zooroadbaja
New member
I found a VR8000 nib on cl for $400. Or should I stick with a getting a synthetic Engo, XRC8?
Is this a good price for a VR8000?
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BrianSD_42
New member
the great him
Elite Member
the warn is hands down a better winch, and their customer service is 100x better should you ever need it!
gshadow325
New member
Ahh, another winch debate. well let me answer your first part of the question.
Factual Info:
Is the VR8000 worth it for $400?
Short answer NO
Long Answer, NO and why? Retail is $479. Used = No warranty. New = Warranty. New also last quarter Sept 2013-Dec 2013 there was a $80 to 100 rebate on select warn winches. This one got a $80 rebate. Basically you are getting it for what he/she paid for it and you are getting it USED. Deal for seller, shafted for the unsuspecting buyer.
Also, if you were a customer and walked into my store wanting one of these. I'd sell you one 6% above cost, $400 + 6% = $424 just to make the sale and have a happy customer.
Opinion, opinions are like buttholes they all stink
I just went thru all this recently http://www.toyota-4runner.org/off-r...lt-will-here-monday-help-so-many-choices.html
I chose the VR10000.
WHy? Warn reputation. Warn rebate for $80 would net cost me down to $490. Engo would cost me less but so much info on the web about them failing. Dont need synthetic, i WANT it(big difference in price). Smittybuilt very popular, but lots of failures too. Many seem to be from water and lack of use over time. Thats me, i will use once in a year but when i need it. im going to need it. Skimp now, regret later. No thanks.
Almost bought a Engo 10000. Smittybuilt wasnt on the list but Superwinch was.
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-g...hidden-winch-install-kinda-lots-pictures.html
the great him
Elite Member
Ahh, another winch debate. well let me answer your first part of the question.
Factual Info:
Is the VR8000 worth it for $400?
Short answer NO
Long Answer, NO and why? Retail is $479. Used = No warranty. New = Warranty. New also last quarter Sept 2013-Dec 2013 there was a $80 to 100 rebate on select warn winches. This one got a $80 rebate. Basically you are getting it for what he/she paid for it and you are getting it USED. Deal for seller, shafted for the unsuspecting buyer.
Also, if you were a customer and walked into my store wanting one of these. I'd sell you one 6% above cost, $400 + 6% = $424 just to make the sale and have a happy customer.
Opinion, opinions are like buttholes they all stink
I just went thru all this recently http://www.toyota-4runner.org/off-r...lt-will-here-monday-help-so-many-choices.html
I chose the VR10000.
WHy? Warn reputation. Warn rebate for $80 would net cost me down to $490. Engo would cost me less but so much info on the web about them failing. Dont need synthetic, i WANT it(big difference in price). Smittybuilt very popular, but lots of failures too. Many seem to be from water and lack of use over time. Thats me, i will use once in a year but when i need it. im going to need it. Skimp now, regret later. No thanks.
Almost bought a Engo 10000. Smittybuilt wasnt on the list but Superwinch was.
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-g...hidden-winch-install-kinda-lots-pictures.html
you should probably know a little about the winches you are talking about....
the vr10k is not a good winch for our trucks, for on it might not fit in most of the bumpers made for out trucks, its physical size could be too large. also it will be a much slower winch than the vr8000 which is already slower than the M series or other warn series...
the CL add states nib = new in box. besides warn honors warranty's on the winch, not the buyer, i have had 10+ yo winches that i did not buy new and they didnt bat an eye or question anything, i even told them i bought it used of craigslist.
warn hands down makes a better product. and at $400 for a vr8000 today its like he is buying it at the end of last year and getting that rebate, only he is actually saving the time and hassle of having to send in for the rebate. and honestly a winch new or used is not really a big deal, if it was taken care of. if given the choice id buy one used or at the used price
IBallEngineer
New member
A quick google search showed me that was no value, but I have another question. Is this an Asian built unit? I've seen the "Mile Marker" branded Asian units and they were pretty much junk.
And, is 8000lbs enough? Without getting into a crazy debate, winches are rated at their best, which is with one wrap on the spool. Most don't use a snatch block so they are winching with 2 or 3 wraps, bringing the capacity way down. I would think a 3rd gen minimum would be 10K.
I have a 12K hydraulic on my FJ62, 16 yrs of service, no problem.
:couch2:
NateMob
New member
The VR Warns are the same cheap Chinese winches that 10+ brands are now selling. They are just putting their name and warranty on it. Why wouldn't Warn cash in on the cheap market? If you do some digging you will that the VR series is "assembled in USA" all the parts are however sourced overseas.
I have a 10k Engo Synthetic on my 4runner, pulls like a freight train and fits fine.
No tech in this other thread but it was talked about briefly here also.
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/off-roading/151753-winches-engo-e9000s-vs-warn-vr8000.html
I have a 10k Engo Synthetic on my 4runner, pulls like a freight train and fits fine.
No tech in this other thread but it was talked about briefly here also.
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/off-roading/151753-winches-engo-e9000s-vs-warn-vr8000.html
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the great him
Elite Member
what is the GVW of our 4runners? you need a winch that is good for 1.5 times that...our runners dont way 6000lb+ maybe when pulling a big load or trailer with car on it would you need a the pulling power of a 10k... but then that begs the question why are you doing that big of a load some place you would need the bigger winch?
the way winch manufactures get more pulling power out of their winches is by reducing the gear ratio, making them slower. they typically do not put bigger motors on them. -warn is the exception to this with some of their winches, like the xp9.5, it has a bigger motor that gives it a super fast pull and still has a 9500lb pull rating.
even 4 or 5 wraps in you should still be able to pull 4-5000lbs with a 8k winch that should be more than enough to get you out, and if you need more, then yeah pull more like out or use a snatch block(this will require you to pull more line out and it will double the pulling power)
gshadow325
New member
I have not had to use the warn warranty, therefore i have no knowledge if they would honor warranty without proof of purchase. I only know what 99% or any manufacture would require a reciept to the original purchaser. if they honored it for you, thats great but YMMV depending on the repair facility. Wouldnt a reciept for proof of purchase be a piece of mind for when the time comes for warranty?
http://www.warn.com/corporate/images/907/SRCWinchWarr.pdf
"This Warranty applies only to the original purchaser of the winch. To obtain any warranty service, you must
provide WARN with proof of purchase and date of purchase acceptable to WARN, such as a copy of your purchase receipt"
As for fittment, you refer to our trucks meaning 3rd gen? I said i chose the vr10000 for my 4th gen truck. I was not suggesting it to the OP, that might be the confusion. But as for fitting my truck, it does
Just because there is chinese content in the Warn winches doesnt mean its a cheaply made product. What product out there that has 100% US made content anymore? If you look at a wire harness in a 2012 Chevy Tahoe, it will say made in china!
Engo is made entirely in china. Lets say we need warranty on the Engo, one place Vancouver WA. Warn 25 service centers thuout the USA, no including canada Warn Industries - Locate a WARN Authorized Service Centers
Now about the comment on cheap chinese winches and warn slapping their name on it... Trail FX is doing that and so is Quadratec for sure, but Warn, i'm no expert i dont think that is the case here.
I only sound like a freight train, have not tried my warn to pull like a freight train yet LoL
Everywhere i read it said good rule of thumb is to double your GVWR for winch capacity.
Toyota 4Runner - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
says
1st gen 3720
2nd gen 3760
3rd gen 3930
4th gen 4280
5th gen 4400
Thus puts me at a 10k winch and 3rd gens at a 8k winch. I would want more power and not need it, than need more power and not have it. thats just me.
IBallEngineer
New member
Well, I NOW know the prevailing thought is a 3rd gen comes in around 4K lbs. So I agree a 10K winch would be overkill. That said, I view things through altered lens'.
My FJ had and advertised curb weight of 4800 Lbs. , I assure you it weighs closer to 7000 today. My buddy's 1st gen weighed 5900 loaded and ready for a 3 day trail. But that isn't really my issue. A stuck rig requires much more than it's weight to overcome the inertia, is it 1.5 times the weight? Just getting over an obstacle may not require any factor at all, then again, it might.
My hydraulic is a two speed, and yes the slower the better. Who is in a hurry to winch? Not me, it's dangerous, I prefer to go slow. Snatch blocks are HUGE, but I repeat most people don't use them, although they should. I carry one, never used it. But I don't do much mudding, and I'm usually winching smaller vehicles. Don't see too many full size rigs on rock crawling "trails".
So I guess 8K is ok.
:couch2:
the great him
Elite Member
FJ at 7k for a curb weight...? i think you need a new scale... thats around the weight of full sized diesel trucks man...
but i hear you on the slower is better. but some of the winches are just down right painfully slow, especially the XRCs and Mile Markers, and even the Engos. adding a snatch block will also slow that speed down, cutting the speed in half. -imagine cutting the XRCs speed in half, you could build a new rig before that winch would move the truck 10' lol
i love snatch blocks, i carry 2 of them at all times in my rig. they extremely useful, they can be used to double up power on a winch, change direction of the pull ect. imo i think they are very over looked and underused.
i run a xd9000ce warn winch. the only reason i have the 9k winch is i got a killer deal on it, and im also of the mind set that bigger is better. but dimensionally its no bigger than a 8k so it works for me.
IBallEngineer
New member
I should have been clear. FJ62, not FJcruiser. I called it an FJ LONG before the FJ Cruiser existed. Before runners we had CJ's and FJ's.
And a full size diesel weighs more than 7K. A half ton chevy extended cab is over 6K.
:couch2:
NateMob
New member
If you see my build you know i have a penchant for parts of high quality, I also know when to be an educated consumer and not just buy based on an old reputation. I ended up with an Engo after researching and a smoking deal fell into my lap, i could have spent more than double for a warn winch with synthetic. Just didn't seem like the best way to spend an extra $600 though when Engo has a good track record going for them as they build up a better and better brand.
I believe the best buy for a quality winch that is PACKED with features is the TJM Stealth lineup. Take a look at them if you aren't familiar.
zooroadbaja
New member
Im buying the winch for the wrong reason haha I had one on the old rig and never used it, I have a front bumper on the 4Runner now and it just looks empty without one sitting in there. So whatever I buy will probably at the most be used 3 times. So i was looking at the $300-$500 range.
KidVermicious
New member
I think Warn probably still makes the best winch out there, but the VR series isn't it. I thought about an M series, but it came down to an 8000 pound winch with cable vs. a 10,000 pound winch with synthetic for a couple hundred less, and I had to go with the Engo. If I'd had the budget, I would have chosen a higher level Warn, but I think the Engo is the best bang for the buck.
If you're just looking to fill a hole in the bumper, find a coupon or wait for a sale and get a Badlands from Harbor Freight. I don't think there's a cheaper winch out there, and they actually don't get horrible reviews.
If you're just looking to fill a hole in the bumper, find a coupon or wait for a sale and get a Badlands from Harbor Freight. I don't think there's a cheaper winch out there, and they actually don't get horrible reviews.
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zooroadbaja
New member
I've been keeping an eye on the HF ones, or any deal that comes up new or used.
KMAYO
New member
I understand that the winch in the article below is not the winch mentioned by the OP but still an interesting review.
Massive Multi-Winch Shootout - Four Wheeler Magazine
Massive Multi-Winch Shootout - Four Wheeler Magazine
gshadow325
New member
My criteria for the warn vr10000 was external solenoid pack. number of available service centers if i had a issue. My bottom line net cost for my personal unit was under $350 plus $80 rebate. All the other brands, no matter how great, doesnt have the service centers that warn has COMBINED, slight exaggeration maybe
Also if the Warn didnt fit using my budbuilt hidden hitch, i can return it thru my distributor. Engo, its mine i have to deal with it. So there are few reasons why i went warn and not harbor freight.i was going to say go harbor freight then
nevada
Senior Member
Rugged Ridge 15100.01 8, 500Lb Winch with Steel Cable : Amazon.com : Automotive
I currently have one on the front of my truck, and im seriously considering buying another for the 4runner.
also one of the guys I wheel with has one on his jeep. these are great winches for the price.
I currently have one on the front of my truck, and im seriously considering buying another for the 4runner.
also one of the guys I wheel with has one on his jeep. these are great winches for the price.
