New paint problem

[piccrazy30]

So heres what happened today......

The insurance adjuster didnt see too much of a difference so he thinks its fine the way it is. The guy I have been working with at the shop (not the painter) went to the toyota dealership with me and we found a very similar color to mine but he didn't seem to see the difference either. Heres where I have made up my mind and this will be a lesson I had to learn the hard way, two mechanics came out and we were talking about the paint.....one says "Toyota does concern themselves with the paint as much as the do with their engines" and that got me thinking, he has an amazing point. I want as many miles out of her as I can get!! So Im not gonna stress over this anymore, time to start small and easy mods!!! I think the first two will be removing the hydrocarbon filter and making the fog lights run anytime!!

So heres my warning to anyone who lives in Colorado Springs...dont go to Kraftsmen Carstar Collision.

 

[EdmundGTP]

I would have just bought a CBI bumper instead. Either way these rigs are meant to be used, not to win beauty pageants.

I bought mine used with some door dings that could easily be popped without ruining the paint. Sometimes I think about getting them taken out, but those thoughts are quickly overpowered by my capacity to not give a chit.

 

[inscarguy]

I would have just bought a CBI bumper instead. Either way these rigs are meant to be used, not to win beauty pageants.

I bought mine used with some door dings that could easily be popped without ruining the paint. Sometimes I think about getting them taken out, but those thoughts are quickly overpowered by my capacity to not give a chit.

wow Carstar is a national chain of body shops. we have two here in Ma and they do pretty good work. from what you say it sounds like he panel painted instead of blending into adjacent panels. check your appraisal and see if the insurance company allowed for blends. if they did and he did not do them it is fraud and he is liable for the repairs. also if you get nowhere call corporate and have them step in.

 

[Asmara]

So heres my warning to anyone who lives in Colorado Springs...dont go to Kraftsmen Carstar Collision.

wow Carstar is a national chain of body shops. also if you get nowhere call corporate and have them step in.

So you are actually in luck. Carstar isn't a national chain but rather a national franchise. As part of the franchise, your work is warrantied nationally. Find another Carstar in the area and bring it in and ask them to fix it. It shouldn't come out of their pocket or otherwise hurt the different franchise and it still may come out of the pocket of the first place.

 

[piccrazy30]

wow Carstar is a national chain of body shops. we have two here in Ma and they do pretty good work. from what you say it sounds like he panel painted instead of blending into adjacent panels. check your appraisal and see if the insurance company allowed for blends. if they did and he did not do them it is fraud and he is liable for the repairs. also if you get nowhere call corporate and have them step in.

What do you mean by "blends"? He only used the color code for the factory 2004 4runner.

 

[Desert Fox]

If Asmara is correct it would be worth contacting another store (if there is one here) and telling them what happened and your concern. See if they will fix it.

If they wont and the original place does not want to fix it to your satisfaction, including the clear coat runs, you need to file a complaint with the BBB. I have had good luck using the BBB to get business issues resolved.

For others in Colorado Springs- There is a shop on Circle and Platte called Blossers. They do good work but most of all they stand behind their work. They are insurance friendly and they like Toyotas.

 

[piccrazy30]

If Asmara is correct it would be worth contacting another store (if there is one here) and telling them what happened and your concern. See if they will fix it.

If they wont and the original place does not want to fix it to your satisfaction, including the clear coat runs, you need to file a complaint with the BBB. I have had good luck using the BBB to get business issues resolved.

For others in Colorado Springs- There is a shop on Circle and Platte called Blossers. They do good work but most of all they stand behind their work. They are insurance friendly and they like Toyotas.

He said that where the clear coat runs they can buff it out....is that true? It seems like it would have to be repainted to me. There are three in Denver.

 

[mike304]

Galtic gray has more than 1 variance from the paint code....i fthe color gets lighter or darker when you walk around and look at it then the mettalic is not laying down as it should giving you a different color that shifts when you move around.......sounds like there is also a run in the clear coat.

I would take it back and point out the run and ask that that gets taken care of and ask them to repaint the areae in question.

 

[EdmundGTP]

What do you mean by "blends"? He only used the color code for the factory 2004 4runner.

"Blends" does not refer to the composition of the paint itself. When you paint a car, there are a TON of variables that can impact how the paint will actually look. The mix of the paint, viscosity, humidity, air pressure, gun orifice, etc. etc. Many times when a paint repair is done, the paint job extends well past the body panel that required the new paint. Basically a "fade" is created between the old paint and the new paint so that the look is more uniform between the two panels.

Considering all the variables above, it's damn near impossible for a body shop to perfectly match a metallic bumper repaint to the OEM metallic paint on the rest of the body, even if the paint code is identical. Hell there is even variance between different paint lots of the same code. So because of that, panels get "blended" together with overspray for uniformity, so that you don't see a stark contrast of color shade, flake lay, or reflectivity from one panel to the next.

Your body guy didn't do this, and your result is an obvious discrepancy between the panels.

If the run is in the clear coat, it can be block sanded and polished out so that you'd never even know it was there.

If the run is in the base coat, then you have to block sand through the paint, probably re-paint the area, re-blend if necessary, and re-clearcoat.

Body work is tedious stuff..

 

[piccrazy30]

"Blends" does not refer to the composition of the paint itself. When you paint a car, there are a TON of variables that can impact how the paint will actually look. The mix of the paint, viscosity, humidity, air pressure, gun orifice, etc. etc. Many times when a paint repair is done, the paint job extends well past the body panel that required the new paint. Basically a "fade" is created between the old paint and the new paint so that the look is more uniform between the two panels.

Considering all the variables above, it's damn near impossible for a body shop to perfectly match a metallic bumper repaint to the OEM metallic paint on the rest of the body, even if the paint code is identical. Hell there is even variance between different paint lots of the same code. So because of that, panels get "blended" together with overspray for uniformity, so that you don't see a stark contrast of color shade, flake lay, or reflectivity from one panel to the next.

Your body guy didn't do this, and your result is an obvious discrepancy between the panels.

If the run is in the clear coat, it can be block sanded and polished out so that you'd never even know it was there.

If the run is in the base coat, then you have to block sand through the paint, probably re-paint the area, re-blend if necessary, and re-clearcoat.

Body work is tedious stuff..

Somehow he seemed to match the bumper (it may he a hair darker), its the back door thats way off. Can it make a difference in the color since the bumper is plastic and the door is metal?

 

[inscarguy]

What do you mean by "blends"? He only used the color code for the factory 2004 4runner.

over time paint does change color, fade, loose pigment etc.. greys, silvers and golds are the worst. sometimes you can get lucky and it matches great but most of the time the color is off or the person who mixed it added an extra drop or two of some color. even the clear coat can change color as even an extra layer of clear will darken a color.

say for instance a ft door needs to be changed a painter will "blend" the new paint into the fender and rear door. a blend is when you add a little dusting of the "color" into each panel so if there is a slight color difference it will not show up as much as if you just panel painted it. after the color is dusted into each panel the painter would clear the entire panels on each side of the door.

 

[WXman]

say for instance a ft door needs to be changed a painter will "blend" the new paint into the fender and rear door. a blend is when you add a little dusting of the "color" into each panel so if there is a slight color difference it will not show up as much as if you just panel painted it. after the color is dusted into each panel the painter would clear the entire panels on each side of the door.

Yeah that's what they want to do to mine. But I won't let them. EVERY panel on my 4runner matches perfectly, including the rear hatch which they've already painted and fixed for me. The driver's door is the only one that's not the same color.

If they start "blending" up and down the driver's side...then I'll have 3 panels that are different colors from the rear of the truck. That makes zero sense. It would be far easier to just sand the door down and repaint it the proper color.

It's true that over time paint fades but if quality paint and quality clearcoat are used, it takes a decade or more for this to happen. By then, my 4Runner will be too old to worry about cosmetically anymore. So I want it done right. I want only the panel that is painted wrong to be painted correctly.

In post #19 you can clearly see how the driver's door was painted too dark.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/136222-looking-03-v8-2.html

Standing at the side, it looks even worse, especially on cloudy days. I can't believe the previous owner, having paid $40K for this thing, would have ever accepted this work.

 

[piccrazy30]

Yeah that's what they want to do to mine. But I won't let them. EVERY panel on my 4runner matches perfectly, including the rear hatch which they've already painted and fixed for me. The driver's door is the only one that's not the same color.

If they start "blending" up and down the driver's side...then I'll have 3 panels that are different colors from the rear of the truck. That makes zero sense. It would be far easier to just sand the door down and repaint it the proper color.

It's true that over time paint fades but if quality paint and quality clearcoat are used, it takes a decade or more for this to happen. By then, my 4Runner will be too old to worry about cosmetically anymore. So I want it done right. I want only the panel that is painted wrong to be painted correctly.

In post #19 you can clearly see how the driver's door was painted too dark.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/136222-looking-03-v8-2.html

Standing at the side, it looks even worse, especially on cloudy days. I can't believe the previous owner, having paid $40K for this thing, would have ever accepted this work.

If you look at your 4R at that exact angle when the sun is out you will see that the small bend above the left tail light is darker than the rest of the truck...they said thats why the rest of the door/hatch looks like its darker too.

BUT the door doesn't bend like that?!?!?! So it should go back to the natural color of the truck and I have looked all week at other runners while driving around town and they all did the same thing....BUT once you see the back door/hatch it starts a little dark and quickly turns back to the natural color of the side of the car...

 

[inscarguy]

Yeah that's what they want to do to mine. But I won't let them. EVERY panel on my 4runner matches perfectly, including the rear hatch which they've already painted and fixed for me. The driver's door is the only one that's not the same color.

If they start "blending" up and down the driver's side...then I'll have 3 panels that are different colors from the rear of the truck. That makes zero sense. It would be far easier to just sand the door down and repaint it the proper color.

It's true that over time paint fades but if quality paint and quality clearcoat are used, it takes a decade or more for this to happen. By then, my 4Runner will be too old to worry about cosmetically anymore. So I want it done right. I want only the panel that is painted wrong to be painted correctly.

In post #19 you can clearly see how the driver's door was painted too dark.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/136222-looking-03-v8-2.html

Standing at the side, it looks even worse, especially on cloudy days. I can't believe the previous owner, having paid $40K for this thing, would have ever accepted this work.

that door is not even close. its a completely different color, like the wrong paint code. i can tell you from past and present experience panel painting is never a good idea. old paint and new paint can be very close but they will NEVER be exact.

for example i have a salsa red 4runner. my neighbor backed into it two years ago. only damaged the cladding on the rt ft door. the shop i use was a fantastic toyota dealer and they know me by dealing with them everyday with my job. they tried panel painting the cladding only and it was not even close. at the time my 4runner was only 5 years old. they blended the fender flare and the rear door flare and its perfect you cant even see a color change on the doors. i am super anal and they knew that.

you ask any good body shop and they will tell you that any surrounding panel will have to be blended to get a proper color match. in your case its black and white. that will definitely need to be redone.

i agree that and it is a known thing that you want to keep as much of the original paint as possible but in most cases it cannot be helped.

 

[WXman]

Yeah I know it'll never be perfect, but like you have seen anything would look better than what these monkeys did to that driver's door. So if my shop gets it really close I will be happy.

Like I said, they already painted my rear hatch for me after my son tore it up earlier in the summer and the paint they did on that panel looks picture perfect.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/maintenance-detailing/140018-scrapes-paint-hard-fix-not.html

Whenever I get a few hundred bucks saved up I'm going to let them take a crack at it.

 

[piccrazy30]

Ok so heres whats going on.....I went to a Carstar in Denver today and talked to the painter there. He said it is very noticeable and a poor quality job. He has been in the painting biz for 16 years. Im taking it next Tuesday to get fixed...fingers crossed its matched better this time.

And let me make a correction to an earlier post----everything at the Carstar in Colorado Springs was great EXCEPT the paint job/painter.

It was also nice to meet Desertfox and talk 4R's for a little bit....he's the one that told me about this forum, my new addiction...facebook is old now

Thank you for all the input I really appreciate it!!!!

I'll post next week about the results.......have a great weekend

 

[Desert Fox]

Glad you are getting resolution on this.

It was good meeting up with you, you and your husband need to get out on a trail with us. Then you will really be hooked.

 

[20034RunnerV84x2]

When my accident happened (my fault, no one else involved) I told the people that I took it to (Nalley Collision if Doraville, GA) that if the paint wasn't right, they were redoing it. Well, after a week of then repairing my truck, I come back and it is spot on (and my truck is white too). I think what I did before I took it in helped, I did a full compound & polish, then wax with meguiars products. Still looks great to this day and don't regret using them.

 

[piccrazy30]

I discovered a new problem yesterday the back window is so loose it feels like if I hit a bump too hard its gonna break......HORRIBLE JOB........I could start to smell smoke I was SO mad when I discovered this you'd think I was on fire..AAHHH

 

[piccrazy30]

I feel like I am back at square one, Im worried that if I take it to the other shop in Denver Im going to get charged for something and it won't be paid by my insurance. But I dont want to take it back to the painter with the shitty attitude. I feel like everyone involved is against me.....maybe I need to get a lawyer, I pay ALOT of money for insurance and they dont seem to care.
Shoot they took better care of us when my husband hit somebody and totaled our car.
Im suppose to take it to Denver in the morning, should I still take it??