I like most platforms. I’m not a Toyota apologist. If something needs to be improved, I’ll look to call it out and improve it. Fords are not turds. Nor are Chevy’s nor Range Rovers - had them all. Liked features of each. Built many trucks to my needs at the time. The brakes on the 5th Gen 4Runner are substandard and it appears no one has found a “solution” - but I do appreciate all the input.
Brakes - Why do they suck so bad!
- Thread starter Jdholder
- Start date
I like most platforms. I’m not a Toyota apologist. If something needs to be improved, I’ll look to call it out and improve it. Fords are not turds. Nor are Chevy’s nor Range Rovers - had them all. Liked features of each. Built many trucks to my needs at the time. The brakes on the 5th Gen 4Runner are substandard and it appears no one has found a “solution” - but I do appreciate all the input.
I have GM truck and a sedan , also the new 2016 4 runner.. I drive the gm vehicles more often than the 4runner as this is wife ride .. so when I drive 4runner the pedal does move very easy to brake.. too easy so compared to the GM vehicles I do at times get that damn brake assist to come on , wheels all lock up ...this is because the pedal goes down very easy and I never slam the pedal down I very gradually push it down but IT gets down to a certain amount those brake assist comes on ...
never had pedal go to floor on the runner.. when I purchased it in 2016 I / ME did have to bleed the brakes.. had air in the rear brake lines .. vehicle was diving really bad .. after the bleed brakes worked better with less front dive ..
I do inspect all the brakes when I/ME do the tire rotations and I was very happy with how the brake pads all worn very evenly ..
I would give it a good bleed job using the clear vinyl tubing so you can see if any air in system and place the open end in a container with brake fluid in it so no air gets in ..
never had pedal go to floor on the runner.. when I purchased it in 2016 I / ME did have to bleed the brakes.. had air in the rear brake lines .. vehicle was diving really bad .. after the bleed brakes worked better with less front dive ..
I do inspect all the brakes when I/ME do the tire rotations and I was very happy with how the brake pads all worn very evenly ..
I would give it a good bleed job using the clear vinyl tubing so you can see if any air in system and place the open end in a container with brake fluid in it so no air gets in ..
mynameistory
New member
Eh, the "Valentine One" radar detector in your signature tells me that you spend a lot of time driving over the speed limit. Have you tried driving at legal speeds? You'll save money on gas and you won't have to replace your brake components every 40K.
Hadelson
New member
Most of the time, you will receive great feedback. It does come at a price from the members who are quite sarcastic.
I've had a 05, 14 and 17. Brake pedal modulation the same for all three. It's in the design when hard application occurs. The are heavy vehicles with fairly simple suspension and no electronic assists other then ABS so IMO act about what to expect during an emergency stop.
lukeskywalker
New member
Are you a female? Only #lol #omg #goodvibesonly #killingit #omgsocialmedia millennial females talk like this.
4runner enthusiasts are usually people that bought a truck to escape this vapid narcissistic youtube commenter / tumblr trend follower culture. Please dont bring this mainstream BS meme culture into this community.
This is about driving off road into the purity of nature and the wild. Don't contaminate it with your #omgmillennial trendy trash.
I'm sure I speak on the sentiment of many (most) members here.
On a side note, yes, my breaks are a bit mushy on my 14 sr5. I've gotten used to it, and found that an upgraded suspension, even bilstein 5100 makes it better, especially the nose dive problem. But for a BOF, I'd say it's not too bad. I replaced my brakes around the 70k mark. I'm at 80k now. I do have rotor wabble, but will get that fixed when i have time. All in all, i'm extremely happy.
opcorn:If you had read, you would have seen that I didn’t have to replace the brakes. I chose to in order to try and improve the feel. Reading comprehension - Tough, I know.
mynameistory
New member
Okay, let me try to emulate your thought process.
1. I don't like the pedal feel on my brakes.
2. My rotors and pads are fine, they don't need replacement.
3. I'm going to spend money and time replacing those parts anyway, and use the exact same parts I already have on the truck.
4. Darn, the brakes are exactly the same as before.
5. Time to complain on the internet.
You're right, that was tough to comprehend for me. Actually, I find myself jealous of the amount of free time and money you have to replace parts for no reason.
Some of you guys really are a barrel of laughs. I know reading is hard, but if you had given it a bit more effort you would have seen I replaced the rubber lines with braided stainless. No change.
mynameistory
New member
I can see the headlines now.
I can see the headlines now.
Now that’s funny! You have more free time than I!
skibee1000
New member
If you're not worried about warranty, you can always upgrade to a new set of blank OEM rotors and some nice pads (HAWK, EBC, STOPTECH, etc)
EddieV4runnin
New member
Never driven an Excursion so I can’t compare it to my current 4Runner. But I can tell you that the 4runner doesn’t have vacuum assist brakes or no brake booster. It does however have an electronic brake distribution module, I believe Toyota calls it a brake actuator. When you step on the brake pedal you’re actually at the mercy of a module that decides how much feedback to allow. They use a Nitrogen charged cylinder to simulate a hard or soft pedal based on inputs from various sensors and modules in the network. Just because you don’t have crawl control doesn’t mean the brake module isn’t capable of executing those functions. It just needs the right signal and on the SR5 there’s just no way for it to receive that signal. Unless someone at Toyota decides to change the algorithm for brake pedal feel it’s gonna stay the same. I hope this clears things up. Here’s a picture of the cylinder for reference.
Attachments
I put steel braided lines and EBC pads and rotors on my f250. It is like a different vehicle. The pedal is very firm and stopping distances are much shorter. On my 4r stiffening up the front end with new shocks and springs eliminated the front end nose dive that drove me crazy.
CutthroatSlam
Senior Member
The OP needs to replace the master cylinder and do a proper bleed of the system. There's a specific special way to bleed the system with ABS. Done right, the pedal feel will return to normal.:infidel:
chester4Run
New member
Yep, this is my guess too. In FL, the humidity gets into brake fluid over time (brake fluid is hygroscopic) and gradually causes the brakes to feel spongy. The brakes on my 2011 SR5 are firm and very grippy. (the brakes on 94 are great too).
The process I usually take is to suck out the reservoir annually and refill with fresh fluid, then bleed all four lines adding fluid as necessary to keep the reservoir above 50%. This process goes well with tire rotations. If you're not into doing it yourself, any reputable brake shop should be able to do it for you.
83Mule
New member
I fully understand the OP's point......I have driven Toyota since my 78 SR-5 PU and the 16 4runner has the most crap brake ''FEEL'' of any vehicle I have driven. I felt a improvement with Akebono pads all around but it was half what I would like to do. The initial travel before engagement is too long and then suddenly gets grabby and as you come to a stop you need to modulate less pressure to smooth the stop.....just not proper compared to other heavy trucks I drive. As to the power....they are very strong in a panic stop so the sizing is correct and plenty for the truck. It is all about the modulation and ''feel''....and they are sub par in that area IMO. Just the ability to move the pedals initial ''bite'' higher in the stroke would probably be enough to improve it but it seems to be a design issue rather than lack of power. The relation of the feel to being an ABS and traction control side-effect is most likely and also means it can't be ''cured'' through throwing parts at the mechanicals!
Jetboy
New member
Sounds like we need a pedal commander for the brakes...
The problem with having very firm initial brake bite is that it's the opposite of what you want off road. Not only for the crawl and low speed torque vectoring stuff, but also just for your own driving functionality. Off road you want a lot of travel for the first 10% of brake force. Especially for rock crawling with an automatic. IMO the brakes are perfectly tuned for that function. The 4Runner makes a lot of compromises for the purpose of offroad benefits. It could be programmed of course for better highway manners - or ideally it could be setup for both where shifting to lo range would change the brake feel like it does with the throttle mapping.
The problem with having very firm initial brake bite is that it's the opposite of what you want off road. Not only for the crawl and low speed torque vectoring stuff, but also just for your own driving functionality. Off road you want a lot of travel for the first 10% of brake force. Especially for rock crawling with an automatic. IMO the brakes are perfectly tuned for that function. The 4Runner makes a lot of compromises for the purpose of offroad benefits. It could be programmed of course for better highway manners - or ideally it could be setup for both where shifting to lo range would change the brake feel like it does with the throttle mapping.
jrandom
New member
Which is the point I eluded to earlier. It is a software based system and we know how Toyota deals with software, closed proprietary. How long did it take Magnuson to get ECU access to tune their supercharger?
Pedal commander for brakes is a great idea, that will never happen... due to liability.
Could always wrap a bungee cord around the pedal stalk to the hyacinth vent, more wraps will stiffen it up :madgrin:
Last edited:
