Does your 5th gen. take 20 minutes to warm up?

[Randyman...]

I don't think it's as much a thermostat issue as a software issue? (The 4th & 5th Gens both use 82°c thermostats)
{snip}
The point is that there may be a strategy to why it takes so long to heat up. Though with an aluminum block it shouldn't be as prone to uneven heating as cast iron blocks due to aluminum's nature. Not to mention from an emission's standpoint the ECM would want the vehicle in Closed Loop as soon as possible. Some of our vehicles used "heat switching valves" that essentially closed off the heater core so the engine could warm up faster (though I don't recall the 4th or 5th gen vehicles using these.)

As mentioned above - very nice explanation indeed :yo: Sunk in immediately thanks to the clear presentation.

I recall the old "Thermowax" valves on the throttle-body of my old '87 T4R 22RE (parked in storage awaiting a re-build) - likely a primitive ancestor to where this technology is today on our 1GR-FE Dual-VVTi's.

Makes me appreciate my shivering-ass on the few rare freezing days we see in Houston. I'll take a slower heater-response to give my engine block a stress-free warm-up routine for sure.


All that said - I agree with the OP. My T4R's heater takes F-O-R-E-V-E-R to warm up...

I'm also contemplating adding aftermarket heated seats (SR5 w/Black Leather Upgrade - so I'm hurting more than if I had cloth seats). And I live in Houston for crying out loud!!!

My passengers also repeatedly complain about the lack of heat when cold outside (in HOUSTON!!!) - so it's not just sand in my va-jay-jay talking here :hurt:

 

[BlackWorksInc]

I will keep an eye out for any information that may shed some light as to why the 5th gen takes so long to warm up. I am curious if the Tacoma and/or '07-'09 FJ Cruisers take as long as the 4th gens to warm up while the '10~'14 FJ Cruisers take as long as the 5th gens to warm up? Perhaps it has something to do with the restructuring to a Dual VVTi engine that utilizes 0w-20? Though I can't imagine what the differences might be...
[MENTION=66316]1engineer[/MENTION] or [MENTION=78273]Jeremy556[/MENTION] could possible throw in their 2 cents on the matter?

 

[FrontRange4Runner]

Mine take about 5 min to warm up. That said, I keep my heater off until the engine temp is actually moving.

 

[philsey]

I don't notice it so much until after I ride in the wife's new Accord. The Honda's heater and A/C are just excellent - fast and powerful. Interesting how 2 modern vehicles can be so different.

Does not make me wish for my 1960 VW back tho. Kept an ice scraper in the front seat, in order to see out.

 

[vailTRD]

My 2015 trail warms fairly quick. I live in Colorado. Now, Toyota is good at putting together parts based on region. How about a different thermostat, one for colder climates?

I also live in colorado. My heat takes longer than it should.

 

[1engineer]

Alright, I took one for the team this morning. Read on:

Conditions: 30 degrees F and Cloudy.
Time: 6:50 AM EST
Location: Driveway where test vehicle had set all night.
Equipment: 2015 Toyota 4Runner SR5, DMM, Old Fluke Temp Probe, Casio G-Shock Watch With Stopwatch, Pad and Pencil, Me.
Set Up:
1. Seat Heater "OFF",
2. Used small piece of folded paper to wedge probe approx. 1/2" into the left center upper vent. Probe not touching anything.
3. Temperature set on "HIGH," all vents including rears left fully open.
4. Left outside vent, left center vent and right center vent pointed at my face.
5. Started truck and let idle at around 1200 rpm. Did not ever hit accelerator.
6. Climbed in to test.
7. Wearing only jeans and sweatshirt so no heavy jacket or gloves.

The Test:
1st Number=Time (minutes) 2nd Number=Temp (degrees F rounded to whole number)
0- 30
1- 31
2- 45
3- 51
4- 73
5- 80

Now this is the temperature on the probe inside of the vent. By around 4:00 I could "feel" the temperature start to rise around me. I removed the probe after the 5:00 mark because I had now measured and documented the temperature rise. I then decided to measure the air temperature around my head so at the 6:30 mark around 6" from my head the air temperature was 72 degrees F. At the 9:15 mark I needed to turn the temperature on the control down because it was getting uncomfortable.

What does this mean? Well, it means nothing really except one person has documented a changing condition instead of just getting on a message board saying "It's too HOT" or "It's too COLD" or "It takes too LONG" or "It's too HEAVY" or "It's too SLOW."
What is comfortable to me might be cold or hot to you guys. If you are like my wife then there is no correct temperature ever.
Anyway, it's documented now. To summarize after 5:00 minutes it's pretty comfortable in the cabin at idle and 30 degrees F ambient.

If you don't believe me fine. You go out in your driveway and go through a test similar to mine and we can compare notes. If you don't want to do that? Then I will call BS.

 

[nguyenn]

I live in the Bay Area. It doesn't get as cold as some places mentioned. But my 2014 T4R takes about 5 mins or less to warm up. The seats warmer gets hot super fast. ;-)

 

[BettysNephew]

I feel it may have more to do with the aluminum engine and radiator size as I have noticed that the temperature gauge drops quite quickly when the engine is shut off for a relatively brief period in 30°F weather. This would be in about a 10 minute period. I don't recall any vehicle I have owned dropping the engine temperature so quickly on shut down in the past. I may try the old trick of covering part of the radiator with cardboard to see if that helps.
[MENTION=66316]1engineer[/MENTION] Great data. Have you noted how quickly the residual heat in the engine seems to fall off as noted here? Or is it just my imagination. We appear to live in similar climate conditions.

 

[TBrock]

Alright, I took one for the team this morning. Read on:

Conditions: 30 degrees F and Cloudy.
Time: 6:50 AM EST
Location: Driveway where test vehicle had set all night.
Equipment: 2015 Toyota 4Runner SR5, DMM, Old Fluke Temp Probe, Casio G-Shock Watch With Stopwatch, Pad and Pencil, Me.
Set Up:
1. Seat Heater "OFF",
2. Used small piece of folded paper to wedge probe approx. 1/2" into the left center upper vent. Probe not touching anything.
3. Temperature set on "HIGH," all vents including rears left fully open.
4. Left outside vent, left center vent and right center vent pointed at my face.
5. Started truck and let idle at around 1200 rpm. Did not ever hit accelerator.
6. Climbed in to test.
7. Wearing only jeans and sweatshirt so no heavy jacket or gloves.

The Test:
1st Number=Time (minutes) 2nd Number=Temp (degrees F rounded to whole number)
0- 30
1- 31
2- 45
3- 51
4- 73
5- 80

Now this is the temperature on the probe inside of the vent. By around 4:00 I could "feel" the temperature start to rise around me. I removed the probe after the 5:00 mark because I had now measured and documented the temperature rise. I then decided to measure the air temperature around my head so at the 6:30 mark around 6" from my head the air temperature was 72 degrees F. At the 9:15 mark I needed to turn the temperature on the control down because it was getting uncomfortable.

What does this mean? Well, it means nothing really except one person has documented a changing condition instead of just getting on a message board saying "It's too HOT" or "It's too COLD" or "It takes too LONG" or "It's too HEAVY" or "It's too SLOW."
What is comfortable to me might be cold or hot to you guys. If you are like my wife then there is no correct temperature ever.
Anyway, it's documented now. To summarize after 5:00 minutes it's pretty comfortable in the cabin at idle and 30 degrees F ambient.

If you don't believe me fine. You go out in your driveway and go through a test similar to mine and we can compare notes. If you don't want to do that? Then I will call BS.

You're always on point with your examinations/breakdowns! :first:


I ran a similar test.

Test: I dressed appropriately for the weather, unlocked my 2014 4Runner, started it, and drove off.

Results: My test revealed that I was a MAN dressed for the weather/temps and was hot as shit after about a minute of sitting in the drivers seat.

Feedback is appreciated!

 

[Slowgoat]

My 4th gen takes FOREVER to warm up.

Was convinced it was the thermostat.

Changed it out, same.


Anyone need a thermostat??

 

[wfo9]

Alright, I took one for the team this morning. Read on:

Conditions: 30 degrees F and Cloudy.
Time: 6:50 AM EST
Location: Driveway where test vehicle had set all night.
Equipment: 2015 Toyota 4Runner SR5, DMM, Old Fluke Temp Probe, Casio G-Shock Watch With Stopwatch, Pad and Pencil, Me.
Set Up:
1. Seat Heater "OFF",
2. Used small piece of folded paper to wedge probe approx. 1/2" into the left center upper vent. Probe not touching anything.
3. Temperature set on "HIGH," all vents including rears left fully open.
4. Left outside vent, left center vent and right center vent pointed at my face.
5. Started truck and let idle at around 1200 rpm. Did not ever hit accelerator.
6. Climbed in to test.
7. Wearing only jeans and sweatshirt so no heavy jacket or gloves.

The Test:
1st Number=Time (minutes) 2nd Number=Temp (degrees F rounded to whole number)
0- 30
1- 31
2- 45
3- 51
4- 73
5- 80

Now this is the temperature on the probe inside of the vent. By around 4:00 I could "feel" the temperature start to rise around me. I removed the probe after the 5:00 mark because I had now measured and documented the temperature rise. I then decided to measure the air temperature around my head so at the 6:30 mark around 6" from my head the air temperature was 72 degrees F. At the 9:15 mark I needed to turn the temperature on the control down because it was getting uncomfortable.

What does this mean? Well, it means nothing really except one person has documented a changing condition instead of just getting on a message board saying "It's too HOT" or "It's too COLD" or "It takes too LONG" or "It's too HEAVY" or "It's too SLOW."
What is comfortable to me might be cold or hot to you guys. If you are like my wife then there is no correct temperature ever.
Anyway, it's documented now. To summarize after 5:00 minutes it's pretty comfortable in the cabin at idle and 30 degrees F ambient.

If you don't believe me fine. You go out in your driveway and go through a test similar to mine and we can compare notes. If you don't want to do that? Then I will call BS.

Good info, but you should take another hit for the team and do a similar test in the more common use case that people are observing. Get in and drive vs sitting still for 6 minutes (who has the patience for that).

Also, I think the unmeasured observations being given here were not based on a specific time interval. It was all relative to other vehicles. A long time to some folks might be 2 minutes. This is the era of instant gratification :ranger: The OP did say 20 min, but A: he might be a lizard, B: he might live in Antarctica

I do think there is more to this than 5th gen urban myth. By no means a a big deal though.

 

[Jayhawk5G]

Mine warms within 5-10 min. even here in Chiberia last winter...

I turn the heat to max, turn the fan all the way up...

 

[blakjack23]

I have the factory remote start, which stays on for 10 minutes before it shuts off. My LE is always warm by the time that 10 minutes is up. And thats in MN temps.

I have the auto temp guage set to 72. I pretty much don't change that all winter.

My heated seats on the other hand seem to not get hot during that 10 minutes (warm but not hot), but they do after a couple minutes of driving.

 

[IAmTodd]

I believe in the last thread on this subject it was determined that the trucks with auto climate have an electric preheater.

 

[Donkey]

Within about 5 minutes, or about 5 miles of driving, my 4Runner is perfectly warm. Warm enough to satisfy a 4 year old too. I just start it up and drive off. Sometimes I park in the garage but I really notice no difference in the time to provide warm heat to the cabin. If the temp is under 35 degrees or so and I parked outside, I will let it run for about a minute or two while I load the kiddos.

20 minutes to warm up is pretty nuts, but if you think that is bad you should try a 4.0L YJ with a plastic roof, zero insulation and a true insult of a heater fan with only two vents...

Are you the original owner? Perhaps some wizard of smart previous owner used a product like "water wetter" or similar, exchanging/flushing the coolant may be an easy fix.

 

[Antman]

My kids hate getting in mine when it's cold out because they are usually in the wife's Odyssey. That thing will roast a turkey in just a few minutes front or rear. 4Runner- takes quite a bit longer.

I just leave the fan off and watch the Scanguage water temp. Once I'm over 150 degrees or so I have instant heat, lol.

On a side note, I love pretending I have a diesel under the hood on cold startups. I think the valve clatter on this engine just sounds awesome...almost makes up for the slow heat.

 

[badhabits]

my kids hate getting in mine when it's cold out because they are usually in the wife's odyssey. That thing will roast a turkey in just a few minutes front or rear. 4runner- takes quite a bit longer.

I just leave the fan off and watch the scanguage water temp. Once i'm over 150 degrees or so i have instant heat, lol.

On a side note, i love pretending i have a diesel under the hood on cold startups. I think the valve clatter on this engine just sounds awesome...almost makes up for the slow heat.

yum yum

 

[m85476585]

I don't think it's as much a thermostat issue as a software issue? (The 4th & 5th Gens both use 82°c thermostats)

For example there is an issue with 5.9L "#53" Cummins engines found in Dodge Rams in which when these blocks were cast there was a section that was too thin below the exhaust manifold. In cold weather the engine would warm up too quickly and the resulting uneven heat expansion cracked the block in a perfectly straight line at thin spot. The "Fix" to prevent cracks from occurring in the remaining unaffected blocks (something like 100,000 engines I believe) was to reflash the ECM with an updated software. The reflash change the warm-up strategy to warm up the block more evenly thus preventing the cracking (by reducing power until the vehicle was completely warm, so owners obviously complained about their trucks being gutless in cold weather after the flash.)

The point is that there may be a strategy to why it takes so long to heat up. Though with an aluminum block it shouldn't be as prone to uneven heating as cast iron blocks due to aluminum's nature. Not to mention from an emission's standpoint the ECM would want the vehicle in Closed Loop as soon as possible. Some of our vehicles used "heat switching valves" that essentially closed off the heater core so the engine could warm up faster (though I don't recall the 4th or 5th gen vehicles using these.)

Interesting. Most (all?) aluminum engines use cast iron cylinder liners, so you can get issues with dissimilar metals. Manufacturers have generally figured it out with good casting designs, but Toyota is known to be conservative, so they might set a slow warm up anyway.

I think the climate control will sometimes not try to blow hot air until the heater core reaches a certain temperature. I vaguely remember reading that in the service manual or something, but it's hard to tell in mine (4th gen V8) since the climate control system has a mind of its own.

My last car was a Honda Civic (r18), and they had an issue with the blocks cracking. I can't remember if there was a software update to fix it, but I know it took forever to warm up in the cold. Like 10 minutes of idling and 20 minutes of driving to work and it would just barely blow warm air by the time I got there. And if I was stopped at a red light with the heat on, I could watch the temp gauge drop. It had a little 1.8l 4cyl aluminum block with cast iron liners, and an oversized cooling system. I always assumed it took so long to warm up because it was just being too efficient.

You guys should consider adding a block heater. It's super easy to install since it's a cartridge that slides into a cast hole in the engine block. The hardest part is finding the hole and routing the wire. I have a few posts about it over in the 4th gen section, but I'm fairly sure that the 5th gen uses the same Toyota part number. The aftermarket ones are the same part number for all Toyota engines that take a cartridge heater.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/187421-my-3-mile-commute-bad-my-4r.html#post1909190

 

[Cobalt Anubis]

I have a twenty minute drive to work. The first five minute or so suck. After ten minutes I generally start to warm up. I really, really miss the heated seats that were in my previous vehicle.

Agreed. Both of my Maxima's would warm up within 5 minutes max. (no pun intended) The 5th Gen 4Runner takes a full 20 minutes and the floor registers only push out cold air. I have an appointement to have that condition checked on Friday. Im glad its still under warranty.

 

[badhabits]

I only have a 6 mile commute but am getting heat within about 3 to 5 minutes with no warm up before I leave. The time until the cab starts getting comfortable is some what longer due to the aforementioned weak air distribution system.