Gauges not working.

[Doc2012]

So, had an issue with my cluster; the board on the back of the cluster shorted and burned a connection.

I found a cluster in my storage unit from my donor. Plugged it in, and the lights WORK, but the gauges don't, doesn't even have my CEL, which I know I should have because I don't have any O2 sensors in there right now.

I checked the fuses, under hood and body ECU, all good.

Checked the connections to the cluster, checked the connections to the BECU. Everything's right and plugged in tight.

Took the cluster apart and everything was still good, nothing burned or broken like the last one.

Didn't check the connections at the ECU end yet, though looking back now I probably should.

Anyone else have any ideas?

I did search, but everything I found was coming up about the lights not being on or a fuel gauge problem.

 

[LittleCaesar]

Same year? Both Sr5 or Limited? Do you know if it worked in the donor beforehand?

 

[nissanh]

Does the donor printed electrical diagram is the same as your old wiring? Check all the wire connections at the wire plug.

 

[Doc2012]

It is. Sorry. Forgot to mention that.

Both '99 Limiteds.

I got a 2000 from a member here, but it had ONE plug that was wrong.

Got lucky finding the one in my storage unit.

 

[pluton]

Not a solution, but I'd look for 12v at the lamp socket for the CEL, when you know it's supposed to be on.

 

[TheDurk]

No CEL, but how about SRS and ABS when you turn it on, or the door ajar light when you have the door open? I'm guessing the first two are dead but door ajar works, if so, I would suggest:

1. Substitute a known good fuse for the 10A GAUGE fuse or check it with a light or meter. Don't just look at it and call it good. They can be very misleading and it leads to a lot of wasted time when people say "It looked fine.".

2. If you are sure GAUGE fuse is good, locate the 12V input to the gauges and warning lights. On a 1999, that will be a black wire with yellow stripe at pin 12 of Plug C29. C29 is one-row brown plug with thirteen pins, of which nine should have wires. Pin 12 is the next to most right one with the clip on top looking at the open end of the plug.

Test that for 12V+ with key on.

Report back and we can go from there. If my guess on the lights was wrong, please let me know, and I'll have a different approach.

 

[Doc2012]

No CEL, but how about SRS and ABS when you turn it on, or the door ajar light when you have the door open? I'm guessing the first two are dead but door ajar works, if so, I would suggest:

Door ajar works.

Battery light works when in the acc position.

NO CEL, ABS lights though.

1. Substitute a known good fuse for the 10A GAUGE fuse or check it with a light or meter. Don't just look at it and call it good. They can be very misleading and it leads to a lot of wasted time when people say "It looked fine.".

VERY true. Should've done that from the start.

2. If you are sure GAUGE fuse is good, locate the 12V input to the gauges and warning lights. On a 1999, that will be a black wire with yellow stripe at pin 12 of Plug C29. C29 is one-row brown plug with thirteen pins, of which nine should have wires. Pin 12 is the next to most right one with the clip on top looking at the open end of the plug.

Test that for 12V+ with key on.

Report back and we can go from there.

I'll check these as soon as I get home and report back.

If my guess on the lights was wrong, please let me know, and I'll have a different approach.

Thanks [MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION].

 

[Doc2012]

[MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION]

So, I know I'm getting power.

I didn't test with a meter, but i have my speedo corrector spliced into the power wire for the gauges.

Think that could be the issue?

I changed fuses, messed with plugs, but no change. Took it apart and everything was still clean.

Any suggestions?

 

[TheDurk]

[MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION]

So, I know I'm getting power.

I didn't test with a meter, but i have my speedo corrector spliced into the power wire for the gauges.

Think that could be the issue?

I changed fuses, messed with plugs, but no change. Took it apart and everything was still clean.

Any suggestions?

Well, you only know that power is getting to your corrector, not to the cluster, and yes, your splice/tap COULD be the problem, especially if you used one of those nasty blue pastic tap thingys. (I won't use them at all anymore.) They like to cut the wire they are tapping off of.

So I think you really need to test where I suggested. It really has to be the 12V+ supply, because these thingys are all ground-switched/controlled.

 

[Doc2012]

Well, you only know that power is getting to your corrector, not to the cluster, and yes, your splice/tap COULD be the problem, especially if you used one of those nasty blue pastic tap thingys. (I won't use them at all anymore.) They like to cut the wire they are tapping off of.



So I think you really need to test where I suggested. It really has to be the 12V+ supply, because these thingys are all ground-switched/controlled.

And this is why you're the electrical engineer and I'm a Corpsman.

You were right. The splice was the culprit.

I couldn't even think why it would be, because I used one of those "weather proof" butt connectors with the glue inside it.

 

[TheDurk]

For the record, I'm no stinkin' engineer. (Apologies to those E.E.'s out there.)

I was just a geek of the 1960's variety as a kid, building electronic stuff from scratch out of old TV's and stuff in my folks basement. We didn't have computers or video games.

My degrees are in economics and finance.

And yes, crimp connectors of any kind are suspect in automotive work. Vibration and heat does bad things. Solder and heat-shrink tubing is the way to go. If you can stitch up a leg, you can learn to solder. (Do corpsmen stitch?)

 

[BlackWorksInc]

For the record, I'm no stinkin' engineer. (Apologies to those E.E.'s out there.)

I was just a geek of the 1960's variety as a kid, building electronic stuff from scratch out of old TV's and stuff in my folks basement. We didn't have computers or video games.

My degrees are in economics and finance.

And yes, crimp connectors of any kind are suspect in automotive work. Vibration and heat does bad things. Solder and heat-shrink tubing is the way to go. If you can stitch up a leg, you can learn to solder. (Do corpsmen stitch?)

Something interesting to note, Toyota as well as most manufacturers these days no longer advise soldering wiring connections. They all are moving to crimp connectors with heat shrink and/or flexible silicone tape, Toyota particularly is using the repair process for aluminum wiring because according to their testing it is the best way to repair wiring.

That being said, I don't mind soldering wires; but I have found that if you use a proper butt connector and prepare the wiring correctly it will work just as well (I have found those heat shrink with glue connectors to be a boon when done right.)

Just figured you'd find that interesting as a "things change" sort of deal.
[MENTION=76419]Doc2012[/MENTION]

How did the connector fail?

 

[Doc2012]

For the record, I'm no stinkin' engineer. (Apologies to those E.E.'s out there.)



I was just a geek of the 1960's variety as a kid, building electronic stuff from scratch out of old TV's and stuff in my folks basement. We didn't have computers or video games.



My degrees are in economics and finance.



And yes, crimp connectors of any kind are suspect in automotive work. Vibration and heat does bad things. Solder and heat-shrink tubing is the way to go. If you can stitch up a leg, you can learn to solder. (Do corpsmen stitch?)

Ah. Well you could have me fooled. Lol.

I'm going to need to redo it, ran out of small shrink wrap, and don't really have a way to get the iron out there, except to run a long cord.

Which is no biggie, I just didn't want the neighbors pissed while I was working out there.

And yes. We do stitch. I've had quite a few pretty knarley ones, and some dumb ones.

 

[Doc2012]

[MENTION=66389]BlackWorksInc[/MENTION]

No idea. Didn't really take it apart to find out.

I'd imagine that by the time I did get it apart, I wouldn't be able to tell anyway.


I really need to depin the connector and take the connector side inside and solder it up. It's really damn short.

That's why I used butt connectors to begin with.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

[MENTION=66389]BlackWorksInc[/MENTION]

No idea. Didn't really take it apart to find out.

I'd imagine that by the time I did get it apart, I wouldn't be able to tell anyway.


I really need to depin the connector and take the connector side inside and solder it up. It's really damn short.

That's why I used butt connectors to begin with.

The only caution I would give you is that soldering close to the connector make a very stiff joint. It probably won't be an issue on the cluster since that harness rarely if ever flexes dramatically; but the basic idea is the same, if it is near the connector it may experience a lot of flex and crack/break later down the line.

Best of luck.

 

[TheDurk]

Something interesting to note, Toyota as well as most manufacturers these days no longer advise soldering wiring connections. They all are moving to crimp connectors with heat shrink and/or flexible silicone tape, Toyota particularly is using the repair process for aluminum wiring because according to their testing it is the best way to repair wiring.

That being said, I don't mind soldering wires; but I have found that if you use a proper butt connector and prepare the wiring correctly it will work just as well (I have found those heat shrink with glue connectors to be a boon when done right.)

Just figured you'd find that interesting as a "things change" sort of deal.

[MENTION=76419]Doc2012[/MENTION]

How did the connector fail?

Interesting. I wonder if that says more about the competence of today's dealer service staff as it does about the technique in general. #idiotproofing I, for one, simply can't remember having to redo one of my own solder joints. I had a lot of issues with crimps which I only used during a phase in my life when I lived in an apartment and had no access to an outlet when working on the car.

 

[Doc2012]

Ok [MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION].

What would be causing my "R" light to flash with the RIGHT turn signal, or when I turn to the "accessory" position, both the right turn signal and "R" illuminate.

Could it have something to do with the tail lights not being hooked up, or something else with the cluster?

 

[TheDurk]

Ok [MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION].

What would be causing my "R" light to flash with the RIGHT turn signal, or when I turn to the "accessory" position, both the right turn signal and "R" illuminate.

Could it have something to do with the tail lights not being hooked up, or something else with the cluster?

You're making that up just to mess with me right? (j/k)

Those signals come in through different plugs, but there is a long trace inside the cluster where the R light connects to something else. (EWD's are VERY vague on internal connections, unfortunately.) So it's possible glitch is inside the cluster, but I doubt it. I'm going to assume it isn't for the moment, mainly because I have no idea how to find it if it is. Are the other transmission lights working normally...P, N,D,1,2 ?

Still, my gut tells me there is some problem in the wires to your right tail light. Per chance, are your parking lights on when you switch to ACC? Like maybe the back-up light and right turn signal are shorting to each other, and the back-up light then feeds back to the R light on the cluster when the TAIL relay gets energized by you turning the key.

Do you have the trailer towing package? That module is a frequent source of taillight weirdness. If you do, pull the 25A TOW fuse and see if it still does it. That could also be the source of our stray voltage.

Why aren't the tails hooked up? I'd make sure those wires are all isolated from ground and from each other.

Also, try the Hazard Switch and see if it does the same thing with the R light. That's a somewhat different circuit and that might tell us something.

This is not a real troubleshooting approach but some shots in the dark. But maybe it will help narrow it down. Let's also see if our West Cost affiliate, [MENTION=102597]IBallEngineer[/MENTION] wants to chime in on this one. (He's no stinkin' engineer either, but he loves stuff like this.)

 

[Doc2012]

Post

I'll check that all out, and report back, hopefully tomorrow, as long as it's not a crazy day.

The tow package is out, ATM, because there as no need for it/interior stuff.

Tail light function as normal, tested out before posting.

Front corners are not hooked up right now, need some new ones(lenses broken).


And it's all taken apart because, now that I have a DD, I'm doing sound deadening, interior modifications figuring out where to mount stuff, etc etc.

 

[IBallEngineer]

HEY, I engineer things all the time, like lunch.

First glance at this situation, and [MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION] is right I do love these things, both the R indicator light circuit and the RH turn signal circuit go through connector 1H at the Driver's side J/B. Pin 5(R Indicator) and Pin 13(Rt Turn) are right next to each other. Coincidence?

opcorn: