Lowering my lift?

[atalarico]

Hey all,

I just spent the last few hours replacing my CV axles because the boots were torn. The ones that were on there were the OEM CVs and another forum member and I rebuilt them with nice CVJ silicone long travel inner boots and the regular neoprene outers about 3 years ago. One of the inners was torn, and the outer on the other side's CV was torn.

Let me be clear, I do not wheel hard at all. Sure, I take my 4runner off-road, but no crazy rock crawling, and nothing harder than a 5 or so according to Trail-Damage's rating system. I'm pretty disappointed that the boots didn't seem to last, and I'm thinking that my lift is just too aggressive and putting too much strain on things for what I actually need.

I haven't been too happy with the harshness of my ride in the last couple years either, and I think the combination of Tundra Bilstein 5100's w/ Eibach Springs and either D or E (I forget) rated Yoko Geolanders is a rough combination.

The Bilsteins are getting warrantied anyway (I hope...don't worry, they're Tundra 5100's on my "Tundra") because one of them has a leak according to the last mechanic I took my truck to. If I recall, new 5100s are actually quite nice and soft compared to OMEs and they get harsher as they get older. Is that correct?

I want to figure out if I there's a spring out there that I can put on these 5100s that will drop an inch off my lift and give a softer ride? I was thinking OME 880's, but I've heard mixed things about combining Bilstein and OME products. I'd be totally OK with some rake too, but I think my rear is starting to sag again anyway, so this might level it out or just not even be noticeable.

Thoughts, opinions? I appreciate it!

 

[krenaud33]

Tundra coils? Aren't they softer then Eibachs? Put the struts on the lowest setting.

 

[JBurt]

Post a pic of your cv angle

 

[hawaiian05]

I used to run the same set up, though on my 1st gen Tacoma. I agree that it was too harsh and just a tad too much lift for my needs. As with you, my cv boots were starting to go and I felt the need for a change.
I swapped my coils over to OME 881's and had no regrets. It dropped my front about 1/2" but that was just enough to help the cv boot fins not make contact. Also, the ride was much better. Just a suggestion and worth looking into. Some people with say not to mix the OME and bilsteins, though plenty of people do it and seem to have great results as well.
Good luck!

 

[sport05]

I've really been pleased with my Toltec boss coilovers with the 550lb Eibachs. I've got the front dialed in at around 2 inches of lift. I was closer to 3 and the ride was rough.

 

[atalarico]

Post a pic of your cv angle

I forgot about this thread! Sorry. Here's a pic of the new cv's

 

[atalarico]

I used to run the same set up, though on my 1st gen Tacoma. I agree that it was too harsh and just a tad too much lift for my needs. As with you, my cv boots were starting to go and I felt the need for a change.

I swapped my coils over to OME 881's and had no regrets. It dropped my front about 1/2" but that was just enough to help the cv boot fins not make contact. Also, the ride was much better. Just a suggestion and worth looking into. Some people with say not to mix the OME and bilsteins, though plenty of people do it and seem to have great results as well.

Good luck!

Thanks for the advice! I'm going to go for it then. Probably going to try the 880s if i can but be ok with 881s.

Edited to add: are you using the tundra Bilstein 5100s or the 4Runner ones?
If only Bilstein would get back to me about the warranty. They're dragging their feet hard right now.

 

[JayRolla]

Been driving on torn front cv boots for about 4 years now, not a sound, work great, have pulled, inspected, cleaned and regreased a few times when I was in there working. I have two used oems with good boots in garage waiting for them to fail. I keep one in truck when I go wheeling just in case. So far been working out pretty well.

 

[atalarico]

Been driving on torn front cv boots for about 4 years now, not a sound, work great, have pulled, inspected, cleaned and regreased a few times when I was in there working. I have two used oems with good boots in garage waiting for them to fail. I keep one in truck when I go wheeling just in case. So far been working out pretty well.

Yeah, I'm not super concerned about my CV boots now that I just replaced them again. I'm just hoping that if I lower my lift a bit it'll improve two things; ride quality and cv angle. Sounds like it'll do both, so I'm just trying to narrow it down to whether I should:
a.) Get 5100's that are made for the 4runner with OME 88x(either 880 or 881)
b.) Get 5100's that are made for the Tundra (again) with the OME 88x spring

I'm wondering if the fact that the 5100's I have are harsher because they are made for the Tundra, or if it really has more to do with the spring.

 

[JayRolla]

Yeah, I'm not super concerned about my CV boots now that I just replaced them again. I'm just hoping that if I lower my lift a bit it'll improve two things; ride quality and cv angle. Sounds like it'll do both, so I'm just trying to narrow it down to whether I should:
a.) Get 5100's that are made for the 4runner with OME 88x(either 880 or 881)
b.) Get 5100's that are made for the Tundra (again) with the OME 88x spring

I'm wondering if the fact that the 5100's I have are harsher because they are made for the Tundra, or if it really has more to do with the spring.

I run the OME sport comforts and 881's. It was pretty tight at first, now with bumper and winch its kind of soft, but I can tell they may tire out quickly now.

My buddy always says my ride feels better than his toytec coilovers, he says its just to rough.

 

[absalom]

I've come to the conclusion that as a community, we're lifting these trucks unnecessarily high. I've also been trying to lower my truck as of late, and have taken several steps so far. I've dropped my front perch down a notch, downsized my tires, shortened my body lift. As a result, my truck feels much more stable, does better in nearly EVERY situation offroad, and is far more comfortable and smooth to drive.

I dealt with the classic 3"/5" (front & rear) lift for 2 years with my last truck. I dealt with the crappy road manners, horrible jarring, and unstable high speeds. I put up with significant loss of power from my 33" E range tires. With every step I take towards a more stock-like geometry, I'm rewarded with a far better driving truck. I now sit at about 2" lift in the front, and 4.5" in the rear. I look forward to replacing my LC coils with Superflexes, and seeing what a 2"/3" lift feels like.

Finally, let's talk tires. Whether or not folks on this, and other, forums care to admit it, load range plays a significant role in the ride quality of a vehicle. The stiffness of a sidewall, with it's various plies, is the main factor. Also, the psi in our tires can massively affect ride quality. I'm not sure where we got the 35 psi rule of thumb that so many of us subscribe to (my past self included), but running tires at/or near OEM recommended psi greatly improves ride comfort. I originally ran my Duratracs at 35 psi, I've since deflated them to 30 psi to the benefit of all my passengers.

Not my most coherent post, but I'd really like us as a forum to come together and encourage new members to at least consider well thought out, milder lifts. Their on- and off-road journeys will benefit greatly!

 

[atalarico]

I run the OME sport comforts and 881's. It was pretty tight at first, now with bumper and winch its kind of soft, but I can tell they may tire out quickly now.

My buddy always says my ride feels better than his toytec coilovers, he says its just to rough.

Good to know. I don't have a bumper and winch, and I sort of ruled having one out last year, and I was about to type "...and I'm never going to get one". That said though, I ruled it out because of cost (Addicted's plate bumper), and that isn't really an issue anymore because of a fancy new job I got that doubled my salary. Maybe I should stick with the 881s in case I do end up getting the bumper I've always dreamed of?

Strut-wise, I've heard good things about the OME sport comforts. I'm only going with Bilstein if they warranty them for me. If not, **** them and their heavily caveat'd warranty policy and crap product. Don't get me started on how infuriating the warranty caveats are with all of this equipment that is so clearly marketed for off-road and lifts but then suddenly isn't when it's not engineered to put up with it.

 

[BrandonF]

I agree. Anything above 2.5" in the front starts degrading on and offroad performance.

 

[atalarico]

I've come to the conclusion that as a community, we're lifting these trucks unnecessarily high. I've also been trying to lower my truck as of late, and have taken several steps so far. I've dropped my front perch down a notch, downsized my tires, shortened my body lift. As a result, my truck feels much more stable, does better in nearly EVERY situation offroad, and is far more comfortable and smooth to drive.

I dealt with the classic 3"/5" (front & rear) lift for 2 years with my last truck. I dealt with the crappy road manners, horrible jarring, and unstable high speeds. I put up with significant loss of power from my 33" E range tires. With every step I take towards a more stock-like geometry, I'm rewarded with a far better driving truck. I now sit at about 2" lift in the front, and 4.5" in the rear. I look forward to replacing my LC coils with Superflexes, and seeing what a 2"/3" lift feels like.

Finally, let's talk tires. Whether or not folks on this, and other, forums care to admit it, load range plays a significant role in the ride quality of a vehicle. The stiffness of a sidewall, with it's various plies, is the main factor. Also, the psi in our tires can massively affect ride quality. I'm not sure where we got the 35 psi rule of thumb that so many of us subscribe to (my past self included), but running tires at/or near OEM recommended psi greatly improves ride comfort. I originally ran my Duratracs at 35 psi, I've since deflated them to 30 psi to the benefit of all my passengers.

Not my most coherent post, but I'd really like us as a forum to come together and encourage new members to at least consider well thought out, milder lifts. Their on- and off-road journeys will benefit greatly!

I am totally with you on all of this! I completely agree on everything, especially the load range on the tires. My Geolanders are a D and I was never given any explanation or warning from Discount about what a harsh ride I was in for (especially when they're properly inflated!). After figuring all of the strut/spring combo stuff out, next on my list are a set of C rated Duratracs, and I really think that'll help.

My rear has settled and has lowered quite a bit (and I think it's actually a negative rake now), and I think I'm fine to not touch that and just lower my front first. The rear jumps around for sure, but I want to start with the direction I'm heading now and see if it becomes more tolerable after the rest of the ride smooths out.

One of the experiences that really galvanized my skepticism of the necessity of my lift and the ride quality was getting a ride from a stock 3rd gen back to cell service so I could call in help to rescue my very stuck 4runner. This guys ride was so god damn smooth through a pretty rough 4x4 road (like 5 out of 10 in difficulty). I was envious, and that was 3 years ago!

Oh, and I didn't go crazy with the first lift either, but we unintentionally got 3.5" out of the front with this combo. No body lift either, so I didn't go that far (even though that would have made installing the rear lift so much easier!).

Again, it all depends on what you're doing with the 4runner. I *thought* I'd be doing crazier things with it, but I think I would have just as well served by a 1.5" lift on the 4x4 roads I've been on.

 

[kolelt]

I have bilstein 5100 Tundra on 2nd perch with eibachs and superflex in rear with 5100. Offroad it handles good. It's not fox or king set up. On road, its little on the stiff side. I think I'm at 3.75-4" in back and 3"-3.25" up front without any weight. Its a daily driver. But for some reason I like it. I can't see my self going lower. Maybe, maybe dropping down a perch. But its such a hassle lol. I'm planning on getting a savage Offroad front bumper. So it should help a little. But its going to be litte stuff because when lifting aren't the coils on the stiffer side because its lifted ?

 

[BrandonF]

I think it's fine to lift the rear 4+". It's just the front suspension that can't handle much lift. The problem is that when you lift ifs, you don't really gain any travel. You're just changing the point in the travel that the vehicle sits at at static ride height. When you go 3+", you get so close to the maximum droop that you end up with no down travel. As a result, the suspension cannot extend into potholes, etc. it can only compress.

 

[KidVermicious]

Three words: O. M. E.

Running the light duties and Nitrochargers on the wife's '99 (no extra weight) and I love them. Just enough lift to get your rocker panels away from the rocks, and they ride like a dream once you get off pavement. No drama, no bouncing or sloshing, and not too rough or fidgety either, you just glide. I've ridden in a couple different trucks with Toytec kits, Bilsteins and Tundra springs and what have you, and it's my opinion that for moderate lift and light wheeling the OME is the best thing going.

 

[atalarico]

Three words: O. M. E.

Running the light duties and Nitrochargers on the wife's '99 (no extra weight) and I love them. Just enough lift to get your rocker panels away from the rocks, and they ride like a dream once you get off pavement. No drama, no bouncing or sloshing, and not too rough or fidgety either, you just glide. I've ridden in a couple different trucks with Toytec kits, Bilsteins and Tundra springs and what have you, and it's my opinion that for moderate lift and light wheeling the OME is the best thing going.

That's about as resounding of a recommendation if I've heard. If Billie won't warranty the ones I have, then I'm going to just get OME 90004 shocks and some 890 or 891 springs (recommendations on which are welcome!) and be done with it.

 

[Road Bull]

Great thread. I am considering all the same. I have no lift at the moment. I don't want much of a lift either. I am leaning towards the mid-travel / mild lift option. I just want to be able to clear my 265/75/16s with a shrockworks bumper up front. Whenever people talk about lifts, especially mild lifts, I don't see too much mentioned about 2" plus the added weight of a aftermarket front bumper and such.

I have looked at OME as an option, I just don't want to start drooping due to front lift not being able to keep up with the added weight.

I would love King / Icon / Fox, but I think that might be a bit too expensive from my vantage point. From my calculations, I might lean more towards a Toytec lift to be able to run the Coilovers up front set up for 2" lift and run either 906s or something else in back. I don't think I would want to go anything taller than 3" for sure. I just want a mild lift that wont sag or ride like complete poop.

 

[atalarico]

Great thread. I am considering all the same. I have no lift at the moment. I don't want much of a lift either. I am leaning towards the mid-travel / mild lift option. I just want to be able to clear my 265/75/16s with a shrockworks bumper up front. Whenever people talk about lifts, especially mild lifts, I don't see too much mentioned about 2" plus the added weight of a aftermarket front bumper and such.

I have looked at OME as an option, I just don't want to start drooping due to front lift not being able to keep up with the added weight.

I would love King / Icon / Fox, but I think that might be a bit too expensive from my vantage point. From my calculations, I might lean more towards a Toytec lift to be able to run the Coilovers up front set up for 2" lift and run either 906s or something else in back. I don't think I would want to go anything taller than 3" for sure. I just want a mild lift that wont sag or ride like complete poop.

Let me know what you find out if it's outside of the thread too! I'm going to drive over to Slee Offroad tomorrow and chat them up to see what they think. I've heard good things about them, so hopefully they can take 10 minutes to shoot the breeze about this.

I wonder if we're starting a new movement here. Lift your 4runner*!

*but keep it reasonable or else you'll regret it down the road!