Another 4 Wheel Drive Question

[CoastieRon]

I'm new to 4 Wheel Drive (at least taking care of your personal vehicle...military vehicles don't belong to you don't really count ).

I have a 2015 TE and the manual says to engage H4 every month for 10 miles for lubrication. We've had some moderate rains here lately, and I've engaged H4 during that time. I've also read that making sharp turns is a no-no and should be used for straight roads.

With all that being said, I haven't engaged H4 on completely dry pavement (light/moderate/heavy rains); however, what would the potential outcome be if so? I've driven maybe 20 miles so far on H4, have made some left and right turns on highways at slow speeds or from stop to go at a red light (no U-turns).

I've heard it can make shifting the transfer case more difficult "down the road" and that it also creates unnecessary wear on my drive train. Would there be any indications of damage now or would a mechanic be able to see if the drive train is damaged? No grinding noises or drive train or trying to shift, transfer case lever vibrates when vehicle is on (since day one, I'm assuming this is normal). I've got maybe less than 2k miles on the truck overall. Thank you all for the clarification!

 

[1engineer]

It won't hurt at all. Just put it in 4HI and drive it.

 

[CoastieRon]

It won't hurt at all. Just put it in 4HI and drive it.

Any idea as to what happens if you never engage 4H for a while and then have to engage it?

 

[CoastieRon]

Also, how does the rear locker come in to play with this as well?

 

[1engineer]

Any idea as to what happens if you never engage 4H for a while and then have to engage it?

Sure. The longer you go without using it the higher the chance of having a stuck solenoid and that will not let you engage to 4WD. That and parts that should be lubricated regularly are not getting lubricated. Personally I do it every few days or weeks for shorter periods. Maybe up my street, maybe for a few miles on a two lane. It does not hurt it to engage on dry roads. Personally I try not to engage it in parking lots because I don't like putting it in a bind unless I need to.

Now, you could take a chance and go years without ever shifting into 4WD and when you do it works just fine. I prefer to not take that chance.

When I had my TE I only used my locker once. I still "exercised" it pulling up my driveway every so often.

 

[CoastieRon]

Thanks [MENTION=66316]1engineer[/MENTION].

Unfortunately I live in a very populated suburb and don't have the "luxury" of finding roads that aren't pavement without potential legal issues...lol.

I need a crash course on 4WD, or a 4WD for dummies. Got any recommendations?

 

[1engineer]

Thanks [MENTION=66316]1engineer[/MENTION].

Unfortunately I live in a very populated suburb and don't have the "luxury" of finding roads that aren't pavement without potential legal issues...lol.

I need a crash course on 4WD, or a 4WD for dummies. Got any recommendations?

Read the link in my signature on how your 4WD works. You don't need a dirt road nor did I say that. Paved roads are fine.

 

[wfo9]

^^^
Yea, do some reading.

There is a chain in that T-case that only spins in 4wd. That is the reason to engage it once a month or so. It is to keep the chain lubed.

Here is a simple rule to follow for 4Hi on dry pavement:

No binding will occur if you only make turns that can be accomplished over ~30mph. Just slip it back to 2h if you are approaching a stop with a right or left hand turn.

If you do this in an area you are familiar with... you can put it in 2h before you hit sections where sharp turns are required.

Even if you forget..., It is no big deal and really won't hurt anything. It's just not ideal to do it all the time.

Best practice is to just get it off-road at least once a month. But that is more for you than the truck. ;-)

For the rear locker. it is not like the T-case and has no special lubrication requirements. You could engage it on dry pavement when going straight, but it requires 4L... unless you have done some manual wiring...

 

[Dalko43]

I'm new to 4 Wheel Drive (at least taking care of your personal vehicle...military vehicles don't belong to you don't really count ).

I have a 2015 TE and the manual says to engage H4 every month for 10 miles for lubrication. We've had some moderate rains here lately, and I've engaged H4 during that time. I've also read that making sharp turns is a no-no and should be used for straight roads.

With all that being said, I haven't engaged H4 on completely dry pavement (light/moderate/heavy rains); however, what would the potential outcome be if so? I've driven maybe 20 miles so far on H4, have made some left and right turns on highways at slow speeds or from stop to go at a red light (no U-turns).

I've heard it can make shifting the transfer case more difficult "down the road" and that it also creates unnecessary wear on my drive train. Would there be any indications of damage now or would a mechanic be able to see if the drive train is damaged? No grinding noises or drive train or trying to shift, transfer case lever vibrates when vehicle is on (since day one, I'm assuming this is normal). I've got maybe less than 2k miles on the truck overall. Thank you all for the clarification!

Toyota's info videos on the 5th Gen's 4wd system states pretty clearly that you should only be engaging 4Hi or 4Low off of the dry pavement (or in slippery conditions like snow or ice).

The reason for this is that the 5th Gen's part-time 4wd system, unlike the 4th gen, did not come with a center differential....meaning when you engage 4wd (either Hi or Low) the drive shafts going to both front and rear axles are locked together (rotate at the same speed). If you were to make maneuvers that would require the front and rear wheels to rotate at different speeds (like in a sharp turn) you could potentially induce drivetrain binding. Remember! These cautions apply only to the 4Runner models with part-time 4wd (Trail, SR5); the Models with full-time 4wd came with a center diff and are obviously safe to drive on dry pavement.

All that being said, Toyota's recommendations are erring on the side of caution. You can probably drive 4Hi on dry pavement, just don't make any sharp turns and don't do it for too long.

Honestly, once I figured out that the new 5th gen didn't come with a lock/unlock center diff function, I only engage 4wd off of the pavement, or when the pavement is covered in snow/ice, puddles ect.

In terms of engaging the 4wd every so often for lubrication and functionality, just find a dirt or gravel road somewhere and engage the 4wd Hi for a bit and you should be fine.

 

[nb rob]

or maybe watch a couple of videos of 4r's bouncing while scaling a rocky wall,
and then feel better about driving in a straight line on level asphalt

 

[Dalko43]

It won't hurt at all. Just put it in 4HI and drive it.

I would be careful about giving generic advice like that.

Toyota has literature/media which very specifically states that you should avoid engaging the 5th Gen's 4wd on dry pavement:

4WD Simplified Version 4.0

Note, that you probably won't hurt anything by driving straight on dry pavement for a little bit, but turning and maneuvers in general can lead to drivetrain binding for the 5th gen (part-time 4wd models).

 

[1engineer]

I would be careful about giving generic advice like that.

Toyota has literature/media which very specifically states that you should avoid engaging the 5th Gen's 4wd on dry pavement:

4WD Simplified Version 4.0

Note, that you probably won't hurt anything by driving straight on dry pavement for a little bit, but in turning and maneuvers in general can lead to drivetrain binding for the 5th gen (part-time 4wd models).

Question: Have you ever taken your 4Runner off road? Off road is not always mud or dirt. Sometimes you are on rock or one wheel off the ground and one wheel on a rock and you have the wheel cranked full lock to get around a stump or rock. Will it bind? Yes it will. Will it damage it? Nope. Could it damage it if you kept doing doughnuts in 4WD in a dry parking lot? Maybe and I wouldn't do that because that's just silly.

You will not damage it if you are on a dry paved road in 4WD and you do a full lock turn. If it would damage it there would be a lot of broken cases on the trail.

I don't have to be careful giving generic advice because I'm only stating facts. Ask the guys here who go off road regularly, especially [MENTION=78273]Jeremy556[/MENTION]. He lives off road and he is on slick rock which is not slick at all lol. [MENTION=106176]wfo9[/MENTION] is off highway. [MENTION=66300]Intruder[/MENTION] too. Ask those guys and there are many more here who will tell you the same thing.

 

[Dalko43]

Question: Have you ever taken your 4Runner off road? Off road is not always mud or dirt. Sometimes you are on rock or one wheel off the ground and one wheel on a rock and you have the wheel cranked full lock to get around a stump or rock. Will it bind? Yes it will. Will it damage it? Nope. Could it damage it if you kept doing doughnuts in 4WD in a dry parking lot? Maybe and I wouldn't do that because that's just silly.

You can get defensive all you want, but the fact is Toyota has literature (I provided a link to) which clearly states that engaging part-time 4wd on dry pavement is not recommended.

Also, the reason you don't get drivetrain binding with 4wd engaged on a trail (rocky, muddly,dirt, whatever) is because the tires have less traction on those surfaces (as compared to dry pavement) and thus the drivetrain doesn't experience the same amount of stress.

You will not damage it if you are on a dry paved road in 4WD and you do a full lock turn. If it would damage it there would be a lot of broken cases on the trail.

See the funny thing about this statement coming from you, is that you have acknowledged in prior threads that engaging 4wd and sharp turns on dry pavement can lead to drivetrain binding:

Sure you can. Too many people worry about this unnecessarily. What you do NOT want to do is put it in 4WD on a beautiful July day and go out in a parking lot, turn your wheels to full lock and start doing circles. That is not good. Normal driving with highway curve radius is fine. Any road condition (dirt, rain, snow) that reduces the coefficient of adhesion lower than rubber on macadam is fine.

You are essentially saying the exact same thing as me in that post (and contradicting yourself in this current thread). So why are you arguing with me?

I don't have to be careful giving generic advice because I'm only stating facts. Ask the guys here who go off road regularly, especially [MENTION=78273]Jeremy556[/MENTION]. He lives off road and he is on slick rock which is not slick at all lol. [MENTION=106176]wfo9[/MENTION] is off highway. [MENTION=66300]Intruder[/MENTION] too. Ask those guys and there are many more here who will tell you the same thing.

I don't think you gave good advice to a fellow forum member...and you aren't stating any facts whatsoever. You can feel free to leave this conversation whenever you want...

 

[msp]

It won't hurt at all. Just put it in 4HI and drive it.

I have a calendar reminder to drive to work in 4HI on the first day of each month...because I have a terrible memory and I've got major OCD when it comes to the 4Runner.

 

[CoastieRon]

My thoughts exactly, do you have to engage and disengage like you're almost driving a manual vehicle?

Definitely didn't want to start arguments lol, just wanted to have an understanding from experienced off-roaders about 4WD. I'm probably going to end up being a road queen anyway as I continue to tell myself I need to get out on some trails. Not as easy with a family and limited access to trails.

 

[Dalko43]

Dalko, it's tougher than you think.

I agree. As I said earlier, I think Toyota erred on the side of caution with their recommendation. But the videos/info that I linked clearly show there were reasons for Toyota making those recommendations.

I have caught myself making sharp turns on dry pavement (coming off of a snowy driveway onto a dry road) and I heard the drivetrain skip and grind a bit...nothing got broken, and I know Toyota built these systems to last.

All the same, I'd rather not put undue stress on the 4wd if I can avoid it.

I'm not sure why you're picking a fight about driving in a straight line, or at least keeping the turns reasonable in 4x4. What would you do if it were intermittently snowing? would you disengage 4x4 every time you encounter a 20' stretch of dry pavement?

I'm letting the OP know there are resources out there for his viewing and that he needs to be careful about the "advice" he gets on these kinds of forums.

As for your hypothetical snow situation: I would engage 4wd Hi if I saw snow on the road and disengage it once I saw the snow clear up...as I have done numerous times this past winter.

 

[nb rob]

sorry Dalko- I deleted my comment. This is total foolishness. There's no need for me to argue with you.

 

[1engineer]

You can get defensive all you want, but the fact is Toyota has literature (I provided a link to) which clearly states that engaging part-time 4wd on dry pavement is not recommended.

Also, the reason you don't get drivetrain binding with 4wd engaged on a trail (rocky, muddly,dirt, whatever) is because the tires have less traction on those surfaces (as compared to dry pavement) and thus the drivetrain doesn't experience the same amount of stress.



See the funny thing about this statement coming from you, is that you have acknowledged in prior threads that engaging 4wd and sharp turns on dry pavement can lead to drivetrain binding:



You are essentially saying the exact same thing as me in that post (and contradicting yourself in this current thread). So why are you arguing with me?




I don't think you gave good advice to a fellow forum member...and you aren't stating any facts whatsoever. You can feel free to leave this conversation whenever you want...

Have you read the owner's manual on this subject?

 

[1engineer]

sorry Dalko- I deleted my comment. This is total foolishness. There's no need for me to argue with you.

I need to follow your advice too. This guy knows everything, especially about diesels and the engine market. I'm out too Dalko.

 

[Dalko43]

sorry Dalko- I deleted my comment. This is total foolishness. There's no need for me to argue with you.

You make a good point....

To the OP I'm done arguing with you-know-who...the informational brief on Toyota's 4wd is available in the link I provided if you are interested in learning more.