I miss shifting

wake_rider

wake_rider

New member
I'm about to turn 35 (in a month) & my 4runner is the first vehicle I have owned that is an automatic, aside of the vehicles I've purchased for my wife's primary driver. I feel like the automatic transmission mated up on my 2000 limited 3.4 with push button awd & J-shifter is just a bit too sloppy and sof and, to be honest, I just really miss driving a standard.

What would I need to go about a manual swap while keeping everything as stock in appearance and function as possible? I want to maintain the multimode push button, and I don't want any check engine lights or codes being thrown (no smog or inspections here, but I just don't want that nuisance).

I'm a teacher, so I want to tackle it over the summer. Any experience on what I'll need to have as a checklist and what the process will be? I really want three pedals and engine manipulation again.
 
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I love manual transmissions. The 6-speed gearbox in my BMW (see signature) makes for driving perfection.

I had a 5-speed 4Runner. The clutch and gearbox aren’t very satisfying compared to those in the BMW. Notchy and with long shifter throws that got frustrating in heavy Seattle traffic over a 40 mile daily commute. I now drive an automatic 4Runner Limited and feel like the 3.4 liter and automatic are a pretty decent combination.

Drive one before you decide to do the swap, if possible.
 
Seattle_SR5 said:
I love manual transmissions. The 6-speed gearbox in my BMW (see signature) makes for driving perfection.

I had a 5-speed 4Runner. The clutch and gearbox aren’t very satisfying compared to those in the BMW. Notchy and with long shifter throws that got frustrating in heavy Seattle traffic over a 40 mile daily commute. I now drive an automatic 4Runner Limited and feel like the 3.4 liter and automatic are a pretty decent combination.

Drive one before you decide to do the swap, if possible.
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I have almost 200k driving my 5-speed 4Runner and I love it. It's not really notchy if you keep the shifter bushings in good repair, although it will never compare to a BMW. It is still fun to drive, although I admit I never feel really comfortable on a slushbox, as I have driven them very rarely over my lifetime. I have never owned one of my own.

You are absolutely correct about commuting, however. I'm retired, so it is not an issue for me. Each time I drive to New York City and face bridge/tunnel traffic, I say to myself, "I could not do this with a stick every day." I commuted for years in smaller cars with sticks in São Paulo with no problem. But the 4Runner is a heavier machine and it is hard to deal with in stop-and-go. The clutch is heavier, too, compared to a car like my 5-speed Ford Escort. So it really depends on how you will use it.
 
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wake_rider said:
What would I need to go about a manual swap while keeping everything as stock in appearance and function as possible? I want to maintain the multimode push button, and I don't want any check engine lights or codes being thrown (no smog or inspections here, but I just don't want that nuisance).

I'm a teacher, so I want to tackle it over the summer. Any experience on what I'll need to have as a checklist and what the process will be? I really want three pedals and engine manipulation again.
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I had a 95.5 extended cab Taco (3.4, 5MT) and was going to move to a 1st gen double cab Taco which only came in auto, so wanted to do a swap.

A local shop said that they would do the swap for $2600 all in (used tranny and transfer case, all new clutch parts, all Toyota factory swap-over components, including interior console/parts, no CELs, selling the used auto trans, etc.). I was surprised how cheap that was planned to be including labor.

If you do the swap, get one from the same model year. I'd do a 5MT and J-shifter with ADD hubs. They mentioned 2000 and 2001 were easier than later years because of some ECU issue. I'm not sure if the same holds true for a 4R. I just totaled a 2000 black sport edition that is now at IAA with 245k or so and shifted fine before the accident.

Good luck - I too like to row my own gears and except for the Ford motovan, all of my cars are manuals too.

Seattle_SR5 said:
I love manual transmissions. The 6-speed gearbox in my BMW (see signature) makes for driving perfection.

I had a 5-speed 4Runner. The clutch and gearbox aren’t very satisfying compared to those in the BMW. Notchy and with long shifter throws that got frustrating in heavy Seattle traffic over a 40 mile daily commute. I now drive an automatic 4Runner Limited and feel like the 3.4 liter and automatic are a pretty decent combination.

Drive one before you decide to do the swap, if possible.
Click to expand...

I love manuals too and my BMWs shift much better than my Taco or 4R did, but I still like it more than my wife's 100-series automatic.

And whatever you do, DEFINITELY drive one before you do the swap. You'll never get your money back out and most people would say its a bad decision. I'd say its a great idea (but for me, shifting is just like breathing so I don't notice it even in traffic).
 
wake_rider said:
What would I need to go about a manual swap while keeping everything as stock in appearance and function as possible? I want to maintain the multimode push button, and I don't want any check engine lights or codes being thrown (no smog or inspections here, but I just don't want that nuisance).

I'm a teacher, so I want to tackle it over the summer. Any experience on what I'll need to have as a checklist and what the process will be? I really want three pedals and engine manipulation again.
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Glad to see another teacher on here. Summers are awesome!

From the research I've done you would need the transmission, clutch pedal, slave cylinder, and driveshafts. I think you also need to cut your transmission tunnel for a larger opening.

For no CEL's you've got a few options.

1) Swap ECU and wiring harness from manual vehicle.

2) Swap ECU from manual vehicle and re-pin existing wiring harness.

3) Somehow trick auto ECU into thinking that transmission solenoids are there. I'll admit I've never seen this done and I would love to see someone do it.

Children of Bodom did a good writeup on this when he did a 5 speed and 4wd swap at the same time. Clownmeat also did this and there are a few others. Swimmerboy maybe?

I've never seen anyone do it and keep the multi-mode t-case though.

Good luck and I hope you do it. I've been on the fence for a long time. Wheeling with an auto is so easy though. If I did swap I would want a dual case setup. Good Luck!
 
Seattle_SR5 said:
I love manual transmissions. The 6-speed gearbox in my BMW (see signature) makes for driving perfection.

I had a 5-speed 4Runner. The clutch and gearbox aren’t very satisfying compared to those in the BMW. Notchy and with long shifter throws that got frustrating in heavy Seattle traffic over a 40 mile daily commute. I now drive an automatic 4Runner Limited and feel like the 3.4 liter and automatic are a pretty decent combination.

Drive one before you decide to do the swap, if possible.
Click to expand...

You have absolutely terrible taste in vehicles and in the city that chose to live in :biggrin2:
 
OP, do you have room for a 2nd car? If you have the space, I would suggest you swing for a 2nd vehicle.

I almost pulled the trigger to get my 2001 Nissan Maxima converted over to 5MT, but eventually decided it was better to switch cars because I know I would not have time to chase down issues that crop up well after the conversion.
 
TheDurk said:
I have almost 200k driving my 5-speed 4Runner and I love it. It's not really notchy if you keep the shifter bushings in good repair, although it will never compare to a BMW. It is still fun to drive, although I admit I never feel really comfortable on a slushbox, as I have driven them very rarely over my lifetime. I have never owned one of my own.

You are absolutely correct about commuting, however. I'm retired, so it is not an issue for me. Each time I drive to New York City and face bridge/tunnel traffic, I say to myself, "I could not do this with a stick every day." I commuted for years in smaller cars with sticks in São Paulo with no problem. But the 4Runner is a heavier machine and it is hard to deal with in stop-and-go. The clutch is heavier, too, compared to a car like my 5-speed Ford Escort. So it really depends on how you will use it.
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What bushings and where to get them From? For our trucks r150f
 
I had a chance back in 2006 to buy a 00 5spd SR5 with only 64,000 miles on it. Garaged and clean. The only drawback was no 4wd, which I rarely need but is nice to have when it is called for along with the 15" tires.

The problem where I live now, as opposed to then, has been the amount of people moving down south. Now traffic at times can be bumper to bumper so a 5spd, while coveted, would mean me riding it in 2nd for a long time.
 
unrealii said:
OP, do you have room for a 2nd car? If you have the space, I would suggest you swing for a 2nd vehicle.

Just get a fun 2nd car like a Bmw, Miata,etc that has a clutch already. Do some driving schools and you'll have a blast! You can use the funds that was going to the conversion to fund your purchase. And... if you ever get tired of shifting, you can just sell it :jump:
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I'd at least ponder the feasibility of selling your 4Runner on to someone who wants an automatic and just buying one with the manual transmission in it from the factory.

I've done some auto-to-manual swaps on other kinds of cars, but always older - pre-computer, where if the car happened to have an ECU it certainly didn't extend its realm into the bellhousing area and wouldn't know what trans was back there.

Just be prepared to search for a while - it took me almost 4 months to find mine ('99 Highlander 5-spd w/e-locker), but it was well worth the wait. Find one, buy it, then sell your automatic and save yourself a bunch of work.
 
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All good responses. Thanks all!

I have spent a significant portion of my life racing [mostly Motocross/Eduro/Hare Scrambles on dirtbikes] and have spent plenty of time on racetracks with cars; the ability to drive a manual is no issue. I have driven a 2nd gen 4runner that was a standard and had no complaints about the shift transition, clutch or transmission feel, but I didn't know if the 3rd gen felt significantly different.

Out of my many manual vehicles, I have to say that my 1997 Honda Civic Coupe had the sweetest clutch and buttery shift feel of any that I've owned or driven. Mind you, I've spent plenty of time in very high end cars and I'd compare that gear box to any I've spent time in. Maybe a somewhat distant second would have been my 2006 GTI.

I have a three car garage, but I keep my wife's in one spot, my truck in another, and my workbench/tools/motorcycles in the other. I really don't want to get another vehicle. I love having no car payments. I'd prefer spending a few thousand keeping my stuff going the way I like than taking on a car payment for a vehicle I don't really want all that much.

I also have ZERO intent on selling this 3rd gen. I'm in it for the long haul. I just love the truck too much, I plan on keeping it as my forever vehicle just as long as I can still source parts for it, so resell considerations are nowhere in my thought process. At 170k, I plan on it being without major problems for quite some time.

That said, I just want to again have the ability to shift and control the motor. Plus, I feel like the auto on this truck is just super sloppy. Not like it's breaking down, Chrysler sloppy, but that it is just designed to be very comfortable; not my cup of tea.

I guess my question still remains: is it possible to maintain the multimode with J-shifter (I have zero desire to change that), while shifting over to a, well, shifter setup? Also, wanting to keep the stock appearance, the cutouts in the plastic trim will be different, but I don't know if the "wood grain" trim comes with the correct molding for a manual setup.
 
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Go for it, you will not regret it. I don't even drive my 2001 that much because its not nearly as much fun. I agree with you on the auto trans, it works but it never really is in the gearing I want it to be in. Plus with all the hills around here I do a lot of engine braking. Remember they came from the factory with a 5speed so you are not reinventing the wheel, just bringing it back to the way it should be
 
I'm offended [MENTION=84643]JBurt[/MENTION] [emoji30]
I did a 5 speed swap in my '01 and kept the multi mode, and I love it.
The AWD is seriously amazing. I also did manual hubs, to keep wear off the front axles.

The wiring is super easy, and involves 6 wires-
4 behind the glove box to make both clutch switches work, and two at the trans plug for your reverse switch.
I did my swap to look completely factory- including the "Clutch Start Cancel" button.
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You WILL have to chop and reweld your tcase shifter as to not interfere with your trans shifter.
For those saying the manual isn't notchy and the throw is long, get the new seat, ball socket, and short shifter from Marlin- super great feeling.
Sure, I love the way my BMW shifts too, but why are we comparing BMWs to 4Runners?!
 
FinSport said:
Sounds like we need a BMW & 3rd Gen thread :)

F
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Yassss! I'm totally in for a BMW/3rd gen thread!

That being said, I have a 2000 Limited that I also want to manual swap. I feel, though, that the auto is easier off road.

If I manual swap it, I kinda want to V8 swap it at the same time, and keep the multimode 4wd.
 
In for the BMW/3rd gen thread as well. Looks like there are a few of us.

I only compared because I had to drive both down I-405 in stop and go traffic. The short throw of the BMW shifter with the ZHP/M3 weighted knob is pleasurable and the light clutch didn’t irk me in traffic.

I wanted to keep the miles off the BMW and the 3rd gen manual T4R wasn’t as pleasant to drive in traffic, and I wanted full time AWD and better fuel economy so I bought a Subaru Outback 3.0R. Bad decision - I should have grabbed a ‘99-00 Limited instead. That Subaru’s real world city fuel economy is 15.5 mpg on premium fuel (Subaru claims 18) and its radiator is undersized for the 6 cylinder leading to cooling issues when driving over mountain passes in the summer.

And I didn’t realize how much I’d miss the toughness of a BOF truck.
 
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