ARB bumper without the tubes?

[steezemcqueen]

What's this talk of airbag interference? The airbag is deployed based on deceleration, not on what the bumper is doing. You don't have to hit the bumper to make the airbags deploy...

You are right about the 4runners being deployed based on deceleration. However, not all cars use accellerometers for airbags. I'm pretty sure older cars use sensors in the front of the car which therefore would mean that the bumper would have an effect on how the airbags would deploy hence the reason for the crumple zone in the arb

 

[techno]

The reason a bumper can effect the airbags and cause them to deploy sooner, is because it changes the decelleration characteristics of the vehicle.

From the factory, the vehicle has crumple zones and features that absorb energy during a collision. It takes time to absorb that energy. The more time it takes, the lower the decelleration. It absorbs more energy, but obviously this is bending and breaking the vehicle. It is decellerating exactly as designed.

When you add a stronger bumper you are significantly reducing the time that it has to absorb energy, because it's stronger and can not crumple. The energy is not absorbed by crumpling, it is used to stop the vehicle sooner, which means higher decelleration (than factory), therefore it deploys the airbags.

The ARB has ribs in the mounting brackets that are designed to match the factory crumple/decelleration rate and hence not 'trick' the airbags into deploying sooner. The great thing is, it does this whilst still providing excellent protection to the body work and radiators that would otherwise be destroyed.

 

[steezemcqueen]

The reason a bumper can effect the airbags and cause them to deploy sooner, is because it changes the decelleration characteristics of the vehicle.

From the factory, the vehicle has crumple zones and features that absorb energy during a collision. It takes time to absorb that energy. The more time it takes, the lower the decelleration. It absorbs more energy, but obviously this is bending and breaking the vehicle. It is decellerating exactly as designed.

When you add a stronger bumper you are significantly reducing the time that it has to absorb energy, because it's stronger and can not crumple. The energy is not absorbed by crumpling, it is used to stop the vehicle sooner, which means higher decelleration (than factory), therefore it deploys the airbags.

The ARB has ribs in the mounting brackets that are designed to match the factory crumple/decelleration rate and hence not 'trick' the airbags into deploying sooner. The great thing is, it does this whilst still providing excellent protection to the body work and radiators that would otherwise be destroyed.

we all just got owned :bash:

 

[brian2sun]

The reason a bumper can effect the airbags and cause them to deploy sooner, is because it changes the decelleration characteristics of the vehicle.

From the factory, the vehicle has crumple zones and features that absorb energy during a collision. It takes time to absorb that energy. The more time it takes, the lower the decelleration. It absorbs more energy, but obviously this is bending and breaking the vehicle. It is decellerating exactly as designed.

When you add a stronger bumper you are significantly reducing the time that it has to absorb energy, because it's stronger and can not crumple. The energy is not absorbed by crumpling, it is used to stop the vehicle sooner, which means higher decelleration (than factory), therefore it deploys the airbags.

The ARB has ribs in the mounting brackets that are designed to match the factory crumple/decelleration rate and hence not 'trick' the airbags into deploying sooner. The great thing is, it does this whilst still providing excellent protection to the body work and radiators that would otherwise be destroyed.

Well said.

 

[LINY4Runner]

well, I've found a used ARB, just hoping the guy can hold it for me for a month or so until i get my taxes back

 

[Qyota]

The reason a bumper can effect the airbags and cause them to deploy sooner, is because it changes the decelleration characteristics of the vehicle.

From the factory, the vehicle has crumple zones and features that absorb energy during a collision. It takes time to absorb that energy. The more time it takes, the lower the decelleration. It absorbs more energy, but obviously this is bending and breaking the vehicle. It is decellerating exactly as designed.

When you add a stronger bumper you are significantly reducing the time that it has to absorb energy, because it's stronger and can not crumple. The energy is not absorbed by crumpling, it is used to stop the vehicle sooner, which means higher decelleration (than factory), therefore it deploys the airbags.

The ARB has ribs in the mounting brackets that are designed to match the factory crumple/decelleration rate and hence not 'trick' the airbags into deploying sooner. The great thing is, it does this whilst still providing excellent protection to the body work and radiators that would otherwise be destroyed.

Thanks for explaining that. However, is there any data to suggest the difference is significant? We're probably talking about the difference between 14mph and 12mph. You really don't even need them at that point. The "rubber meets the road" at higher speeds...in which case it doesn't matter what bumper you have (or if you have one at all), the bags are gonna pop.

Anyway, back to the discussion. Sounds like LINY found one! Waiting for taxes is a pain. I usually don't get all my forms together until the second week in February. Meanwhile, the gubmint is making cash on my money. Bas****s! :sniper:

 

[techno]

Thanks for explaining that. However, is there any data to suggest the difference is significant? We're probably talking about the difference between 14mph and 12mph. You really don't even need them at that point.

Yes, there is data. Lots and lots of it. Manufacturers and national road safety organizations have spent much time and millions of dollars on determining when an airbag 'should' deploy. The results are based on injury criteria and reduction of severity of injury. Collisions at speeds above airbag deployment speed, occupants are said to have a high chance of serious injury or death without an airbag. At lower speeds the risks are much lower and acceptable for non airbag use. No one wants airbags to deploy if they are not needed. They cost a lot to replace and can in fact cause injuries themselves sometimes.

I agree that the difference is likely not very significant, but as far as the bumper manufacturers go, and regardless of which looks the best (they're both awesome) I'm pleased ARB has addressed the issue and disappointed that Shrockworks has not. Maybe when the Shrockworks company gets to the same size as ARB they will be able to afford R&D dollars to engineer something for this.

 

[JohnsD90]

well, JohnsD90 found me a used ARB, just hoping the guy can hold it for me for a month or so until i get my taxes back

Fixed it.

 

[Qyota]

Yes, there is data. Lots and lots of it. Manufacturers and national road safety organizations have spent much time and millions of dollars on determining when an airbag 'should' deploy. The results are based on injury criteria and reduction of severity of injury. Collisions at speeds above airbag deployment speed, occupants are said to have a high chance of serious injury or death without an airbag. At lower speeds the risks are much lower and acceptable for non airbag use. No one wants airbags to deploy if they are not needed. They cost a lot to replace and can in fact cause injuries themselves sometimes.

I agree that the difference is likely not very significant, but as far as the bumper manufacturers go, and regardless of which looks the best (they're both awesome) I'm pleased ARB has addressed the issue and disappointed that Shrockworks has not. Maybe when the Shrockworks company gets to the same size as ARB they will be able to afford R&D dollars to engineer something for this.

Right on, dude.

 

[CajunRunner]

Nope. The airbag sensor in 4runners are located in the center dash below the stereo and Qyota is right. They are just accelerometers

What the greenmonster said. Here is a picture of the deceleration sensor in a 97...black box with the yellow label. It's mounted on the transmission hump just below the center dash.

 

[cfairbank]

Just installed my ARB bumper a couple days ago. Very pleased with how it turned out. I was also torn by the shrockworks and ARB but decided on the ARB because of price and no wait time. Using the dough I saved to by some lights for the bumper.