Modifications you regret

[mrblah]

Good list!

Skids plates and sliders alone with decent weight AT tires have practically no effect on anything though. Maybe 1mpg. But yeah there is cost to anything.

For RTT, I can see the value in the desert. We do not and will not camp in the Sonoran desert (Utah is totally fine). This costs us some really nice opportunities. An RTT would be the solution to that but then the cost of RTT and the need to bother with storing it, etc, makes it easier for me to just wave off those camping opportunities and stick to day trips in the desert.

That's us. Others will see things differently.

I'm not going to lie, 99 percent of the time i rather just rent a motel room, and get a good nights sleep when I can, because I figure I have to get gas and food anyways.

Thats why I laugh when I go to motels and hotels, and I see vehicles w/ RTT's sitting in the parking lot...ROFL.

 

[Bayou_Pro]

....

 

[Bayou_Pro]

Kings/ICON/Fox: maintenance costs can go through the roof.

Why do you say this? Other then the very occasional rebuild what else is there? Also rebuilds are quite cheap and easy to do yourself if you are handy.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MAST4R]

Why do you say this? Other then the very occasional rebuild what else is there? Also rebuilds are quite cheap and easy to do yourself if you are handy.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's my intention if I go that route. But a lot of people ship out for rebuilding so thats roughly 400+shipping costs.

I have read all sorts of things about how long it takes between rebuilds depending on many factors. Apparently, it is very unusual to go over 40k with any actual use. With lots of people saying 15, 20, 25.

But you never know about use or abuse and maintanance like shaft protection etc.

Apparently spherical bearings though easy to replace go out all the time. That is on the minor gripes side of things.

I would love to get my hands on used and done shock for training.

One reason I am looking at Dobinsons MTs is that I trust them more as the Australian companies are more focused on outback use and endurance than on performance.

 

[Hydguy]

Good list!

Skids plates and sliders alone with decent weight AT tires have practically no effect on anything though. Maybe 1mpg. But yeah there is cost to anything.

For RTT, I can see the value in the desert. We do not and will not camp in the Sonoran desert (Utah is totally fine). This costs us some really nice opportunities. An RTT would be the solution to that but then the cost of RTT and the need to bother with storing it, etc, makes it easier for me to just wave off those camping opportunities and stick to day trips in the desert.

That's us. Others will see things differently.

The rule of thumb I learned when I had my TJ was when adding weight is that you lose approximately 1 MPG per 100lbs of added weight. SO if you add 150lbs of skids and extra tire weight, you will lose about 1.5MPG.
Is it exact? Probably not, but its just something you can use to give you a ballpark idea of what to expect, except when putting things like a RTT on which is not only extra weight, but extra wind resistance, so it can have a larger impact on your MPG.

 

[ayeyothisiskyle]

I think the general concensus is what works for someone else might not work for you.

SO before you decide to part ways with your hard earned money, realize that everything you do to your vehicle is all about compromise. You have to see what's important to you and weigh the pros and cons.

Cons of popular mods:

RTT: dead weight, can't park in garages. Off vehicle storage is a PITA, loss of mpg, wind noise.

Kings/ICON/Fox: maintenance costs can go through the roof.

Big tires: lose of MPG, transmission hunting.

Sliders/armor/winch: dead weight, suspension sag, loss of MPG

Light bars: can't use them on road unless you like Johnny law to notice you, theft magnet, wind noise.

Fridge: theft magnet, requires upgrade electrical/battery, dead weight

dual battery setup: dead weight, high initial costs.

CB/HAM setup: theft magnet, tuning, licensing, etc.

Drawers: loss of versatility, lack of off vehicle storage, dead weight, loss of mpg.

audio/stereo: high initial costs, loss of hearing at old age.

If you notice, most of the cons is added weight. IT all adds up. So don't be surprised if you end up with a 6,000 lb slug w/ 12mpg fuel efficiency.

Great list. I always tell people just take the truck out stock and see what it can and can't do OR what you feel comfortable doing with the stock equipment. Then, you can judge what should go on your vehicle. There are many things on our trucks that are probably overkill, but make you feel better when you have them or have to use them.

Build slow, do your research, ask questions like this thread. Also, lifestyles change. People get older, have kids, get lazy. The use of the vehicle changes. It'll wholly depend on what you need it to do at the moment.

I'm a cheap sucker. I hate buying things twice so I scour the classifieds and wait for deals. I have a list on a google spreadsheet to track everything from buying price and selling price of mods, OICs, engine air filter changes, cabin air filter changes, and things I want vs things I might need. Next on my list is a snorkel. Dusty and silty roads down here in CA makes me change air filters more frequently than others. If I can help mitigate that somehow, I can do that. Budgeted it in and all I have to do is order it.

Why do you say this? Other then the very occasional rebuild what else is there? Also rebuilds are quite cheap and easy to do yourself if you are handy.

Rebuild kits are $30/shock. $120 for all 4. Plus down time for vehicle. (this is what is expensive) Usually, if you use them, new shafts for the rears are $50. $100 for the rears.

Rebuild places near me cost around $120/shock.

 

[MAST4R]

I'm a cheap sucker. .

Well, you have done pretty well looking at your mods list!

How long have you had those Kings and how have they treated you?

 

[ayeyothisiskyle]

Well, you have done pretty well looking at your mods list!

How long have you had those Kings and how have they treated you?

Buy once, cry once. I learned that with my old 3-series. I'm cheap in a sense that I dont want to buy mid-tier to "save-money" and not be happy, then inevitably buy what I wanted. If you actually use things, it will save you money in the long run to purchase quality.

Kings are wonderful. I've had them for just over a year. I swapped front springs for 650# and it feels a lot better. There are a lot of desert roads where I go and I got the itch for higher speeds. 40-50mph on dirt roads is sketch on stock suspension, not to mention on spacer lift (which was done because $100 was a cheap hold over until I found a good deal on kings. When I did get my kings, it was literally night and day. Impacts weren't as hard, and it gobbles up smaller dips. I wanted Fox because I wanted to tune low and high speed, but I read everywhere, customer service was iffy and availability was a toss up. I never wanted Icons because I have heard horror stories about them and a lot of my friends who went with Icon, are now running King.

 

[MAST4R]

Buy once, cry once. I learned that with my old 3-series. I'm cheap in a sense that I dont want to buy mid-tier to "save-money" and not be happy, then inevitably buy what I wanted. If you actually use things, it will save you money in the long run to purchase quality.

.

Yeah, same here. Thankfully, I learned that on a vehicle for which there were almost no options and no way to really waste money

On a 4R, on the other hand, one can spend a fortune playing with suspensions, roof racks, you name it.

What valving on your kings? Custom or off the shelf, 4R? How are they tuned if the latter is the case?

 

[mrblah]

Why do you say this? Other then the very occasional rebuild what else is there? Also rebuilds are quite cheap and easy to do yourself if you are handy.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Its pretty much the downtime associated with the rebuild, and labor costs of mounting and dismounting the shocks, plus the cost of the rebuild. Also, those spherical joints that go out all the time, costs 50 dollars plus each....lol.

Unfortunately, for me I'm a renter so I can't do any vehicle maintenance on my own, or leave the vehicle on stands.

So when it times come to rebuild, its going to be costly for me, unless my living situation changes.

:crybaby:

 

[epjfsa]

I've done almost zero mods to the 4runner except head unit, modest speaker replacements, and brighter LED bulbs in the tailgate. I regret neither, and I also don't regret keeping it stock otherwise.

I learned my lessons with my '97 M3 when it was my daily driver.

-High end coilovers: Ride sucked
-Urethane bushings: Ride sucked
-High end summer tires when 98% of driving was on the road: Ride sucked

Unless you NEED to modify the suspension for more than appearance, think hard about it. There's a chance you'll outgrow it....

 

[arehman11]

I've done almost zero mods to the 4runner except head unit, modest speaker replacements, and brighter LED bulbs in the tailgate. I regret neither, and I also don't regret keeping it stock otherwise.

I learned my lessons with my '97 M3 when it was my daily driver.

-High end coilovers: Ride sucked
-Urethane bushings: Ride sucked
-High end summer tires when 98% of driving was on the road: Ride sucked

Unless you NEED to modify the suspension for more than appearance, think hard about it. There's a chance you'll outgrow it....

When it comes to cars I absolutely agree with suspension changes making things worse. However I find that my 4Runner rides better with 5100’s and Dobinson springs than it did stock.

EDIT: Thought about what I said a bit and wanted to elaborate on what I meant worse. My physical ride never got worse as I stuck with oem bushings on all my cars, but what I didn't like was the noises that were associated with coilovers on cars making my luxury cars sound like cheap cars on the inside. I never had noise issues with springs/struts though. Actually, I haven't left suspension alone on any car I have ever owned or bike.

 

[jrandom]

I agree for most sliders I have seen but I definitely do not regret getting powdercoated Shrock sliders. Looks like an OEM part.

Underneath, shows less than I thought it would plus spraying scratches is easy.

I have their stepslider with powder coat, I love the design and protection. like [MENTION=103801]sn_85[/MENTION] mentioned, their powdercoat was cheap, the thing is I have been painting over them every spring with lol “rust converter” rattle can anyway. All the nooks and crannies are rusting, I wash after snowstorms to help keep it from happening, still does. The things are pretty bomber, not like the scaling is going to cause any structural issues at least during my lifetime, I just don’t want it to get to the point where it starts flaking the coat up.

I learned my lessons with my '97 M3 when it was my daily driver.

-High end coilovers: Ride sucked
-Urethane bushings: Ride sucked
-High end summer tires when 98% of driving was on the road: Ride sucked

Unless you NEED to modify the suspension for more than appearance, think hard about it. There's a chance you'll outgrow it....

I don’t at all regret dumping money on high end suspension, only the brand I chose. Even with the difference in feel from “raising the height” 2 inches, this truck rides so much better, stays flatter in corners, sucks up whoops, nose dive is much more subtle in panic stops, hands down to me, was worth the expense.

 

[ayeyothisiskyle]

What valving on your kings? Custom or off the shelf, 4R? How are they tuned if the latter is the case?

Stock valving. I plan to tune it when I need the rebuild. Every so often, I turn the clicks to see if there is a difference. It mostly depends on how much weight I have on a given trip. I read somewhere that the first 3-4 clicks of the adjusters on kings "tune" lower speed stuff. I found that 2 clicks + from 0 provide me with the best comfort/handling on-road. I think with my usual slim camping setup (e.g. cooler, 5gal water, 5 gal fuel, pantry box, recovery, and clothes) 17 clicks is where I find myself. I think there are 28 clicks to full dampening.

How King Compression Adjusters Work | AccuTune Off-Road

 

[Bayou_Pro]

-High end coilovers: Ride sucked

Unless you NEED to modify the suspension for more than appearance, think hard about it. There's a chance you'll outgrow it....

While I can understand what you are saying from a sports car world, this doesn't necessarily hold true on the 4runner and other offroad vehicles. Ride in a 4runner with a set of Kings or Fox and then tell me what you think!!! They are amazing!!




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ayeyothisiskyle]

I've done almost zero mods to the 4runner except head unit, modest speaker replacements, and brighter LED bulbs in the tailgate. I regret neither, and I also don't regret keeping it stock otherwise.

I learned my lessons with my '97 M3 when it was my daily driver.

-High end coilovers: Ride sucked
-Urethane bushings: Ride sucked
-High end summer tires when 98% of driving was on the road: Ride sucked

Unless you NEED to modify the suspension for more than appearance, think hard about it. There's a chance you'll outgrow it....

M3 coilovers serve a completely different purpose vs truck coilovers.

Edit: To elaborate, M3/sports car c/os stiffen up the ride in an attempt to keep all 4 tires on the tarmac. (Usually a track that has minimal bumps and harsh dips.) It firms up everything to keep everything flat and tight. In a truck c/o, it is meant to be taken off road where there are always changing conditions. New whups, dips, corrugations. In a higher speed situation, you want the c/os to take the impact so not to relate that change in driving surface to the cabin, attempting to keep it as flat as possible. In truck c/os, they are more or less "softer" to take the bumps and etc. before they translate the impact to the cab.

 

[Pathfinder5243]

They just don't do the leg work with design and engineering. My first set of coilovers leaked after 10 days and Icon wanted me to send them back to have them rebuilt instead of replacing them. The dust cap for the UCA's come off once the suspension is at full droop ripping the sticky and exposing the uniball. And lastly the rear lower shock skids move left to righ no matter how tight you have the shock bolt. They got knocked loose and ate through my shock body and damaged the lower links.

 

[mynameistory]

Cheap lights for sure, I went mid grade with Extreme LED and Lifetime LED and wouldn't do so again. The Lifetime is much better than the Extreme LED IMHO but both are short life and rust like crazy. (My Extreme LED mounting bolts and brackets rusted in 3 weeks) Plus the light output is much lower, You can buy a smaller Baja Designs light bar and get more light output.

Also roof rack mounted lighting. Wouldn't even consider that again. Lights on the bumper and/or ditch lights are better.

I'm looking at the Extreme LED X6S bar now (38"). Other than the rusting brackets/bolts and mid-tier power, did you find any other problems with it? I planned on making my own brackets and replacing everything with stainless hardware anyway.

It's the only bar (at my desired price point) with a small enough profile to tuck into my front fairing neatly. The fairing also has a little lip in front that the bar can tuck behind. I'm hoping that this will mitigate wind noise and hood glare, which seem to be the only complaints about roof mounted lighting. Any other advice you can share?

And I'd love the performance of a Rigid or Baja Designs, but I just can't justify that price point. Especially for something so easy to steal.

 

[4runnin4mylife]

I'm looking at the Extreme LED X6S bar now (38"). Other than the rusting brackets/bolts and mid-tier power, did you find any other problems with it? I planned on making my own brackets and replacing everything with stainless hardware anyway.

It's the only bar (at my desired price point) with a small enough profile to tuck into my front fairing neatly. The fairing also has a little lip in front that the bar can tuck behind. I'm hoping that this will mitigate wind noise and hood glare, which seem to be the only complaints about roof mounted lighting. Any other advice you can share?

And I'd love the performance of a Rigid or Baja Designs, but I just can't justify that price point. Especially for something so easy to steal.

I chose Extreme LED lightbar because of the fit and pricepoint also! I was fitting it inside a cutout on my C4 lopro bumper. I have used my lightbar quite a bit and i have liked it a lot. It's the best (most expensive) light i have owned, so as mentioned above I am sure the high dollar lights are even better. My main reason for going Extreme LED is if your T4R setup changes you don't have $1200 in a light that doesn't fit your need, etc. Those were my reasons for going with Extreme LED, and I'm a buy once cry once kinda guy MOST of the time.

 

[KingTaco]

I'm looking at the Extreme LED X6S bar now (38"). Other than the rusting brackets/bolts and mid-tier power, did you find any other problems with it? I planned on making my own brackets and replacing everything with stainless hardware anyway.

It's the only bar (at my desired price point) with a small enough profile to tuck into my front fairing neatly. The fairing also has a little lip in front that the bar can tuck behind. I'm hoping that this will mitigate wind noise and hood glare, which seem to be the only complaints about roof mounted lighting. Any other advice you can share?

And I'd love the performance of a Rigid or Baja Designs, but I just can't justify that price point. Especially for something so easy to steal.

I almost bought the Extreme for my lo-pro C4 bumper, but ended up with a bar from CaliRaised (they are on the forum also). Price was very similar at first glance, but CaliRaised price includes brackets, wiring, and shipping. Signing up for their email list also gets you 5% off, and their light was brighter. Just throwing it out there.