing half degree of toe but it was "grayed out" on the display because there was no spec. Basically saying don't ignore the rear.

One other thing it could be is the LCA bushings eccentrics (those things have to be tight) or tie rod lock nuts are not locked down, allowing things to shift. Do you have some alignment printouts you could upload?

Every machine from a new laser (?) machine to the super old school ones that just use a big flashlight style head.

Nothing recent, no. I may run it by another shop tomorrow and see what they say. If they give me anything, I'll make sure to show it here.
 
Every machine from a new laser (?) machine to the super old school ones that just use a big flashlight style head.

Nothing recent, no. I may run it by another shop tomorrow and see what they say. If they give me anything, I'll make sure to show it here.

The newer machines use CCD cameras mounted on a post in front of the rack. Might look something like a crucifix or "T". These are the machines you want to use and most shops have them now.
The older ones have heads that mount on the wheel that have all the circuitry inside (inclinometer levels, LED arrays, etc) Those things were very prone to bad alignments because the components would shift inside when dropping off the wheel accidentally or being driven down the road when a tech forgot to remove the head. :wow:
 
The newer machines use CCD cameras mounted on a post in front of the rack. Might look something like a crucifix or "T". These are the machines you want to use and most shops have them now.
The older ones have heads that mount on the wheel that have all the circuitry inside (inclinometer levels, LED arrays, etc) Those things were very prone to bad alignments because the components would shift inside when dropping off the wheel accidentally or being driven down the road when a tech forgot to remove the head. :wow:

The shop I'm going to tomorrow has that. I am sure about that.
 
The shop I'm going to tomorrow has that. I am sure about that.

Post a picture of the before an after! I get so frustrated reading about alignment nightmares, it is absolute the simplest thing on the planet. No excuses for this, just bad or lazy techs.

My concern is with the fact you said it was good, then suddenly it wasn't. Something moved, rack, or ends or bushings. You can't go from a straight wheel to not straight with out some movement.

:whip2:
 
I'm betting on a broken adjustment cam. Tell whoever works on it next to remove the bolt, and the nut with integrated cam adjuster off. It's a 3 piece system and usually the inner cam with integreted sleeve (goes through the control arm bushing) ends up breaking at the point where it keys into the nut with integrated cam. It sounds confusing, but makes sense when you have it apart.
 
What is your caster alignment at? Do you have any lift at all? If you have a lift most likely your caster is off and your wheels don't return to center so quickly.
I had huge alignment problems until I replaced upper and lower control arm bushings. To check climb under your truck while somebody turns the wheels and see if the upper or lower arms move.
 
Post a picture of the before an after! I get so frustrated reading about alignment nightmares, it is absolute the simplest thing on the planet. No excuses for this, just bad or lazy techs.

My concern is with the fact you said it was good, then suddenly it wasn't. Something moved, rack, or ends or bushings. You can't go from a straight wheel to not straight with out some movement.

:whip2:

I will.

Funny thing is, it seemed ok for the first 3/4 of my commute this morning. Then off to the right towards the end.

I'm thinking it's not the tech. This guy is good. I'm thinking there's something simple probably going on with the truck that causes this.
 

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