Shock and strut question, Fox content etc

[Mendoncyclesmith]

Hey all, so one of my YT channels (not Toyota focused) has a modern Tundra that the suspension sion needed replacement. He did some of the modern, "smart" Fox stuff, and was amazed at how much better it handled chunky choppy stuff, think, trophy truck railing through whoops in the desert, the wheels moving wildly but the body being really calm.

Turns out that level Fox stuff isn't offered in fitments for 3rd gens like ours, bummer.

Best they offer is their Performance line, and I can likely get a bit of discount due to being a Fox dealer on their bike side of things. Cool, one point for going that direction.

But I'm more focused on dropping in something that will render the biggest improvement towards that smoothing effect the really nice stuff gets you, and I'm assuming the Performance will just be moire like everything else on offer, Bilstein whomever.

Currently running maybe 8 year old, 2" lift, OME stuff. It works, but it's definitely shuddery jittery on extended runs of rougher stuff at modest speeds (think beat up dirt roads at 25/30mph).

Is there another brand out there that's offering something with more tech built in, than standard replacement level stuff? Do I need to do big mods to the truck to get anything in that range from anyone?

Hoping to do this as part of a full stature reset on the old girl, I've done my FAFO phase with excessive leveling block lifts etc and would like to lower it slightly, and make it ride like a mahogany ChrisCraft cruiser on a still lake surface...

 

[phattyduck]

There are no electrically adjustable options out there for the 3rd gen application. Too small of a market at this point.

You need a 2.5" progressively valved shock, good bump stops and the right tire pressure for max comfort off road. Make sure your bushings are all in good shape (arms, links, body mounts, etc.). Remove your front swaybar and leave the rear stock to reduce side-to-side head toss. 2" lift is just right for slightly more compression than droop travel with stock arms/geometry.

Then go send it.

-Charlie

 

[Mendoncyclesmith]

There are no electrically adjustable options out there for the 3rd gen application. Too small of a market at this point.

You need a 2.5" progressively valved shock, good bump stops and the right tire pressure for max comfort off road. Make sure your bushings are all in good shape (arms, links, body mounts, etc.). Remove your front swaybar and leave the rear stock to reduce side-to-side head toss. 2" lift is just right for slightly more compression than droop travel with stock arms/geometry.

Then go send it.

-Charlie

Thanks Charlie. I figured that was the case, too small a market. But with all the overlanders out there running 3rd Gens, I didn't know what might exist in darker corners of the market. The internet only pushes paying advertisers products for the most part, so I never assume my searches are truly "complete".

Yeah, already got the whole front end rebuilt, new bushings, LBJ (OEM of course), new JBA UCA's, alignment, she drives great.

Interesting on removing the sway bar, I debated that before getting the bushings redone, and it sounded like most opinions were that doing so would give better flex, but would seriously impact on road manners and handling.

So will any shocks that are progressively valved, (I'm assuming this is in the same camp as "positionally sensitive"?) be called out as such?

Appreciate the input sir!

 

[phattyduck]

Yeah, already got the whole front end rebuilt, new bushings, LBJ (OEM of course), new JBA UCA's, alignment, she drives great.

Interesting on removing the sway bar, I debated that before getting the bushings redone, and it sounded like most opinions were that doing so would give better flex, but would seriously impact on road manners and handling.

So will any shocks that are progressively valved, (I'm assuming this is in the same camp as "positionally sensitive"?) be called out as such?

Appreciate the input sir!

Good to hear the front end is good. I had a nice (and somewhat unexpected) improvement in comfort/control with new rear link bushings too. A secondary 'jitter' feeling disappeared.

Removing the front bar definitely has an impact on cornering and road manners. But it also means that the two front sides no longer 'talk' to each other with each bump and the roll resistance at the front of the truck no longer tosses the chassis side to side as much with hits on one side of the truck. It is a comfort vs. handling tradeoff.

Look up progressive vs. linear vs. digressive shock valving. That has an effect on the feel in the 'main' travel of the shock in 'normal' situations. Position sensitivity is another level (either internal or external bypass type technology) that changes the damping at the top or bottom of travel, generally to stiffen up at the end of travel in either direction. Quality (softer) bump stops can do SOME of the work during compression, but only increase the spring rate (not dampening, which is also helpful) and lead to 'bouncing' off the bottom of big hits. Hydro bumps help with that - but again, not bolt-on or easy to get right.

I run King 2.5" shocks F/R, 1.75" front lift, 2.5" rear lift, all poly bushings (suspension, steering, body mounts), A mix of Durobumps and PerryParts bump stops, 32" tires and 20-22psi for medium to high speed off roading. This is for 30-75mph work doing stage rally course car (safety) work on dirt roads. The only thing left that I want to do is the the Eimkeith rear PCK to reduce some body roll without stiffening swaybars. Going beyond that setup would be a big custom project - but I'm not building a desert race truck.

-Charlie

 

[turbo8]

You can make the front DCS Fox shocks from the Taco work on the 4runner. It requires re drilling the upper mounting holes.

 

[Mendoncyclesmith]

Awesome, thanks again, both of you.

Think I'll leave my sway bar in place till I get the other things sorted out, it's pretty highland I do mostly paved road, so less stability when I'm already on stilts of a sort, sounds sketchy/scary. We have deer around here, evasive maneuvers are a thing, though my ARB out front already obliterated one without so much as scratching the powder coat, so it's more about automated reflexes than intentional driving. I got her these to give her some fighter ace street cred...

Your set up sounds like what I'm working towards, thanks for the breakdown.

Turbo, so, that's a lot of $ to blow only to start drilling! That said, I fully grasp how it's possible to do something like this and retain every ounce of safety, integrity and performance, too. So is this just "different hole positions in the mounting surface" or does doing so deviate from where stock holes and hardware would be, in a modern Taco?

I've seen enough modification (and do it in my bicycle mechanics all the time) that this is seriously intriguing if it's doable without creating a mess, or danger for myself later on.

Random aside on that? Would running that sort of thing out front, and "dumber" shocks out back, create some oddball mullet as far as drivability and handling?

 

[calimobber]

I run King 2.5" shocks F/R, 1.75" front lift, 2.5" rear lift, all poly bushings (suspension, steering, body mounts), A mix of Durobumps and PerryParts bump stops, 32" tires and 20-22psi for medium to high speed off roading. This is for 30-75mph work doing stage rally course car (safety) work on dirt roads. The only thing left that I want to do is the the Eimkeith rear PCK to reduce some body roll without stiffening swaybars. Going beyond that setup would be a big custom project - but I'm not building a desert race truck.

-Charlie

Im running the same Kings F/R idk my lift at this point since ive changed to many little things but id guess around 2" or so. I also have the PerryParts bump stops. So far Im pretty happy with the setup. I removed my front sway bars as well but I leep consider putting them back when im on those long highway runs. Its not bad but it noticeable.

 

[turbo8]

Yeah, if you don't want to modify anything you will be stuck with the fox performance series version.

Fox part number 880-06-409 are for the 1st gen Tacoma (95.5-2004) which shares all sorts of common parts with the 3rd gen 4runner.The top 3 mounting bolts are clocked about ~15 degrees off from the 4runner on the Fox top hat. You would need to make new mounting holes in the 4runner coil bucket or drill and tap new mounting holes in the Fox top hat.

 

[2TH4IST]

I too ditched the front sway bar, and honestly, I don't notice the difference except offroading. I've driven curvy roads to the trails and it still handles great. But I did actually put in a stiffer rear swaybar, that might help some.

No idea where I'm at lift wise. But I have radflo front w/resiviours w/650 springs and radflo 2", 10" stroke shocks w/resiviours, outboarded with lc80 springs. It's amazing how much better it drives with the shocks outboarded. And offroad fast stuff is smooth. On trail I run 15psi.

Also watch some reviews on the taco fox set up, iirc they were not impressed with it.

I think the go to is king, radflo, locked, ads ect.

Just a FYI, radflo, when ordered will custom valve the shocks to what you want.

Which reminds me I need to get them revalved again, little stiffer in the front, and maybe 2x more in the rear.

Also run perry parts bumps front and rear. Might go to durobumps in the rear or hydro bumps in the rear. Then again I might have messed up the axle mounts (fully compressed vs bump stop length).

 

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

There are no electrically adjustable options out there for the 3rd gen application. Too small of a market at this point.

-Charlie

I know you are talking aftermarket... but TEMS was a rare factory option in Japan! Just an electronically controlled single damping adjustment really.

Most have been repalceds with regular shocks by now.

Later this year I intend to pull the trigger on the Dobinsons MRR kit. I know it doesn't have the brand strength of Fox etc but they offer a full bolt on kit with high speed / low speed bump adjustment as well as rebound, so I am hoping that I can get a smooth, stable ride dialed in. I did consider some Fox remote resevior ones a couple of years back, but the way they are clocked means drilling extra top mount holes... and the top mounts are weak enough already.

I'd personally not delete sway bars.. they offer stability on road when you need it most, but mine spends more time on road than off, and I drive fairly fast...

I ran ToyTec Boss for 10 years or so until they failed, - non rebuildable.. Ride was a bit firm.

 

[Mendoncyclesmith]

Thanks all.

I have a lot of info to chew on and work through, it's appreciated.

Yeah. Fox holds no cache for me, if another brand offered similar options, I'm just as interested.

Good to hear about the sway bar delete. I'll play round with that later, once I sort out ride height more fully.