Colorado wisdom?

[Carl.]

If you plan on regularly going to the mountains or you like mountain biking or rock climbing, check out Golden. 25 minutes or less into Denver durning rush hour and closer to the skiing and wheeling than the other "suburbs." Suburbs is in quotes because it's just as much it's own town as Boulder. Golden used to be the Capitol of Colorado and is home to School of Mines (cool fact: graduates' starting salaries are higher than any public university in the country). Golden real estate ain't cheap though.

Highlands is nice if you want the culture and character and close to Denver.

Far south of Denver can get you a little land and nice views of the mountains, but its a haul to actually get to where the mountains start and traffic into Denver sucks. If you don't have to commute that might not matter.

 

[bofa]

lol, it will NOT, but I think you have more common sense than most that move here. just remember, we have LOTS of illegals without auto ins. and just cause you have a green light, does NOT mean others will the red light will stop. out here a red light means 3 more cars are going. be fore warned.
Again, I think you will be fine.

Unfortunately that problem isn't limited to CO. About 8 years ago I was driving to work the day before our wedding to take care of a few last minute things, and an uninsured illegal ran a red light in front of me... I t-boned them at a solid 45 mph. It totaled my Rav4 at the time. The impact was so hard I bent the steering wheel, ripped the tires off the wheels when I did a 180, and it broke the engine block at the mounts. I have some pics here somewhere.

As for me, I only broke my thumb (ninja grip on the steering wheel!) and I was bruised all over. My knee went through the dash so it was swollen for a few days, and I had some really.. um.. interesting bruising from the seat belts that looked a lot like those hall monitor sashes kids wear. Then whatever concoction of medicine the hospital gave me made me sick as a dog for about 3 days.

It did give me a new appreciation for the Toyota brand though. The car was only a year old and I broke even on the value and I walked away relatively unscathed. Since then I took up motorcycle riding and learned a lot more about defensive driving and knowing its not only about me, but about other knuckleheads around me. I don't have my bikes anymore, but still look out for the baddies.

Don't forget I also lived in CO for a couple of years and I drove while there. I also drove from Denver to Birmingham in the middle of a blizzard (well the blizzard only reach to Kansas) but I did pretty well. I was in a 4WD Jeep though. I did feel bad for all the people in the ditches though.

 

[04rnr]

thats cool you knowing about the Illegals here, but that issue has only got a lot worse, since Az passed that law, guess where those Illegals went ???? :redbrick:
Glad you survived that crash, sounds pretty bad, and Im betting he had no ins. they dont here.

 

[bofa]

If you plan on regularly going to the mountains or you like mountain biking or rock climbing, check out Golden. 25 minutes or less into Denver durning rush hour and closer to the skiing and wheeling than the other "suburbs." Suburbs is in quotes because it's just as much it's own town as Boulder. Golden used to be the Capitol of Colorado and is home to School of Mines (cool fact: graduates' starting salaries are higher than any public university in the country). Golden real estate ain't cheap though.

Highlands is nice if you want the culture and character and close to Denver.

Far south of Denver can get you a little land and nice views of the mountains, but its a haul to actually get to where the mountains start and traffic into Denver sucks. If you don't have to commute that might not matter.

Thanks! We are planning to spend a day in Golden this December to check out the historic downtown area, do the sleigh ride thing, and probably the Coors tour. Maybe we'll do a bit of driving and check out the housing too. How are the schools in that area?

Yeah neither of us plan to commute to Denver. The only way that happens is if 1 - she cant manage to find a job in a local district and has no other choice, or 2 - something happens to my job and I have to go back to work for the company I was at when I was there a few years back. Even then, I'll be shooting for the work from home thing like crazy. It has to be the best perk ever.

 

[chetJ]

Not quite sure what to make of this post

CA beats FL in worst schools (ranks 49th!). Unfortunately, I AM a beach person...which is the only thing keeping me here. I think your reasons for moving are very similar to mine, though you were more diplomatic than I will be:

My reason for moving out of CA is because it has become one huge 3rd world cesspool!:surfer:

Now for the hateful comments to follow...:flipoff:

Not quite sure what you are trying to say here with your statement about your reasons for leaving CA- are you saying
A-that you would like to leave CA because it has become as dirty as a cesspool-in which case I am not sure what makes a 3rd worldcess pool any worse than a so called first world cesspool
B- that you would like to leave CA because it has become like a cesspool due to the diverse community of people who live there, many of whom are from the so called 3rd world- in which case what you are saying is racist.
If you meant the latter, I would like to make a personal request to you-please be respectful- there are fellow members on here who are from other countries.
Thanks

 

[bofa]

thats cool you knowing about the Illegals here, but that issue has only got a lot worse, since Az passed that law, guess where those Illegals went ???? :redbrick:
Glad you survived that crash, sounds pretty bad, and Im betting he had no ins. they dont here.

They will only go where the money is. If CO makes it sustainable for them to live there, you can only blame the people paying them.

Yep, he was uninsured so my full coverage paid off the Rav4. I'll never have less than full coverage and will always have uninsured coverage from now on too.

I don't blame illegals for wanting to be here. After all... someone, somewhere in our lineage managed to come here long ago. Its just that it was easier for them to become 'legal' back then than it is these days. I'm somewhat torn between making it easier on people to assimilate and contribute responsibly to society and the "send em packing" attitude shared by many. That's another debate for another day though. For now I'll just try to cover myself best I can.

 

[bofa]

Fireplaces - some places here have fireplaces but it's far from a necessity. It seems they are very common out there. What are your preferences for wood vs gas vs alternatives?

Pipes - this might seem silly... but when it freezes here we wrap up pipes and leave the water dripping to prevent cracking. Is that something you guys do there too or are things built to withstand cold temps better (if that's possible). I know... silly question but I really don't know. Even when I live there it was in a building downtown.

Basements - we have basements here... they are called swimming pools. But seriously, we've never had a basement. I imagine getting a finished basement is ideal. Do you have any suggestions or constant problems to look for or avoid? It seems most places we've looked at there have decent sized basements.

Sooo... can anyone help with these questions? :hungry:

 

[04rnr]

Is that the same sense of entitlement that leads some people to believe outsiders aren't welcome?

I know you guys are half kidding... well maybe some of you... but our mind is made up. Just looking for some tips.

its not, a sense of "entitlement" its a sense of, this state if very beautiful, most of the trails are prestine, and we would like to keep it that way, the Denver area is way over populated as it is, and more and more people want to move here, making a bad situation worse.
People move here, use the trails for either wheeling, biking, atvs, etc, and always go off trail (not saying you will) and get our great trails closed, FOREVER.
At some point, Colorado will be no better than Ca. way over crowed, nasty trashy, illegals, non-drivers, etc., etc, with limited trails. I pray it never gets to that point, This is why, when I get wheeling, I come home with a trash bag full of trash. :sobbing:

Now we are not even talking about about the ski season, thats a whole other thread :banana:

 

[bofa]

its not, a sense of "entitlement" its a sense of, this state if very beautiful, most of the trails are prestine, and we would like to keep it that way, the Denver area is way over populated as it is, and more and more people want to move here, making a bad situation worse.
People move here, use the trails for either wheeling, biking, atvs, etc, and always go off trail (not saying you will) and get our great trails closed, FOREVER.
At some point, Colorado will be no better than Ca. way over crowed, nasty trashy, illegals, non-drivers, etc., etc, with limited trails. I pray it never gets to that point, This is why, when I get wheeling, I come home with a trash bag full of trash. :sobbing:

Now we are not even talking about about the ski season, thats a whole other thread :banana:

Yes but quipping "the state is full" or whatever nonsense seems to assume that everyone moving to the area is going to do just that. We are responsible people. We have worked very hard to get to the point where we can move and we know where we want to move and why.

When I see people basically say "state's full, go away" it rubs me the wrong way. I've seen it on other sites as well, and with other states. Since I am not an illegal, I have just as much right to be in CO as anyone else. And just because someone was born there because their family decided it was a nice place to settle well before said person was even a consideration of life, doesn't mean they are any more entitled than anyone else. I find that people that say this aren't very worldly in their views and assume everything around them is theirs and no one else's... they have no concept that their country is not theirs... their state is not theirs.. their home is not theirs... and in most cases even their car is not theirs. We're just a small part of a larger whole trying to make something of ourselves.

I'm also amused when the statement is followed by justification of "where you are is fine, why do you want to be here?". Hell if it's so great, I know a house that will be for sale once we leave. :cowboy:

 

[SgnDen]

If you plan on regularly going to the mountains or you like mountain biking or rock climbing, check out Golden. 25 minutes or less into Denver durning rush hour and closer to the skiing and wheeling than the other "suburbs." Suburbs is in quotes because it's just as much it's own town as Boulder. Golden used to be the Capitol of Colorado and is home to School of Mines (cool fact: graduates' starting salaries are higher than any public university in the country). Golden real estate ain't cheap though.

Highlands is nice if you want the culture and character and close to Denver.

Far south of Denver can get you a little land and nice views of the mountains, but its a haul to actually get to where the mountains start and traffic into Denver sucks. If you don't have to commute that might not matter.

Good idea, Carl! Golden is a great choice. Yeah, if you are thinking you'll really want to get up into the mountains with any regularity, Parker adds a lot of time to your drive (to anywhere except Park Meadows, etc of course).

 

[SgnDen]

I find that people that say this aren't very worldly in their views and assume everything around them is theirs and no one else's... they have no concept that their country is not theirs... their state is not theirs.. their home is not theirs... and in most cases even their car is not theirs. We're just a small part of a larger whole trying to make something of ourselves.

I was with ya (even though I can certainly be a 'hater' when it comes to the population growth - from a certain state in particular) UNTIL this remark.

You were right that, in my case, I am probably 50% dramatizing for effect in my comments about our beautiful state's infestation problem (ha! seeeee?).

I have lived in Chicago, New York City, Belo Horizonte Brazil, Buenos Aries, and Rome (oh, and Denver, Steamboat, Vail, and Fort Collins - which, by the way is truly worth your checking out these days!! Very very nice up there without the crush of the Denver metro)...and trust me, I wasn't walking around in overalls with a piece of Alfalfa hanging out of my mouth asking why I can't find a cold Old Milwaukee...not that it didn't cross my mind of course (hahaha!). But when you are working with the Ministry of Health in various countries in efforts to look at endemic populations afflicted with some nasty tropical infectious diseases or trying to setup the right facility to use their new Flow Cytometer (a very cool "cell sorter" basically), the piece of hay would've been a bad choice.:

What you see in my remarks, aside from just ranting for the sake of venting a little and trying to have a little fun with it, is really and truly about my personally experiencing the complete lack of respect for our surroundings and a general ego-centric "me first" attitude that has really been one of the biggest changes I've seen in the people here over time as I have come and gone over 40 years (re: 'entitlement' characterization). One guess as to who I have seen driving like complete a**es, acting like any rules/lines/procedures do not apply to 'them' (quote: "Back in Ell Ayyy...[L.A.] blah blah"), "car camping" right along a 2-lane highway sitting on coolers with music cranked (hi hop of course - ha...or not) tossing pop cans and wrappers from their pre-packaged foods into the brush, maybe even starting a "cute little campfire" then pouring a diet coke on it and driving off...did you see the news this Summer? No joke there.

Yeah, there is certainly a sense of hurt when I take my amazing memories of wilderness survival and backpacking trips with my now deceased father and try to reconcile that mentally when I find time to go hike...and everything is now "owned" and fenced...there's trash o the trails...spandex clad yuppies on $5,000 bicycles are flying by with headphones on trails meant only for hiking...and as another guy said, tearing-up the areas going off-trail. The whole "too cool" stuff just pushes me over the edge.

NOW - I really and truly believe and want to promote that we are ALL "in this" together. My son is currently 2 weeks away from the Selection process for US Army Special Forces (knot in my stomach) and even though I was raised by extremely liberal parents (scientist and psychologist), I am a firm believer in our need to act as ONE country and that our entire country belongs to us all.

I certainly know, in reality, that my gripes are about the individuals who choose to be dumbasses (in my opinion only) and are really not because of their license plate (execpt CA - haha see, I can't help it!).

When you look at NM, AZ, even UT and MT (where the uber-rich buy family ranches and take pictures of themselves), you can see how this will one day happen out there too as population increases and people realize just how tremendous our region is in climate, outdoors, etc etc. Look at Portland, OR and you really see how it's changed and they are realllly pissed about the "Californication" of their state (proximity issue there). Like I say, though (really), we need take the good with the bad.

BTW - Iowa has a had a HUGE migration here (big ad campaigns for years worked - just go to Keystone and you'll see) as well as IL and TX. Top 4 I think demographically are CA, TX, IA, IL. It's not lost on me that without this growth we wouldn't have been able to afford the light rail and lot of other great things here now.

OK - Enough. I hope you DO move here as the vast majority of all who come here are not in the categories I gripe about. Hey, we used to hate the Texans, after all...now it's the Cali's who have shown us that the TX infux in the 70's/80's was a good thing.

Love, Sgn :cowboy:

 

[bofa]

Agree SgnDen.... and I didn't mean to imply that I was referring to you. I could tell based on other responses that you were offering thoughtful input following your first post. There's not much I can do about any great expansion besides just be a responsible person myself. In any case, I refuse to live in an area where I do not want to be, especially when I have the ability to do something about it.

I too am guilty of casually pre-judging people, even if just for a quick laugh, based on their license plates. Here it's the Canadians and New Yorkers (I have a story about a New Yorker that 'hit' our 4R the week we got it.... reminds me to post that).

I also agree with your "all in this together" thing which eludes back to my opinion that we are a small part of a whole. An individual doesn't own their state or country... it's the collective will of the people that make it possible.

Okay, enough of this deep conversation and conjecture. Time for some football. Any can anyone answer my frozen pipes question? :shrug:

 

[GrantK]

bofa,
In one sense the state is full. You mentioned that you wanted to build. Before you buy the land, make sure you can secure a permit to put in a well. Colorado is running out of water do to more and more people moving here. Deep water aquifers are running 400' to 1000' and levels are dropping 4' a year. There is a hotel in Denver that originally just sunk a pipe and it supplied water for 4 stories under natural pressure. The result is that some people are having a hard time getting permits for new wells.

BTW - As to your frozen pipes question, it's not a real problem here, except for older, poorly insulated homes. Pipes enter the house below the frost line and stay in the heated areas of the house. So as long as your place is properly constructed you won't have a problem. Just choose a builder that has been building in Colorado for decent amount of time, it's always the builders from warm areas that have problems. For pipes that go outside (garden spigots, etc) you install a no-freeze type that puts the physical valve inside the house.

 

[OppoZ]

Sooo... can anyone help with these questions? :hungry:

Can't comment on this from a CO perspective but grew up in North Jersey bordering NY State where it was snow covered from late Dec through Feb and live in VA now where we think about these things too. Had a stint for 4 yrs in Tampa while I was in mid-20s, great time there.

Fireplace - Can't comment from experience on homes/fireplaces >15 yrs old but have found a traditional wood fire place doesn't do anything for heat. They actually suck the heat out of the house. They are great to look at and listen to. Gas gives off good heat yet can you really feel good about flipping a switch, not me. The best for heat, IMHO, is a wood burning stove. Had this growing up and the basement would get up to >90 degrees in winter

Pipes - we just winterize by draining the water and leaving the hose bib open. Been my experience that if you get the water out of the pipes before the freeze, pipes don't bust.

Basements - not to sound sexist but for a man, it's pure awesomeness. Have SuperChexx, 60' Sony, minibar and card table in mine. Not only do I have an escape but when the boys are over the occasional F-bomb or yell from a TD does't offend or disrupt the kiddies upstairs. I am taking a guess but would think CO has rocky soil, so you want to watch out for the proper grading that runs away from the house. This is so you don't get flooding. I prefer walkout basements vs. walk-ups so no drainage issues at the bottom of an outdoor staircase either.

Some general banter about CO. I could write a 1000 word essay on how great the Denver Metro area is but will save you. Pre-marriage and kids, I got in 20+ days a year in Summit County (even got frostbite during the best ski day I've ever had) and my company has a couple offices in and around Denver. Did a ton of travel for work so I had the air miles and hotel/rental car points. Also have my best friend from 3rd grade (we're 39 now) living in Boulder & Longmont for 15+ yrs (he's very much tied into the community through his job) and another dear friend of mine allows me access to her condo in Keystone for free whenever they're not using it. Relatively speaking, spent quite a bit of time out there in all seasons. As anyone would tell you the mtn/road biking, skiing, camping, off-roading (dirt bike or wheeling), hiking, basically anything outdoors is some of the best in the country. But to me it's the little things that really puts that area over the top - standing on the top of ____ (insert any mountain and season) and just take in the beauty - truly mind bending, belly up to any brewery (Oscar Blues is my favorite especially on bluegrass night) and strike up a conversation, flip a quarter over a map and hike that trail that day, concert scene is great (everyone knows Red Rocks. Mishawaka is a cool little hippy place but not good for kids). I could go on and on (obviously). Good luck with the move. I've moved quite a bit in the last 15 yrs and my little tribe has decided to call NOVA home for another 17+ yrs (if possible) or I would be right behind you...

 

[SgnDen]

Agree SgnDen.... and I didn't mean to imply that I was referring to you. I could tell based on other responses that you were offering thoughtful input following your first post. There's not much I can do about any great expansion besides just be a responsible person myself. In any case, I refuse to live in an area where I do not want to be, especially when I have the ability to do something about it.

I too am guilty of casually pre-judging people, even if just for a quick laugh, based on their license plates. Here it's the Canadians and New Yorkers (I have a story about a New Yorker that 'hit' our 4R the week we got it.... reminds me to post that).

I also agree with your "all in this together" thing which eludes back to my opinion that we are a small part of a whole. An individual doesn't own their state or country... it's the collective will of the people that make it possible.

Okay, enough of this deep conversation and conjecture. Time for some football. Any can anyone answer my frozen pipes question? :shrug:

Hey Bofa...no problem at all!

I'll answer your other questions in order in another post...just a sec.

GO Broncos!!!

 

[SgnDen]

bofa,
In one sense the state is full. You mentioned that you wanted to build. Before you buy the land, make sure you can secure a permit to put in a well. Colorado is running out of water do to more and more people moving here. Deep water aquifers are running 400' to 1000' and levels are dropping 4' a year. There is a hotel in Denver that originally just sunk a pipe and it supplied water for 4 stories under natural pressure. The result is that some people are having a hard time getting permits for new wells.

BTW - As to your frozen pipes question, it's not a real problem here, except for older, poorly insulated homes. Pipes enter the house below the frost line and stay in the heated areas of the house. So as long as your place is properly constructed you won't have a problem. Just choose a builder that has been building in Colorado for decent amount of time, it's always the builders from warm areas that have problems. For pipes that go outside (garden spigots, etc) you install a no-freeze type that puts the physical valve inside the house.

+1

Also be VERY aware of the fabled "expanding soil" (Bentonite). Years/decades ago, during one of CO's typical Boom times, a LOT of homes were built along the foothills in areas where the homes began cracking, foundations shifting, leaking, driveways heaving, etc. All due to expansive soil that was not addressed with the proper construction methods. I think the biggest issue areas were Southwest (e.g. Ken Caryl, Perry Park), far South (Castle Rock) and West (Golden) but not sure...I know it can be all over the front range.

BTW - You can find land/lots in the city neighborhoods, but you will pay big $$. Two houses down the street from me here in the West Highlands (Highlands Square area) had an open lot for decades. A couple of months ago, in rolled the heavy equipment, dug a HUGE basement and up went a big house that at first we were afraid would NOT go with the historic feel of the area but it ended up looking great. New Highland Square Contemporary - 3543 Osceola St | Nostalgic Homes but $760k! Wow. Go highlands, go! Sheesh.

 

[bofa]

bofa,
In one sense the state is full. You mentioned that you wanted to build. Before you buy the land, make sure you can secure a permit to put in a well. Colorado is running out of water do to more and more people moving here. Deep water aquifers are running 400' to 1000' and levels are dropping 4' a year. There is a hotel in Denver that originally just sunk a pipe and it supplied water for 4 stories under natural pressure. The result is that some people are having a hard time getting permits for new wells.

BTW - As to your frozen pipes question, it's not a real problem here, except for older, poorly insulated homes. Pipes enter the house below the frost line and stay in the heated areas of the house. So as long as your place is properly constructed you won't have a problem. Just choose a builder that has been building in Colorado for decent amount of time, it's always the builders from warm areas that have problems. For pipes that go outside (garden spigots, etc) you install a no-freeze type that puts the physical valve inside the house.

Thanks! Good to know about the pipes. I couldn't imagine everyone running around wrapping stuff and letting faucets drip every time it gets a little chilly, like they do here.

Knowing my wife... we will probably end up in a development of some sort. Any recommendations on builders out there? I see Richmond builds out there... they also build here and have a good reputation in FL.

 

[bofa]

Hey Bofa...no problem at all!

I'll answer your other questions in order in another post...just a sec.

GO Broncos!!!

I'm pulling for the Broncos as well... might as well as the Jags are gutless as usual. I was excited to see them get Manning. I've always like watching him play but it was hard because he was a big rival for my college team (UGA) and the Jags.

 

[veloindy]

Good idea, Carl! Golden is a great choice. Yeah, if you are thinking you'll really want to get up into the mountains with any regularity, Parker adds a lot of time to your drive (to anywhere except Park Meadows, etc of course).

Jeffco schools??? Hmmm, there are better options.

Fireplaces. Most days during the winter, there are burn restrictions. Our air quality is horrible, especially in winter. So even if you have a fireplace, there's usually a burn restriction in place. Both of our fireplaces are converted to gas, and they're much more efficient.

 

[bofa]

+1

Also be VERY aware of the fabled "expanding soil" (Bentonite). Years/decades ago, during one of CO's typical Boom times, a LOT of homes were built along the foothills in areas where the homes began cracking, foundations shifting, leaking, driveways heaving, etc. All due to expansive soil that was not addressed with the proper construction methods. I think the biggest issue areas were Southwest (e.g. Ken Caryl, Perry Park), far South (Castle Rock) and West (Golden) but not sure...I know it can be all over the front range.

BTW - You can find land/lots in the city neighborhoods, but you will pay big $$. Two houses down the street from me here in the West Highlands (Highlands Square area) had an open lot for decades. A couple of months ago, in rolled the heavy equipment, dug a HUGE basement and up went a big house that at first we were afraid would NOT go with the historic feel of the area but it ended up looking great. New Highland Square Contemporary - 3543 Osceola St | Nostalgic Homes but $760k! Wow. Go highlands, go! Sheesh.

And they say the housing market is dead... hah! Interesting house. Not my cup of tea but I'm sure it turned out nice. I'd probably avoid the 'historic' areas. They tried that here and the result is a bunch of million dollar homes surrounded by slums and ghetto. I know that problem is of a lesser extent in Denver but it seems like you are paying for the nostalgia. I'd rather pay for a 3-4 car garage and fill it up with toys and tools. :driving: