BlackCloud
Member
You mounted it to the Gobi rack, but does the kit include a bracket that would work on the standard T4R roof rack crossbars?
Off Road Comms
- Thread starter moshie
- Start date
You mounted it to the Gobi rack, but does the kit include a bracket that would work on the standard T4R roof rack crossbars?
Coyotegray
New member
The Diamond K515S might work...
Things to note:
GMRS/FRS is locked to specific channels which could get crowded (although the FCC has recently expanded the band).
HAM is not legally allowed to TX over GMRS/FRS, but CAN RX.
HAM generally has more power output (30+ watts) than GMRS and can reach out better when you have clear LoS.
Repeater advantages have already been discussed, but there's also IRLP for licensed operators to use.
I personally run a Yaesu Ft-8800R rig in my 4Skinner and carry two Yaesu VX-5R HTs for in the field work between operators.
You don't need a massively complicated set up to get the benefits of HAM. For several years, I ran one of the HTs with a Diamond antenna and a hand mic. Granted, I was maxed out at 5 watts, but with the larger antenna, I could reach out beyond the 5-7 mile range.
GMRS/FRS is locked to specific channels which could get crowded (although the FCC has recently expanded the band).
HAM is not legally allowed to TX over GMRS/FRS, but CAN RX.
HAM generally has more power output (30+ watts) than GMRS and can reach out better when you have clear LoS.
Repeater advantages have already been discussed, but there's also IRLP for licensed operators to use.
I personally run a Yaesu Ft-8800R rig in my 4Skinner and carry two Yaesu VX-5R HTs for in the field work between operators.
You don't need a massively complicated set up to get the benefits of HAM. For several years, I ran one of the HTs with a Diamond antenna and a hand mic. Granted, I was maxed out at 5 watts, but with the larger antenna, I could reach out beyond the 5-7 mile range.
Bumbo
New member
Glad you mentioned that... The IRLP / Echolink or similar functions that link radio repeater to internet IP is pretty dang useful and only expand coverage...
My wife went snowboarding few states away and there was no cellular coverage for her... no reliable repeaters between us either. Only her small VX-2R Yaesu.
Plus I had to work and couldn't not be parked near a radio.
She used a handheld into a repeater that was Echolinked, and I just used the Echolink an app on my iPhone. I could monitor and talk to that repeater in case there was an incident.
My wife went snowboarding few states away and there was no cellular coverage for her... no reliable repeaters between us either. Only her small VX-2R Yaesu.
Plus I had to work and couldn't not be parked near a radio.
She used a handheld into a repeater that was Echolinked, and I just used the Echolink an app on my iPhone. I could monitor and talk to that repeater in case there was an incident.
Thebeastlives
New member
what does this setup cost?
tx_shooter
New member
So how many people really need to have comm for 40 miles when wheeling with friends?
Last month I went wheeling with friends and we used a mix of GMRS truck mounted radios and FRS handheld radios with zero issues. I know all the HAM guys are pounding on their keyboards saying we only had 2-4 miles of coverage with the FRS radios - but that was more than enough for terrain and highway usage we did. We had comm link between the trucks around 8 miles from first to last on the highway and close to 5 miles inside the wheeling area.
Sure - HAM setups can talk to people 50 miles away if those people are listening. Personally I only care to talk to the people in my group. GMRS truck mounted Midland radios are doing a great job at that. Between a few truck radios and a handful of cheap FRS radios we are all 100% legal (the GMRS guys have their licenses) and the FRS radios go to people without. No FCC issues and we all have a great day.
But it is not tacticool like HAM. I can live with that.
Last month I went wheeling with friends and we used a mix of GMRS truck mounted radios and FRS handheld radios with zero issues. I know all the HAM guys are pounding on their keyboards saying we only had 2-4 miles of coverage with the FRS radios - but that was more than enough for terrain and highway usage we did. We had comm link between the trucks around 8 miles from first to last on the highway and close to 5 miles inside the wheeling area.
Sure - HAM setups can talk to people 50 miles away if those people are listening. Personally I only care to talk to the people in my group. GMRS truck mounted Midland radios are doing a great job at that. Between a few truck radios and a handful of cheap FRS radios we are all 100% legal (the GMRS guys have their licenses) and the FRS radios go to people without. No FCC issues and we all have a great day.
But it is not tacticool like HAM. I can live with that.
Bumbo
New member
Theoretical distance isn't a good measure. Everything is terrain dependent on all systems. I have gotten <1/4 mile in a valley and 150 miles from top of a mountain with the same HAM radio.
For simplex (radio to radio) operation, if the power levels are set to the same, and similar handheld antenna are on each setup, a HAM radio will preform near identical to GMRS or FRS.
I agree that car-to-car coms does not require much. You most certainly dont need a HAM radio.
For wheeling or road-trip with people who don't really care about radios, I use MURS. I prefer it over both FRS and GMRS.
Multi-Use Radio Service - Wikipedia
The biggest benefit is that MURS rules allows for external antennas, which makes a world of difference when operating from inside a car.
MURS is free and does not require a licence. I'ts similar to FRS without antennas restrictions and better power limits.
The benefit of a HAM radio is access to more bands, and repeaters. Equipment is also more capable and you can get crazy with antennas as well. With my ham radio I can track GPS position (APRS) of friends, text message without cellular, send data like photos, have better emergency coms using repeaters, make my own repeater using my truck radio... There are far more reasons to be a ham beyond just talking to the dude next to you. It's the most capable tool you can have in terms of radio.
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Coyotegray
New member
What Bumbo said above and that’s just a small part. One of the best things I ever did for remote adventure travel and emergency preparedness was get my Amateur Radio License...
Bumbo
New member
Same here... people are turning down HAM radio for the wrong reasons.
I'll be honest I rarely use my HAM radio for wheeling, but that only because most all of my group does not hold a ham licence.
Being the radio nerd of the group I pushed everyone towards MURS. Everyone I wheel with has their own MURS radio, and for those who don't, I have a few of them to use as loaners, which is my way of creating a standard.
That said, I always have like at least two ham radios with me. If something happens on the trail and we are out of range of cellular, I am literally the only person in the group that has the ability to call for help.
MURS, FRS, GMRS, or CB IMO are useless for anything other than basic group coms.
tx_shooter
New member
HAM is great for that 5% of people that really enjoy that kind of stuff. Nothing against those people/ that stuff. But I have a lot of other things I would rather be doing. GMRS and FRS works great for the other 95% of the population that just want to buy a license (if GMRS) and go hit the trail.
Yeah HAM radios and all the other things that go on them have a lot of features for going way out there and getting lost - but again that is beyond the scope of 95% of the people out there. I have only been one place in the US where my GPS devices did not work with enough certainty to get me around.
At some point I may go forward with a HAM license but it is not something that should be pushed as a "anything less is irresponsible" thing that a lot of HAM/Overland Bound types like to push. Most people need to spend a bit more time learning their rig than learning the HAM test.
Yeah HAM radios and all the other things that go on them have a lot of features for going way out there and getting lost - but again that is beyond the scope of 95% of the people out there. I have only been one place in the US where my GPS devices did not work with enough certainty to get me around.
At some point I may go forward with a HAM license but it is not something that should be pushed as a "anything less is irresponsible" thing that a lot of HAM/Overland Bound types like to push. Most people need to spend a bit more time learning their rig than learning the HAM test.
Bumbo
New member
I don't disagree with you, but I feel like you are still missing the point.
It has nothing to do with GPS or navigation. It's not about being tacticool. It's not even about Overlanding. It's not about talking to your buddy on the trail either.
It is about being prepared and responsible for your own saftey.
Even if you need it and don't want it, you can just throw money at the problem and buy a satellite phone or a Garmin InReach. I have both and from experience can say InReach is even better than owning a HAM radio from a personal saftey standpoint in that it takes literally no skill to operate.
Amateur Radio as a hobby is a totally different thing... at it's core, it's basically the radio version of cryptocurrency. It can't be controlled by a entity or government. It can't be censored. Users are responsible for any and all infrastructure related to it. Even with zero public or private infrastructure you can still achieve global communications. You can talk to the international space station or relay off a satellite. Nothing else on the planet allows you to do that.
The same reasons decentralized currency like Bitcoin appeal to people today is the same reason why Amateur Radio is still valid today.
Not trying to turn you into a HAM convert, but just trying to shed some light into the hobby, which you have made clear you have no interest in.
It has nothing to do with GPS or navigation. It's not about being tacticool. It's not even about Overlanding. It's not about talking to your buddy on the trail either.
It is about being prepared and responsible for your own saftey.
Even if you need it and don't want it, you can just throw money at the problem and buy a satellite phone or a Garmin InReach. I have both and from experience can say InReach is even better than owning a HAM radio from a personal saftey standpoint in that it takes literally no skill to operate.
Amateur Radio as a hobby is a totally different thing... at it's core, it's basically the radio version of cryptocurrency. It can't be controlled by a entity or government. It can't be censored. Users are responsible for any and all infrastructure related to it. Even with zero public or private infrastructure you can still achieve global communications. You can talk to the international space station or relay off a satellite. Nothing else on the planet allows you to do that.
The same reasons decentralized currency like Bitcoin appeal to people today is the same reason why Amateur Radio is still valid today.
Not trying to turn you into a HAM convert, but just trying to shed some light into the hobby, which you have made clear you have no interest in.
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BlackCloud
Member
WHAT?
Ham radio is a proven technology with tangibly reliable benefits.
Bitcoin is a highly speculative financial experiment.
The reasons people are drawn to each are about as disassociated as someone entering the priesthood and another person wanting chocolate ice cream.
Bumbo
New member
You are reading way too much into this statement.
The only takeaway from this was that the infrastructure and operation isn't controlled by a single authority, government, or private entity. It can not be shut down. Both are forms of a hedge in their own respect.
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BlackCloud
Member
Oh yes, these are similarities indeed.
Lost-Again
New member
I'm retired. So I like being kind of a gear geek. Getting a Ham license is super easy. You can literally just study the test online then pass it. Of course you won't
gain any knowledge but you can legally push the button. That said having all the toys what I use most is my iPhone. Unless I'm out in BigBend. Then I use my iPhone through my inreach mini.
gain any knowledge but you can legally push the button. That said having all the toys what I use most is my iPhone. Unless I'm out in BigBend. Then I use my iPhone through my inreach mini.
Bumbo
New member
It's hardly an issue off-road... but you bring up a good point, and something I completely forgot about... congestion.
Back in the day we used to use FRS/GMRS Motorola radios for snowboarding and it was pretty bad even with the use of tone encoded channels.
If you are lucky you have to share the airspace, if you are unlucky it usually is because kids are just playing around with them and or yelling obscenities.
Agreed. There's also the added benefit of having access to repeaters to extend range for HAM over FRS/GMRS, not to mention IRLP capabilities to reach people at home over the internet when you're in the field.
If you know what you're doing, the advantages of HAM over non-licensed options becomes glaringly apparent. Took me a few years to fully appreciate the value of getting licensed up, but once I did, it's been a practical part of my kit ever since.
Lost-Again
New member
Being able to text via satellite is a remarkable.