Just got a really cool battery...

[Bumbo]

So a friend of mine who is into the DIY electric cars hooked me up with this thing... I'm really tempted to try to use this in some sort of electrical project in my 4Runner but not really sure yet.

It's just a really cool battery but its not really a drop-in thing for your standard 12v applications.... one reason is because its a 24v pack consisting of 6 lithium cells. I think they would refer to this as a 6S1P battery pack.

All I know about it is it came out of a modern production EV, I was told a Fiat 500e with about 5000 miles on it. After some googling I found a picture of the battery module in the chassis. I believe it was manufactured by Bosch/Samsung.

I have some experience with LiPo, LiFePO4, IMR, and a few others but mostly from 18650 and RC stuff. First time tinkering with a large format lithium pack like this.

Going to dig into this over the weekend to see if I can learn more about it before throwing it into the truck and burning it to the floor.

Anyone around here an EV Tech? I am going to sign up at the Fiat forums to see if anyone knows what I am looking at, or if there is some type of spec sheet available.

Just figure I share... not something you see everyday and can't help but want to use it for something in the 4Runner. If it's just not viable ill use it at home for something... probably just keep it around for emergency power.

 

[vanion2]

You could probably run it through a solar charge controller to convert the output to 12V. Or use it as a solar battery for RV applications with an inverter for AC applications which is what I'd probably do once I figured out how many AHr this pack was rated at.

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[BlackWorksInc]

Yeah, basically anything you are gonna do with that is gonna need a step-down converter and a computer controller for charging discharging if that's LiPo

 

[Bumbo]

You could probably run it through a solar charge controller to convert the output to 12V. Or use it as a solar battery for RV applications with an inverter for AC applications which is what I'd probably do once I figured out how many AHr this pack was rated at.

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I need to spend some times looking at different controllers. I used a Genasun MPPT for a small ammo can battery pack along with a small 17ah APC battery which is pretty much my only 12v source not including the 4Runner.

Inverter use sounds awesome too. I have a couple small inverters right now but neither one of then can accept a 24v input.

Side Note: I bought a 600 watt pure sine recently... still for sale at Lowes for 75% off. I tested it out already, seems like a great buy for the price.
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Zamp-Solar-600-Watt-12-VDC-Off-Grid-Inverter/1000079939

I'm trying to find some specs on this thing, but I was told it's a 1.5 kWh pack. If its true, ill be ecstatic.

That said I still need to throw actually test it with a load and just see what happens.

 

[Bumbo]

Yeah, basically anything you are gonna do with that is gonna need a step-down converter and a computer controller for charging discharging if that's LiPo

I was looking at dc to dc buck step-down on Amazon like these for smaller loads... like a ham radio, or to charge up 12v things.

https://www.amazon.com/Nextrox-Conv...489821348&sr=8-20&keywords=dc+to+dc+converter

Not too bad in price... but I don't think I would use it for anything too crazy since its probably not really a high duty cycle item.

Would be nice to do away with any step-down converter and run native 24v stuff just to not have to deal with any efficient losses.

I got it charging up right now... Here is what it looks like under those protective caps. You can see all of the BMS wires and other goodies. I'm sure one is a temperature probe too.

Pack is clearly wired in series with a 6 cell config.

Here is the voltage of just one individual cell... Pretty sure I can rule out LiFePO4 on just that alone.

My buddy cut his cells out of the module/cage that was holding it all together. Here are 4 of them in this picture stripped of all its bits...

Not sure what that items is attached to the negative post...

 

[Bumbo]

Weight

If this is really a 1.5kWh pack, that is pretty impressive for the weight... assuming my math isn't crap that is about 60 amp hours @ 24v or (about 120aH @ 12v)

Here are two 12v 17ah sealed lead acid packs from an old APC unit for comparison. Totaling 17ah @ 24v...

So by the powers of theoretical math and beer... I guess that would mean the lithium pack about 3.5 times more storage density for a similar weight.

But in practice... you can discharge lithium a lot more. Really 50% DOD (depth of discharge) for the lead and 80% for the lithium.

So taking that into account it means the lithium has 5.6 times more density for the weight. Probably not a fair comparison, I should be comparing that to a AGM battery to see how they stack up... but I remember the 100 amp hour AGM was almost 100 pounds...

Either way, still impressive.

Really wish this was a 12v deal so I can just drop it into a regular battery tray and just be done with it lol.

 

[Bumbo]

I guess I was close. I found one for sale on e-bay... I really should check there more often.

24V 102Ah TESTED Bosch Lithium Ion Battery | eBay

MODULE SPECIFICATIONS

Number of cells 6
Construction 6 in-series
Length 11"
Width 7"
Height 6"
Weight 28.5 lbs
Output terminal M6 nut
Amp Hour 75
Total Voltage 24vdc @75ah


CELL SPECIFICATIONS

Cell type Laminate type
Cathode material LiMn2O4 with LiNiO2
Anode material Graphite
Rated capacity (0.3C) 102 Ah
Average voltage 3.8 VDC
Maximum Voltage 4.2VDC
Minimum Voltage 3.0VDC

 

[OzarkRunner]

That's pretty cool. What are the dimensions of the cells? Looks like a prismatic design rather than cylindrical cells. I assume that's an integrated management system in the center stack?
I work for a specialty battery company, although I'm not technical at all. Really cool to see.

 

[vanion2]

I have 2 x 125 AHr AGM batteries that each weight 75 lbs for my RV solar array.

If each of those cells is outputting 4V then you can easily break that pack into two batteries for 12V applications.

Be careful with the discharge limits you were quoting. 80% may be a limit set but if you discharge it that far repeatedly you significantly reduce the number of recharge cycles you will get. The same applies to standard deep cycle batteries and 50%. I have done a lot of research into lithium pack to replace my AGM packs and you have to read the fine print but the data is out there.

Still, getting that for free is awesome and the number of applications you can put that to are pretty sweet.

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[hearno]

I came into this thread hoping to find a new battery for my truck and all I see is a bunch of math. Worst type of thread.

 

[rich045]

all that comes to mind is 1.2 gigawatts lol

 

[BackOff]

The place for E-stuff.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/

 

[Bumbo]

That's pretty cool. What are the dimensions of the cells? Looks like a prismatic design rather than cylindrical cells. I assume that's an integrated management system in the center stack?
I work for a specialty battery company, although I'm not technical at all. Really cool to see.

Its about 7x12x6 inches... about the size of a regular car battery.

Plenty of places to cram something that small.

 

[Bumbo]

I came into this thread hoping to find a new battery for my truck and all I see is a bunch of math. Worst type of thread.

I realize I should have at least put this in the General section... sorry to disappoint.

I guess you need a bit of nerd in you to get jacked about these things... that's a lot of juice in a small and light cube.

I will find a use for this in the 4Runner...

 

[Bumbo]

The place for E-stuff.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/

Thanks man... one to add to the list.

 

[Bumbo]

I have 2 x 125 AHr AGM batteries that each weight 75 lbs for my RV solar array.

If each of those cells is outputting 4V then you can easily break that pack into two batteries for 12V applications.

Be careful with the discharge limits you were quoting. 80% may be a limit set but if you discharge it that far repeatedly you significantly reduce the number of recharge cycles you will get. The same applies to standard deep cycle batteries and 50%. I have done a lot of research into lithium pack to replace my AGM packs and you have to read the fine print but the data is out there.

Still, getting that for free is awesome and the number of applications you can put that to are pretty sweet.

Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk

Exciting... Ya, I confirmed 75% DOD is fine on these packs.

Convert mine to 12v numbers and we have 204 AH and it weights 28lb... vs your 150lb worth of pack.

At this point I am thinking portable of some sort... something I can take in/out of the truck. I camp a lot and lugging heavy gear can get old fast.

I still need to be OBA... and Viair and ARB make 24v air pumps... and my ARB fridge is also 24v native... and its got a built in LVD.

Creative juices are flowing...

 

[ran]

12-17 ?? You must be running some large UPS's. just replaced 12-12 in mine.
_____________
2007 SE V6 titanium

 

[AuSeeker]

I realize I should have at least put this in the General section... sorry to disappoint.

I guess you need a bit of nerd in you to get jacked about these things... that's a lot of juice in a small and light cube.

I will find a use for this in the 4Runner...

I find this quite interesting, I'm glad you posted in this forum section, I would of never seen it otherwise, I never look at the General section that often if at all.

 

[whyowyo]

No experience with a LiPo battery like this, but I'm curious...is it possible to rewire the 6 series cells to 2 parallel banks of 3 in series to double the AH at 12v?

Does it have logic built in, or is it just a dumb battery?

 

[Bumbo]

12-17 ?? You must be running some large UPS's. just replaced 12-12 in mine.
_____________
2007 SE V6 titanium

2 x 12 Volt batteries, that were 17ah each. It came from a SmartUPS 1500 Pure Sine Wave APC.

I come across then at business that have some APC units that were destined for e-waste.

I do my recycling part by stripping all the tasty bits off stuff like that when it comes across my desk... that said I kinda wish I still kept a coupe of those units around. I literally could have just powered one off this battery in an emergency. They have really good high quality pure sine wave inverters in those things that run at 24v...