thennen
New member
He has 8-9 days total, I believe. He has 5 days minimum just driving there and back.
National Parks Trip: Fly and Rent or Drive 4Runner Cross Country
- Thread starter RnrVA
- Start date
Sp00ner
New member
8-9 Days total was my understanding, and he's coming from quite a distance.
You've got at ~2 days each way depending on your drive, which leaves 5 days for 3 parks. I just cant agree that 5 days split among those 3 parks (assuming you haven't been there before) is anywhere close to enough time to have a meaningful visit at any one of them, let alone all three.
Especially with RMNP being full 500 mile day away from YS or GT. If it's his first time in Yellowstone, 5 days is barely enough as it is.
Just to clear things up. Plan is below:
Optional leave two days early to drive.
Night 1: Jackson or Jackson Hole regardless of drive or fly
Night 2-3: Stay in Grand Teton
Night 4-6: Stay in Yellowstone (potentially Jackson on last night)
Night 7-8: Stay in Rocky Mountain NP
Night 9: Flex day to stay in Rocky Mountain NP, Denver, or push later part of trip back a day and incorporate this day into Grand Teton or Yellowstone
Day 10: Fly back from Denver or begin drive back to VA. Driving would push out arrival to VA by an extra day
Optional leave two days early to drive.
Night 1: Jackson or Jackson Hole regardless of drive or fly
Night 2-3: Stay in Grand Teton
Night 4-6: Stay in Yellowstone (potentially Jackson on last night)
Night 7-8: Stay in Rocky Mountain NP
Night 9: Flex day to stay in Rocky Mountain NP, Denver, or push later part of trip back a day and incorporate this day into Grand Teton or Yellowstone
Day 10: Fly back from Denver or begin drive back to VA. Driving would push out arrival to VA by an extra day
CO-Cygnus
New member
Just make sure you get entry reservations for the National Parks. Not sure about Yellowstone but RMNP is definitely on a daily quota.
Thanks that’s good to know!
thennen
New member
So you have two extra days at the front, and one extra day at the back? 13 days total?
Like a couple others on here, my wife and I have done this same trip, essentially, about 10 times (we actually do Yellowstone and Glacier). We're in Ohio, so a tiny bit closer.
In your case, driving from Richmond, you have about 2200 miles to Jackson/Yellowstone. You also have 2200 miles back (maybe a little more via RMNP). So you're at 4400+ miles (63 hours of driving at 70mph average, which is difficult to do) without doing any sightseeing. Once there, I bet you burn at least 1000 miles sightseeing amongst the parks (Yellowstone is huge, 9 times the square miles of RMNP. And it has 250 miles of roads). So you're at 5400 miles minimum for the trip, I'd guess. Likely closer to 6000. Average of 600 miles/day for 10 days. I love driving, but at that rate, fatigue will set in, ruining 1-2 days of your trip.
I'm trying to be helpful. I've done the 5am-11pm runs twice. You can get to Yellowstone or Glacier on day 2, but you're burned out. You think you're buying days in the parks, but they're not quality days.
Here's what I would do if I had 10-12 days: I'd drive to Yellowstone/Tetons, allowing at least 3 days to get there. South Dakota is worth slowing down for. Allowing for 3 days' return trip, that will leave me 4-6 days to chill and explore Yellowstone and the Tetons (plus a ton of territory right next door if you want to explore). I still wouldn't be able to see it all, but I wouldn't feel rushed, either. Personally, I would save RMNP for another trip.
That's me. Best wishes to you!
ElectroBoy
Banned
OK, now it makes more sense. You want to do a drive-through, stopping at the scenic overlooks, walking a short distance, snapping a few pics, get in the truck and drive to the next location. This is what most tourists do, as well as the bus loads of foreigners you’ll encounter. That’s OK.
But if you really want to “explore” as you originally said, you will need more time or slim down your ambitions. I spent 2 days hiking in Grand Teton and 13 days hiking in Yellowstone. And that was still not enough. It’s just incredible, so much to see, but you have to walk and hike to see the best and get away from crowds. Yellowstone is huge with long drives between major scenic areas. Plus you may get caught in traffic jams of cars watching roadside bears, or bison.
I would also recommend you concentrate most of your time on GT and YNP. Plan out your days of travel, lodging, sights to see, hikes to take. Your base lodging could be Jackson, Old Faithful Inn, Canyon Village, West Yellowstone. Or campgrounds nearby. Make reservations. Research what is open and closed. The winters are so severe that there is usually roadway reconstruction every year. Delays happen. Plan it out in as much detail as you can, it will be so rewarding.
Looks like just RMNP at this time but worth monitoring
Yes definitely looked into it - seemed a bit expensive. Think I was seeing $1,000+ for one way
Got it got it. Seems like general consensus would be to skip RMNP and just focus on these two parks to get the full experience
MeefZah
New member
Nothing really to add, since my opinions on it align pretty much with everyone else's.
Just a few thoughts:
If you have 2 people and you drive in shifts you are a mere 24 hours from the west.
Fear of putting miles on the truck, and depreciation, is bullshit. What the **** did you buy it for?
Now isn't really a great time to be traveling. If you are doing off the grid stuff, dispersed camping, then that's one thing. But going through the NPs, commercial campgrounds, restaurants, **** that. We blundered through Crater Lake last month while on a off the grid trip and it was a total shitshow. Packed. Packed more than I've ever seen it. Yellowstone will be worse... it's stupid busy even on a good day.
Just a few thoughts:
If you have 2 people and you drive in shifts you are a mere 24 hours from the west.
Fear of putting miles on the truck, and depreciation, is bullshit. What the **** did you buy it for?
Now isn't really a great time to be traveling. If you are doing off the grid stuff, dispersed camping, then that's one thing. But going through the NPs, commercial campgrounds, restaurants, **** that. We blundered through Crater Lake last month while on a off the grid trip and it was a total shitshow. Packed. Packed more than I've ever seen it. Yellowstone will be worse... it's stupid busy even on a good day.
Exactly.
We just returned from a month out in CO UT MT and WY.
If you don't already have reservations you can pretty much forget staying in any of the park campgrounds. Booked solid every time I looked and I started looking back in April or so....occasionally you might catch a cancellation but I would not count on it.
We stayed in USFS campgrounds a National Monument and a BLM campground. Same story with being 100% full just about every night.
BTW we drove the 4R- 7200 miles racked up. Did a similar trip 3 years ago and almost hit 10,000.
Going back in September for an undetermined period. Starting that vacation when we arrive in the Bighorn Mountains. Takes me 2.5 days to get there. I love being retired!
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3 years ago my grandson, then 10, and I went on an epic National Park trip- 11 of them, all out west. Drove almost 10k miles and took a month.
Yellowstone was ridiculous- we were in my Transit van and could not stop at ANY of the must see spots. Parking lots were full and cars lined up for a mile down the road shoulders both directions.
We went back the next morning pre-dawn and were able to see a lot we missed. By 10AM it was back to the same overcrowded mess.
Did the same thing at Yosemite.
The sad news is it is even worse now.
Jetboy
New member
FWIW - if you do not already have camping spots reserved - I would not expect to stay in Yellowstone or in or close to Teton park. Everyone in the west has the same idea of going camping. I spent last week in Yellowstone. As you may already know about half of the campgrounds are closed. The open ones were full every night - I believe all pre-reserved. I don't know if any first come first serve campgrounds are open right now. The popular campgrounds around West Yellowstone were also full. I can't say about the campgrounds near the other entrances.
We spent one night in Island Park, Idaho on the lake and we were able to find a walk up campsite open. So that may be a place to look if you can't find spots in the park. At least one of the campgrounds near Hebgen Lake was closed to tents due to bears being in the campground. Also there was a bear at Madison Campground where we stayed on Thursday night IIRC. Last week a woman and kid were bitten by a black bear(Black bear bites woman, child in Yellowstone | East Idaho News. Main point - for tent camping, you need to be planning on thinking bear safety. Bears are always around, but they've been really active lately in the campgrounds - probably something along the lines of a gap in seasonal food happening right now. Yellowstone campgrounds have bear boxes for food. The ones outside the park rarely do. Buy some bear spray. Don't let the kiddos have food in the tent at all - a granola bar wrapper can get you killed. Sounds extreme - but it's happened. Put everything in the bear box at night or in the car. Take it seriously. I don't lay awake at night worried about bears, attacks are rare. Just giving a heads up if you're not familiar with the issue to think about it before you get there.
The crowds were limited because many of the campgrounds are closed and there are no chinese tour buses. So that was a big plus. On most backcountry hiking trails there were very few people or none at all. The popular boardwalks were moderately busy given the season. Both the boiling river and firehole river swim locations are closed. And there are no shower facilities open at any location inside Yellowstone park. Many of the service stations (gas) are open and have typical convenience store food. Almost all or all of the prepared food locations and counters are closed. So plan on doing your own cooking. The restaurants in West Yellowstone and Mamoth/Gardiner are still open, but restricted.
Oh - and they're currently doing a re-pave of the road between Big Sky and West Yellowstone Montana. If you go that route, expect long waits (like 30+ minutes). The road through to Mamoth from the north wasn't so bad. The road between Tower Junction and Canyon Village was closed. So if you're coming in through Cook City, or Cody Wyoming and are headed somewhere you'd plan to take that segment, plan an extra hour or so to go around through mammoth.
Also - It's a great time to go. I hope you have a great time. But pack your patience - lots of it!
Oh - one more thing - 99% of Yellowstone does not have cell service. None at all. And the locations that do have very limited bandwidth and a ton of people trying to use it. So I would not plan on doing any remote work from inside the park that requires data connection. Phone calls will be limited and if you're out seeing the park, you'll rarely be able to make a phone call. Generally the only places with cell phone service are in Mamoth, Tower Junction, Fishing Bridge area, Canyon Villiage, and Grant Village. The Madison junction area does not have any phone service. Generally in the west Verizon is the best/only service. So even in those areas if you're not on Verizon or do have a phone that can roam on Verizon's network you may be SOL. I don't know for for sure on that for Yellowstone. In Montana - Verizon is for all practical purposes the only carrier that has a functional network.
We spent one night in Island Park, Idaho on the lake and we were able to find a walk up campsite open. So that may be a place to look if you can't find spots in the park. At least one of the campgrounds near Hebgen Lake was closed to tents due to bears being in the campground. Also there was a bear at Madison Campground where we stayed on Thursday night IIRC. Last week a woman and kid were bitten by a black bear(Black bear bites woman, child in Yellowstone | East Idaho News. Main point - for tent camping, you need to be planning on thinking bear safety. Bears are always around, but they've been really active lately in the campgrounds - probably something along the lines of a gap in seasonal food happening right now. Yellowstone campgrounds have bear boxes for food. The ones outside the park rarely do. Buy some bear spray. Don't let the kiddos have food in the tent at all - a granola bar wrapper can get you killed. Sounds extreme - but it's happened. Put everything in the bear box at night or in the car. Take it seriously. I don't lay awake at night worried about bears, attacks are rare. Just giving a heads up if you're not familiar with the issue to think about it before you get there.
The crowds were limited because many of the campgrounds are closed and there are no chinese tour buses. So that was a big plus. On most backcountry hiking trails there were very few people or none at all. The popular boardwalks were moderately busy given the season. Both the boiling river and firehole river swim locations are closed. And there are no shower facilities open at any location inside Yellowstone park. Many of the service stations (gas) are open and have typical convenience store food. Almost all or all of the prepared food locations and counters are closed. So plan on doing your own cooking. The restaurants in West Yellowstone and Mamoth/Gardiner are still open, but restricted.
Oh - and they're currently doing a re-pave of the road between Big Sky and West Yellowstone Montana. If you go that route, expect long waits (like 30+ minutes). The road through to Mamoth from the north wasn't so bad. The road between Tower Junction and Canyon Village was closed. So if you're coming in through Cook City, or Cody Wyoming and are headed somewhere you'd plan to take that segment, plan an extra hour or so to go around through mammoth.
Also - It's a great time to go. I hope you have a great time. But pack your patience - lots of it!
Oh - one more thing - 99% of Yellowstone does not have cell service. None at all. And the locations that do have very limited bandwidth and a ton of people trying to use it. So I would not plan on doing any remote work from inside the park that requires data connection. Phone calls will be limited and if you're out seeing the park, you'll rarely be able to make a phone call. Generally the only places with cell phone service are in Mamoth, Tower Junction, Fishing Bridge area, Canyon Villiage, and Grant Village. The Madison junction area does not have any phone service. Generally in the west Verizon is the best/only service. So even in those areas if you're not on Verizon or do have a phone that can roam on Verizon's network you may be SOL. I don't know for for sure on that for Yellowstone. In Montana - Verizon is for all practical purposes the only carrier that has a functional network.
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ElectroBoy
Banned
The National Park Service is limiting the amount of cars entering Yosemite as part of the covid response. Reservations are needed (weeks ahead of time) for lodging, camping, day use, back packing, day hiking, climbing. You even need to make a reservation to just drive through the park as if going on the Rt 120 Tioga Rd to Mono Lake and Rt 395.
It’s crazy busy. Gotta plan ahead. Good luck.
Entrance Reservations - Yosemite National Park (U.S. National Park Service)
It’s crazy busy. Gotta plan ahead. Good luck.
Entrance Reservations - Yosemite National Park (U.S. National Park Service)
CO-Cygnus
New member
I don't know why... but seeing 3-4 tour buses randomly pull up in the middle of nowhere Yellowstone and disgorge dozens and dozens of Chinese tourists always surprised me. The no squatting signs on the toilets were confusing to me until I saw my first bus convoy. I never realized Yellowstone was such a draw for China, especially after running in to mostly UK and German tourists in Yosemite.
thennen
New member
I hate to be that guy, but things were so much nicer and simpler in the parks in the 80s. Nowhere near the amounts of people there are today, facilities were more basic, etc. I remember thinking how cool it was to call home from the one pay phone in Polebridge, Montana, by Glacier NP.
MeefZah
New member
Luckily most people don't go to - or even know about - Polebridge. And pretty much every NP has a "Polebridge"... an off the beaten path cool spot that feels like a local secret.
Really though, the last few times I've just driven through a NP to drive through, it was torturous. I'm honestly of the opinion now that NF > NP. So much more space to explore with so few people. I guess if there's not a posted map with every pullout marked most people won't go there. Thank God.
thennen
New member
And right after I posted that, I realized I was someone else's 'crowd' back then, lol.
I sometimes look at NP webcams, specifically Glacier and Yellowstone since I'm familiar with them. Lake McDonald in Glacier has so many wind surfers/boarders now, they would be in every pic you tried to take. Then there's the face masks - don't even get me started ;-)
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