Big Bear II

[HB 4X4]

Another trip up to Big Bear with Blair and our girls for a few nights.

Different scenery when offroading at night.

 

[HB 4X4]

Some of Blair that were on my camera.

 

[BlairB]

My pics are more of the same but they will have to wait because I seem to have misplaced my cord to transfer pictures to the computer :bash:

Definitely a fun trip though, we did some runs at night and after that I am pretty much positive that I will be getting a light bar sometime soon

 

[audiqtr]

that looks like a lot of fun, one of these days, I need to take out my 4R for its' and my first ever Off-roading experience....lol

 

[HB 4X4]

that looks like a lot of fun, one of these days, I need to take out my 4R for its' and my first ever Off-roading experience....lol

Since you're in NorCal you could always check out Hollister Hills.

 

[icantsee]

Looks like a lot of fun!!

I'd love to see how well the truck cleans up after you wash it.

 

[getsomeVA]

awesome pics man, that looks like a great trip. Those pics just make me want to more to my rig :awais:

 

[Thai]

You guys sure take a lot of nice scenic pics!

I think that both of you need BIGGER meatier tires to fill the fenders.

Josh, is your 4runner the one with the blacked out emblems? If so, then is that the max compression in the front wheels?? It doesn't seem like your front tires compress much...i know that the stock compression ain't great, but has it changed with your lift??

 

[HB 4X4]

You guys sure take a lot of nice scenic pics!

I think that both of you need BIGGER meatier tires to fill the fenders.

Josh, is your 4runner the one with the blacked out emblems? If so, then is that the max compression in the front wheels?? It doesn't seem like your front tires compress much...i know that the stock compression ain't great, but has it changed with your lift??

Yes I believe that is about as far as they compress. I have the FJ coils so they are stiff. As for the tires, they are on the list however I haven't decided on what I want to do. I really want to stay with the Nitto's, but I don't want to go up to 285's because of tire rack options. 275's don't have any brands that appeal to me. Possibly Cooper STT's but I haven't heard enough from them as far as handling, road noise, etc. BFG's are quite annoying from what I've heard, as well as experienced on past vehicles. I just spent $1500 on the suspension, $200 on spidertrax, a few hundred on the trip, and have demello rock sliders on order which is another $525, so tires aren't of top priority right now.

 

[CJ3Flyr]

Yes I believe that is about as far as they compress. I have the FJ coils so they are stiff. ...285's because of tire rack options. 275's don't have any brands that appeal to me.

As always great pics and much envy

1) Did Blair install the 3/2 yet? Edit: Blair and I were typing at the same time, I see his answer below
2) How would you characterize the ride with your suspension? Same as 2/1, stock? I am talking about rolling along at 20-30mph on a dirt road. Thanks.
3) Any rubbing with the SpiderTrax?

:cheers:

 

[BlairB]

I think that both of you need BIGGER meatier tires to fill the fenders.

Totally agree Thai, they might look a little meatier if they were not so worn .

I am actually in the market for new tires (after only 13,000 miles on my NTG's :bash: ). I am throwing on some spidertrax and a 3 inch spacer in front hopefully this week or next so I am debating what to do, part of me can't resist $500 out the door for Nitto's but part of me wants to get something a little bigger and meatier.

Any recommendations/ideas?

 

[BlairB]

As always great pics and much envy

1) Did Blair install the 3/2 yet?
2) How would you characterize the ride with your suspension? Same as 2/1, stock? I am talking about rolling along at 20-30mph on a dirt road. Thanks.
3) Any rubbing with the SpiderTrax?

:cheers:

I have not put the 3/2 on yet, I think I will put the 3 inch in the front this week or next, along with spidertrax.

I have not seen anyone else running a 3/1 but I think it should be pretty good for my needs (usually not heavily loaded and I think I am the only t4r owner without a tow hitch, so that is not a worry either)

Josh always had complaints about the back kicking worse with the 2 inch spacer in the back compared to the 1 so that also helped me make my decision to go for a 3/1, worst case I can throw a 2 incher in there in about 45 minutes.

 

[CJ3Flyr]

:bigok: You may be starting the next big thing, the Blair 3/1:lmao:

It sounds like a great idea to me especially considering your light load situation.

There's really a 'satisfaction' cutoff. Most like the 2/1 and think the 3/2 is too stiff. Josh's observation about the back-end getting stiff and your 3/1 experiment may yield some cool results. Keep us posted.

:cheers:

 

[BlairB]

:bigok: You may be starting the next big thing, the Blair 3/1:lmao:

It sounds like a great idea to me especially considering your light load situation.

There's really a 'satisfaction' cutoff. Most like the 2/1 and think the 3/2 is too stiff. Josh's observation about the back-end getting stiff and your 3/1 experiment may yield some cool results. Keep us posted.

:cheers:

I will also be starting the other new big thing, a 2/2 lift!!!

So if anyone wants to buy one let me know :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

 

[Thai]

Any recommendations/ideas?

Well, you guys seem to like off-roading over rocky terrain from the pictures. Ask yourself this question: what is one of the pain-in-the-ass thing that can happen on an off-road trip that is easily preventable??

If you guys like rockcrawling or going over rock gardens, then a bad set of tires can truly debilitate your 4runner within an instant. A strong set of tires means that you don't have to worry about tire puncture while enjoying the scene and, quite frankly, give you more "balls" to do more stuff.

If you guys like mud or dirt roads, then yeah, get any tire you want. But, over rocks, you need a strong sidewall. Sooner or later, you will get burn.

If you want to stick to all-terrains, then you only have a few true choices: BFG AT KO, Goodyear SilentArmor, and other smaller production AT tires from dedicated off-road manufacturers (like ProComp, Cooper, etc.). For me, i would stick to BIG tire companies and with tires that have 3-ply sidewall and a proven history of toughness. That leaves me with two choices: BFG and Goodyear.

(Note: i have had Nittos TG, Michelin LTX M/S, REVOs, BFG AT KO, and Firestone Destination M/Ts...so, i speak from MY experiences.)

As for BFG's "poor" on-road performance, i don't care too much because #1 i don't drive fast in my 5500 lbs SUV, #2 they have never failed me before in years that i have had them either on-road or off-road, and #3 they are one of few TRUE all-terrain tires that lives up to it's name.

Question: did you buy your 4runner to go up against a Porsche Cayenne OR to go places where Porsche Cayenne can only dream of????

Just remember, i think that BFG AT KO is also the best selling all-terrain on the market by regular folks and by off-road enthusiasts. You can look at the bias TireRack consumer ratings all day long, but you need to pay attention to what tires people are actually buying with their hard-earned money....

Now, if you want to be more capable, then get Mud-Terrains. I did that a while back but the tradeoffs (noise, rough ride, poor wear & balance) was significant enough for me to jump back to all-terrains. By all means, mud-terrains are superior to all-terrains off-road by a long shot.

It all depends on your priorities.

 

[Falls]

Josh / Blair ..... excellent shots and looks like a lot of fun. The trucks look great . That shot of the snake sent shivers up my spine but other than that very nice.


Thai, Why do you think TR and DT reviews are biased ? Where then can you get good reviews ? Surely not from magazines since the advertisers pay form the ads ... surely not Consumer reports who have already been cracked many times for favoritism . All we really have is what people say about their tires here and other forums , in which people justify their purchase as you once put it , which would be the same as we read on the forums for the most part as where some people will stand up and say the tires they have suck , just like some do on TR and DT. Just wondering your thoughts. The challenge for someone like me who likes to play off road , but still drives a lot of miles. As you know my tire running experience for all terrains except for 1 set of GY Wrangler AT's (which were actually not bad and held their own for what they were) has always been BFG AT's . Things I didn't like about them was I tended to get cupping , and on 1 set I had a really bad , bad ride at 40k miles on them. I mean BAD , jolt your fillings loose BAD. I have never as much as had a flat with 23 years of running BFG AT's .

Josh / Blair , sorry to hi-jack with a tire question/statement opinion.

 

[HB 4X4]

Josh / Blair ..... excellent shots and looks like a lot of fun. The trucks look great . That shot of the snake sent shivers up my spine but other than that very nice.

Josh / Blair , sorry to hi-jack with a tire question/statement opinion.

No worries, as I was the one who initially brought up tire selection questions. I have been contemplating some BFG's, but I'm still not sure. I am having very mixed thoughts. And again, I am not going to go up to 285's, which cancels out BFG's as well.


As for the Nitto's, I actually had a flat on this trip. However, it was from a bolt the size of my index finger, that went straight through the middle
of the tread.

Thanks for the compliments. Blair, any luck finding that cable?

As always great pics and much envy

1) Did Blair install the 3/2 yet? Edit: Blair and I were typing at the same time, I see his answer below
2) How would you characterize the ride with your suspension? Same as 2/1, stock? I am talking about rolling along at 20-30mph on a dirt road. Thanks.
3) Any rubbing with the SpiderTrax?

:cheers:

I actually had rubbing before the spidertrax after I had the lift installed, and they fixed it completely. However, I have been told that many tire shops will not work on a vehicle with spacers.

The ride is very firm, but I haven't yet decided if it's a good or bad firm. I will know better when I get it up to Gorman since most of Big Bear was on rocks, and rough is expected.

Thai, here are some comparison shots to show you how much I have worked to bring my lift down. Can't argue with facts. The one at the campsite is a little far away, but if you look closely, only a sliver of thread is showing.

Compared to what 4 Wheel Parts did....

 

[Thai]

Thai, Why do you think TR and DT reviews are biased ? Where then can you get good reviews ? Surely not from magazines since the advertisers pay form the ads ... surely not Consumer reports who have already been cracked many times for favoritism . All we really have is what people say about their tires here and other forums , in which people justify their purchase as you once put it ,

Things I didn't like about them was I tended to get cupping , and on 1 set I had a really bad , bad ride at 40k miles on them. I mean BAD , jolt your fillings loose BAD. I have never as much as had a flat with 23 years of running BFG AT's

Falls,

What I (and many others) think of TireRack consumer surveys have been discussed at length before...so, i am not sure why you're asking it again since you have read it before.

As stated before, i trust actual reviews by TireRack editors, off-road/truck magazines reviews, and Consumer Reports reviews more so than TR's consumer surveys. Although there may be some tampering by advertisement money, this has never been really proven in any magazine that i know of??? I hear Lexus owners whine about Car & Driver's "favoritism" towards BMW...i hear Honda owners complain of C&D's favoritism of Toyota...i hear domestic owners complain about C&D favoritism of Japanese brands...do you see a pattern here?? The loser of a comparison always complain about "favoritism" of a magazine. Facts of life...human nature. Yeah, i am sure that there are some magazines out there that favor one brand, but is it really that obvious and common??? I doubt it.

Consumer Reports tire comparisons are done by an independent company. This was clearly stated in the last tire comparo i read (passenger all season tire). So, i don't know if this independent company had any favoritism, but from their results, it was widespread among the different brands. I would assume that it was a fair fight.

If you read MY reviews of tires, then you will see that i am no exception to human nature. I tend to speak highly of tires that i just bought and compare them favorably to my old tires. However, as i have more experience with them, i usually post more accurate reviews of the tire's performance. See my post on Firestone Destination M/Ts...or my post on Nittos TG on the Benzworld forum. It's simply human nature.

Yeah, BFG AT KO can get bad as they age...but, aren't your REVOs doing a similar thing??? Tires don't do well as they age...this has been proven over and over again. Your REVO's superduper multi-compound tread was supposed to counteract this aging process...did it? I am sure that it helped some and thus is probably aging better than the average BFG. This is why i tend to replace tires much sooner than their expected death because, no matter what their warranty or tire life expectancy, rubber don't do well with age.

 

[Thai]

Josh, did you air down while off-roading?? I cannot see for sure from pics if you did this or not. I highly recommend you do this. Airing down may have prevented your flat tire. I would air down to at least 18-20 psi. (BTW, you will also need a good air pump, which is more reason to get the ARB rear locker with on-board air compressor!!!) Airing down a tire increases traction surface AND make the tires more flexible/compliant over rocks. This helps the tread withstand sharp objects better.

Of course, airing down a tire means that you expose the sidewall more than usual. Your sidewall will bulge out and thus is a target for sharp rocks. Airing down will put more stress on your sidewall. What does this mean? You need to get a tire that has a strong sidewall...a tire that was made to withstand airing down stress...again, you are stuck with the two options mentioned above (BFG and GY).

On another note, many owners on here do NOT upgrade their spare tire. So, you have 4 good tires and one weak tire. What does this mean?? You better have 4 damn good strong DURABLE tires!! Because if you get a flat, then you may be in deep trouble if your spare is the weak link. So, for those who do not upgrade the spare tire, i highly recommend getting 4 damn good tires because these 4 tires are the ones that will get you to the off-roading place and then back home.

My opinion of course...take it with a grain of salt....

 

[Thai]

Thai, here are some comparison shots to show you how much I have worked to bring my lift down. Can't argue with facts. The one at the campsite is a little far away, but if you look closely, only a sliver of thread is showing.

Josh, i see that the front is better now...how is the CV angle now?? The back of the 4runner now looks too high or is your rear axle flexing in the picture??