Coolant Temps After Water Pump Change

[bjarratt]

I recently did a timing belt change on my new 2001 4runner and at the same time replaced everything I could including the water pump. After changing everything over my current coolant temp sits right at 205 when driving around town. Before the change it never got about 190.

I am curious if anyone has any advice or could know what the cause is. Everything I see online says that most peoples temps range anywhere from 185 on the low in to 205 on the high end, but mine is always as high as it can be.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks.

 

[baskelh]

I recently did a timing belt change on my new 2001 4runner and at the same time replaced everything I could including the water pump. After changing everything over my current coolant temp sits right at 205 when driving around town. Before the change it never got about 190.

I am curious if anyone has any advice or could know what the cause is. Everything I see online says that most peoples temps range anywhere from 185 on the low in to 205 on the high end, but mine is always as high as it can be.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks.

Could be the brand of coolant. I have had 10 to 20 degree differences in different coolants. Did you replace the thermostat too?

 

[LittleCaesar]

Make sure the jiggle valve on the thermostat is between the 5 oclock and 6 oclock position.

If it was placed at the high noon or 12 oclock position, that may account for your high temps.

 

[kball]

Jiggle strikes again...

 

[541joseph]

You probably had Toyota red coolant before the change. If you didn't use this again then that would explain it. It's really the best coolant out there

 

[BlackWorksInc]

You probably had Toyota red coolant before the change. If you didn't use this again then that would explain it. It's really the best coolant out there

I need to make a thread for the forum in general one of these days explaining why you should be very careful about which coolant you're putting in anything newer than about the mid 90's on a Toyota. Many of the Universal coolants do not meet Toyota's requirements and Toyota's have had a different coolant chemistry than most others since the mid 90's when we went to Toyota LLC (Long Life Coolant, also known as "Toyota Red") I seem to be covering this more and more in the 4th gen section as they get older and people are doing their first coolant service at 10yr/100k with the Toyota SLLC (Super Long Life Coolant, aka "Toyota Pink")

Also for the OP, I would check the Jiggle valve as well.

 

[Hiball]

Make sure the jiggle valve on the thermostat is between the 5 oclock and 6 oclock position.

If it was placed at the high noon or 12 oclock position, that may account for your high temps.

I apologize as I'm new to my 4runner, but plan on changing the water pump/thermostat/ timing belt this weekend and everything I've read indicates the jiggler is suppost to be with 15 degrees of 12 o'clock. What is the benefit of running it at 5/6 o'clock?


Edit... I've read enough google pages concerning 6 o'clock jiggler location versus 12 to convince me that 6 is the best.

 

[TheDurk]

You probably had Toyota red coolant before the change. If you didn't use this again then that would explain it. It's really the best coolant out there

How would it explain it? 99% of any coolant mix is either ethylene glycol or water. Given the same percentage mix of the two, their cooling efficiency is identical. (I don't dispute that Toyota Red is best for our trucks, but because of compatibility with cooling system materials and effectiveness of the anti-corrosion chemistry.) There is just nothing that makes Toyota Red any better at removing heat from an engine in the short term than any other ethylene glycol coolant.

+1 for jiggle valve.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

How would it explain it? 99% of any coolant mix is either ethylene glycol or water. Given the same percentage mix of the two, their cooling efficiency is identical. (I don't dispute that Toyota Red is best for our trucks, but because of compatibility with cooling system materials and effectiveness of the anti-corrosion chemistry.) There is just nothing that makes Toyota Red any better at removing heat from an engine in the short term than any other ethylene glycol coolant.

Last I checked there are chemical additive packages that help create better heat dissipation aren't there (granted much of it is probably snake oil)
, I don't remember if Toyota has any but I do know that not all coolant is created equal anymore and while the base glycol formula is pretty common across many coolants, its the additive packages and chemical alterations that create the main differences?

 

[TheDurk]

Last I checked there are chemical additive packages that help create better heat dissipation aren't there (granted much of it is probably snake oil)
, I don't remember if Toyota has any but I do know that not all coolant is created equal anymore and while the base glycol formula is pretty common across many coolants, its the additive packages and chemical alterations that create the main differences?

I am unaware of any such claims for Toyota Red. You do have RedLine WaterWetter, but that is a change from the water/ethylene glycol system and is snake oil in my opinion and others:

Redline WaterWetter® Review | The Truth About Cars

You also have some non-ethlylene glycol formulations, but Toyota Red isn't one of them. You are a long way from persuading me here. The additives are all about anti-corrosion, not efficiency. That's just physics.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

I am unaware of any such claims for Toyota Red. You do have RedLine WaterWetter, but that is a change from the water/ethylene glycol system and is snake oil in my opinion and others:

Redline WaterWetter® Review | The Truth About Cars

You also have some non-ethlylene glycol formulations, but Toyota Red isn't one of them. You are a long way from persuading me here. The additives are all about anti-corrosion, not efficiency. That's just physics.

I was more trying to clarify, I wasn't aware that Toyota red had anything in it of that nature as well; but I figured it'd be worth mentioning a possibility. I do know diluting the coolant can affect cooling efficiency as well if too little or too much. But at this point I think we'd be picking flys out of the shit so to say, its more a matter of the temperature controls in my opinion than the coolant. But its always nice to verify things.

 

[TheDurk]

I apologize as I'm new to my 4runner, but plan on changing the water pump/thermostat/ timing belt this weekend and everything I've read indicates the jiggler is suppost to be with 15 degrees of 12 o'clock. What is the benefit of running it at 5/6 o'clock?

FSM says "jiggle valve downward." There are several threads on this. It makes a difference. TBH, I can't explain why.

 

[hawaiian05]

Make sure the jiggle valve on the thermostat is between the 5 oclock and 6 oclock position.

If it was placed at the high noon or 12 oclock position, that may account for your high temps.

This^^^. When I changed my tbelt, water pump, & t-stat I placed the jiggle valve @ 12 o'clock thinking it'd allow air bubbles to escape. My water temps were then sitting around 199-205, which was high. I then went back and reset the t-stat so that the jiggle valve was @ 6 o'clock position and temps were instantly dropped back to 190-193, which was what I was used to. Do it- it'll fix your concern.

 

[TheDurk]

I was more trying to clarify, I wasn't aware that Toyota red had anything in it of that nature as well; but I figured it'd be worth mentioning a possibility. I do know diluting the coolant can affect cooling efficiency as well if too little or too much. But at this point I think we'd be picking flys out of the shit so to say, its more a matter of the temperature controls in my opinion than the coolant. But its always nice to verify things.

No question that changing the percentage makes a difference(I stated 'given the same percentage mix')--in fact pure water is a more efficient coolant than a mix or pure ethylene glycol--until it boils. If OP has over 50% ethylene glycol in his mix, he can improve cooling efficiency by adding water down to the ideal 50/50, unless he lives in Alaska or similar climate. Beyond 50/50, cooling efficiency improves further but you run into freezing, boiling, and corrosion issues.

http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/ethylene-glycol-d_146.html

It's all about system volume, %mix, and appropriate circulation as far as liquid cooling goes. Nothing else matters. Then radiator efficiency , ambient temp. and air circulation enters into getting rid of that heat pulled from the engine.

 

[Cheap2000SR5]

I just recently replaced my timing belt and water pump, I put in just whatever coolant they had, did not know anything of "Toyota Red" just mixed 50/50. Evidently got lucky on jiggle valve cause I just put it in and temp doesn't get above 190 deg, but I have gotten the wrong rated t-stat, or have an air bubble, driving up a steep incline should solve that, glad you got that resolved tho. I'll be getting my 2000 inspected for the first time in almost two yrs, it's been sitting for almost a year been over the whole thing and hopefully it passes, can't wait to drive it down the legally lol!

 

[bjarratt]

Well I know that the jiggle value was put at the 12 o'clock position (should have done more research on that. That's my fault). Now I am curious about the coolant used. I saw no change temperature change from the Toyota red to the prestone coolant before the thermostats change. My coolant is still so new though that it could cause the temperature change in the long run.

Any guys who have run something other than the Toyota coolant for a long time that can report on long term performance.

 

[TheDurk]

Well I know that the jiggle value was put at the 12 o'clock position (should have done more research on that. That's my fault). Now I am curious about the coolant used. I saw no change temperature change from the Toyota red to the prestone coolant before the thermostats change. My coolant is still so new though that it could cause the temperature change in the long run.

Any guys who have run something other than the Toyota coolant for a long time that can report on long term performance.

Just to follow through on what I have been saying, while ethylene glycol coolants are the same in terms of cooling efficiency, they are NOT the same in terms of anti-corrosion technology. Thus, if you are running non-Toyota coolant (exception only for Valvoline Asian which is a Toyota Pink clone), it should NOT be in there for longer than 25 or 30k. Any drop in efficiency in the longer term is not because the ethylene glycol is 'wearing out'--it doesn't--but because the radiator and engine passages are getting coated and even plugged. This is not a good thing. So I hope there is no one out there to give such a report.

As I said upthread, if the coolant is diluted because of water additions over time, the cooling efficiency will actually INCREASE, since water is a better coolant than ethylene glycol.

 

[nevada]

Make sure the jiggle valve on the thermostat is between the 5 oclock and 6 oclock position.

If it was placed at the high noon or 12 oclock position, that may account for your high temps.

I apologize as I'm new to my 4runner, but plan on changing the water pump/thermostat/ timing belt this weekend and everything I've read indicates the jiggler is suppost to be with 15 degrees of 12 o'clock. What is the benefit of running it at 5/6 o'clock?


Edit... I've read enough google pages concerning 6 o'clock jiggler location versus 12 to convince me that 6 is the best.

FSM says "jiggle valve downward." There are several threads on this. It makes a difference. TBH, I can't explain why.

This^^^. When I changed my tbelt, water pump, & t-stat I placed the jiggle valve @ 12 o'clock thinking it'd allow air bubbles to escape. My water temps were then sitting around 199-205, which was high. I then went back and reset the t-stat so that the jiggle valve was @ 6 o'clock position and temps were instantly dropped back to 190-193, which was what I was used to. Do it- it'll fix your concern.

wait, what now. that makes no sense, and honestly, is the first time ive ever heard that it should be on the bottom.
usually its said it needs to be on the top, in order to allow the trapped air to escape.

I have never adhered to either of these, the trapped air is released when the stat opens. I have yet to run into any issues with overheating, or otherwise.

also, I have installed many stats that don't even have a valve, what then?

 

[TheDurk]

wait, what now. that makes no sense, and honestly, is the first time ive ever heard that it should be on the bottom.
usually its said it needs to be on the top, in order to allow the trapped air to escape.

I have never adhered to either of these, the trapped air is released when the stat opens. I have yet to run into any issues with overheating, or otherwise.

also, I have installed many stats that don't even have a valve, what then?

I agree, it's voodoo. After all, what effect on running performance between say, 200°F and 205°F can the jiggler have since the thermostat has been at least partially open once 180°F has been passed? But the FSM says down, and many posters in various threads report lowered temps when switching from up to down on this particular engine.

If there is no jiggle valve, that's not the right thermostat for this engine. If you aren't talking about this engine, I don't think anyone here is saying jiggler down for all engines. We are talking about the 5VZ-FE 3.4L Toyota V6 and that's it. My BMW 2,5L I6 M52 wants jiggler up and that's what it got.

 

[LittleCaesar]

When I opened mine up for the first time, the jiggle valve was between 5 and 6, with it being closer to 5. I know the previous owner had never touched the T-stat. I'd say this is a result of secondary R&D by the Toyo engineers before the 4runner hit the market, just like the little oval in the throttle body gasket.

Every other vertical thermostat I have installed has had the jiggle valve positioned at high noon. Ones that are recessed horizontally (think Chevy Vortec for one) usually is devoid of the jiggle valve.

My buddy who had a T100 used the Zerex pink stuff just like Durk does, and had zero effects after using it for 100,000+ miles, with only a radiator drain and refill once. I think the stuff was still in there when he sold it.