Official Reveal Thread 2025 6th gen 4Runner

[AZ Craig]

I agree with you, in theory. Toyota is competitively priced with other manufacturers and Toyota/Lexus quality is a nice advantage.

My main concern is that the entire industry is pricing itself out of the market.

The automotive industry is fast approaching a breaking point where people, in the numbers manufacturers and dealerships need to keep record profits continuing, will either simply stop justifying $50k, $60k, $70k, window stickers for a daily driver or they won't qualify for a car loan even if they are willing to pay because of high interest rates and tightening bank credit.

You're completely right and I think that's why we continue to see pretty good demand for lower priced (sub-$40K) vehicles currently as a lot of stuff over $50K and especially over $60K has slowed down and is being discounted quite a bit.

The demise of Jeep in the US market I think is completely a product of them pricing their vehicles out of the reach of quite a few of their consumers. When I looked at a V8 Grand Cherokee L the end of last year, they literally were willing to give it to me at around $17K (!) off of sticker ($66K purchase price negotiated on a $83K summit reserve vehicle). Ultimately I ended up passing since I was getting a crappy trade on my Rover from them and the vehicle didn't lease very well (plus was an absolute gas hog with potentially questionable reliability). Wranglers and Gladiators are heavily discounted for this exact reason too; how many Jeep consumers can afford these vehicles when Rubicons and Sahara trim lines are easily pushing into the mid to upper $60Ks range. Then you end up with a bunch of financially illiterate people on 84 month loans with 10% interest rates and a $1000 a month car payment who will be upside down for years.

I am really curious to see if Toyota can keep up the sales pace on this new generation of Tacomas, 4Runners, and the Land Cruiser with the prices where they are now or if they simply start to push people away who simply cannot make it financially work any longer (even if they really want it).

 

[AZ Craig]

Yeah, that is a definite consideration for me. LC with premium package is over $70k. At that point, why not a GX Overtrail?

Or just splurge for the Overtrail Plus which maxes out right around $82K I think. My take on it is monst consumers who can afford a $72K truck can probably afford an $82K truck. Land Cruiser will probably have nominally better residual values and a slightly cheaper operating cost given the better fuel mileage. You also take the cargo hit with the raised floor in the trunk though to accomodate the hybrid battery plus the GX550 blows away the LC on towing capacity.

The LC may be a slightly better platform to modify is the one thing I can see given the EKDSS system in the GX; at least for suspension work.

 

[thatoneguy]

It's interesting that a mid-spec Land Cruiser without the premium package is about $63k, and that a base GX is $64k, both with destination. Those are really similar prices. Some of the only big draws to the LC250 in this comparison is that the LC can get the two-tone paint offerings (which I think are awesome), and that it comes standard with the rear locker--you have to go straight to an Overtrail to get a rear locker in the GX, and now you're at $69k. So I guess... how much is that thirsty V6 (versus the efficient 4cyl hybrid), the Lexus badge, Lexus interior, one year longer warranty, and extra cargo area (since no hybrid battery) worth to you?

I think the base LC250 is the best value. Granted, it may be hard to stomach cloth seats at $57k... even if you're getting full-time 4WD, style, and a rear locker. If you don't care about a rear locker or fuel economy and just want a nice full-time 4WD offroad capable SUV, the base base GX seems like good value.

All these prices kind of need $3-5k of Dealer Adjustment applied to them--in the downward direction this time. And maybe that'll be the case after the first 6-12 months... 4Runners were already readily available thousands below MSRP, and I'm hearing multiple reports of non-loaded 2024 Tacomas already selling $1-2k below MSRP. Toyota may have been too profit-optimistic on these pricing structures, particularly at current interest rates.

 

[gomiami]

It's interesting that a mid-spec Land Cruiser without the premium package is about $63k, and that a base GX is $64k, both with destination. Those are really similar prices. Some of the only big draws to the LC250 in this comparison is that the LC can get the two-tone paint offerings (which I think are awesome), and that it comes standard with the rear locker--you have to go straight to an Overtrail to get a rear locker in the GX, and now you're at $69k. So I guess... how much is that thirsty V6 (versus the efficient 4cyl hybrid), the Lexus badge, Lexus interior, one year longer warranty, and extra cargo area (since no hybrid battery) worth to you?

I think the base LC250 is the best value. Granted, it may be hard to stomach cloth seats at $57k... even if you're getting full-time 4WD, style, and a rear locker. If you don't care about a rear locker or fuel economy and just want a nice full-time 4WD offroad capable SUV, the base base GX seems like good value.

All these prices kind of need $3-5k of Dealer Adjustment applied to them--in the downward direction this time. And maybe that'll be the case after the first 6-12 months... 4Runners were already readily available thousands below MSRP, and I'm hearing multiple reports of non-loaded 2024 Tacomas already selling $1-2k below MSRP. Toyota may have been too profit-optimistic on these pricing structures, particularly at current interest rates.

The one thing I would add is that, if the GX550 is anything like the GX460 was, you will be hard pressed to find a Premium 550 available in large parts of the country. So, while the on-paper price is very similar, the LC will actually have units you can buy whereas the Premium GX550 will be a unicorn.

In the KC/Omaha area, there are 54 GX550s allocated or in transit...only two of them are the Premium trim that costs $64k (both are optioned out at around $66k.)

 

[phillyd2]

The new LC is now basically just another 4R trim level so just pick whichever scooter's body design you like better.

The GX is now the best of the bunch, by far.

 

[trainman605]

The one thing I would add is that, if the GX550 is anything like the GX460 was, you will be hard pressed to find a Premium 550 available in large parts of the country. So, while the on-paper price is very similar, the LC will actually have units you can buy whereas the Premium GX550 will be a unicorn.

In the KC/Omaha area, there are 54 GX550s allocated or in transit...only two of them are the Premium trim that costs $64k (both are optioned out at around $66k.)

One thing to keep in mind when comparing the Lexus models to the Toyota models and their 4 wheel off roading capabilities is that, 99% of Lexus model never see any off roading. Now for the 4 Runners I would say it's less then 10% of the ones on the road today see any off roading either. I own a 2024 TRD Off Road and it will never see any off roading, I just like the model, the looks, and it could go off road if need be. I'm not saying these models can't perform off road, they can, but most buy them for what they are and not so much to be used as built, it's a status symbol for many. The new Land Cruiser will just fit in pretty much somewhere between the Lexus and the 4 Runner and will be pretty much used and sold the same way, just another upscale vehicle that can perform off road, but mainly seen at the malls. For me I see anyone of them as one of the best vehicles out there to buy, you can't go wrong with any of them.

 

[M1911]

Or just splurge for the Overtrail Plus which maxes out right around $82K I think. My take on it is monst consumers who can afford a $72K truck can probably afford an $82K truck. Land Cruiser will probably have nominally better residual values and a slightly cheaper operating cost given the better fuel mileage. You also take the cargo hit with the raised floor in the trunk though to accomodate the hybrid battery plus the GX550 blows away the LC on towing capacity.

The LC may be a slightly better platform to modify is the one thing I can see given the EKDSS system in the GX; at least for suspension work.

The OT+ is more than I want to spend. Yes, the reduced cargo space in the LC 250 is a negative, but the improvement in fuel economy is significant. I’ve seen a post from an LC owner that he is getting 22 mpg, versus 17 mpg in a GX. That might not sound like a big difference, but it is about 30%. I’m nearing retirement and don’t drive a lot these days, so the cost difference won’t be huge for me. I still have an irrational disappointment that the GX doesn’t get better fuel economy.

 

[gomiami]

One thing to keep in mind when comparing the Lexus models to the Toyota models and their 4 wheel off roading capabilities is that, 99% of Lexus model never see any off roading. Now for the 4 Runners I would say it's less then 10% of the ones on the road today see any off roading either. I own a 2024 TRD Off Road and it will never see any off roading, I just like the model, the looks, and it could go off road if need be. I'm not saying these models can't perform off road, they can, but most buy them for what they are and not so much to be used as built, it's a status symbol for many. The new Land Cruiser will just fit in pretty much somewhere between the Lexus and the 4 Runner and will be pretty much used and sold the same way, just another upscale vehicle that can perform off road, but mainly seen at the malls. For me I see anyone of them as one of the best vehicles out there to buy, you can't go wrong with any of them.

OK?

I was making a point that the price difference between the Toyota and Lexus is effectively much larger than the paper MSRPs. The higher end Land Cruiser will be made in some numbers and will be available. The base model Lexus not so much and those that are made are sent primarily to the coasts...meaning most customers won't have the base Lexus as an option even if they want one.

...and I disagree with your assessment. The vast, vast majority of 4Runner owners never use their vehicle for anything other than on-road applications. The same will apply to the Land Cruiser. The entire marketing campaign built around the off-road/overlanding crowd is just playing into perception. If you would use an LC as intended, good for you. 90% won't, just like 90% of 4Runner owners won't...and Toyota knows this. Subaru knows it. Ford knows it. Hell, most Jeep Wranglers where I live are driven by high school girls so that they can display cute little ducks on the dashboard.

Lexus GX may be a status symbol. The 4Runner, Wrangler, Land Cruiser, Outback Wilderness, Ram1500, GMC Sierra, Bronco, etc. are not too far off, bro. Let's be real. It's just a bunch of people projecting an image through the type of vehicle they buy.

 

[Jetboy]

Yeah. I just can't imagine sales will remain robust on Toyota SUVs at these price points. Same thing with the pricing on the new GX550.

Some new Tacomas are already sitting on lots for 100+ days. Something has to give. New trucks sitting 100 days is time to start cutting prices to get them moving out the door.

Maybe $55k for a TRD OR Tacoma isn't a viable market price.

 

[thatoneguy]

Some new Tacomas are already sitting on lots for 100+ days. Something has to give. New trucks sitting 100 days is time to start cutting prices to get them moving out the door.

Maybe $55k for a TRD OR Tacoma isn't a viable market price.

They also definitely need to ease up on putting several thousand dollar packages on too many of their factory builds. Not every TRD OR buyer wants that $4,600 "offroad upgrade" package or that eye-watering $8,800 "Off-road Premium" package. Turns a $44k truck into a $53k truck real quick.

Saw it happen with 2023/2024 4Runners. In late 2022, it seemed like most Offroad Premiums they were building were loaded to the hilt with several thousand dollars in options. 9-12 months later, a LOT more low/no options builds started hitting dealers. No matter how much automakers want it, their wide middle class audience cannot reliably swing 55k vehicles--which makes me wonder what future sales of LC250s and 4Runners will look like.

 

[Jetboy]

They also definitely need to ease up on putting several thousand dollar packages on too many of their factory builds. Not every TRD OR buyer wants that $4,600 "offroad upgrade" package or that eye-watering $8,800 "Off-road Premium" package. Turns a $44k truck into a $53k truck real quick.

Saw it happen with 2023/2024 4Runners. In late 2022, it seemed like most Offroad Premiums they were building were loaded to the hilt with several thousand dollars in options. 9-12 months later, a LOT more low/no options builds started hitting dealers. No matter how much automakers want it, their wide middle class audience cannot reliably swing 55k vehicles--which makes me wonder what future sales of LC250s and 4Runners will look like.

Agreed.

But even the basic models aren't selling. As an example just searching for ones listed for a long time,

This is a SR5 that's been sitting for 131 days for sale and has price dropped $2,600 so far since listing.

cargurus.com

Another one under MSRP still sitting at 128 days that is an SR5 model (mis-listed) in a pretty basic trim without much dealer add ons.

cargurus.com


Considering how new these are and not able to move them - I think the writing is on the wall for what the market looks like in 6 months or a year.

 

[gomiami]

Some new Tacomas are already sitting on lots for 100+ days. Something has to give. New trucks sitting 100 days is time to start cutting prices to get them moving out the door.

Maybe $55k for a TRD OR Tacoma isn't a viable market price.

I would hope not. The average car increased around 6% in 2021, 11% in 2022 and 3% in 2023. Not many people got 20% raises over the same period.

 

[thatoneguy]

Agreed.

But even the basic models aren't selling. As an example just searching for ones listed for a long time,

This is a SR5 that's been sitting for 131 days for sale and has price dropped $2,600 so far since listing.

cargurus.com

Another one under MSRP still sitting at 128 days that is an SR5 model (mis-listed) in a pretty basic trim without much dealer add ons.

cargurus.com


Considering how new these are and not able to move them - I think the writing is on the wall for what the market looks like in 6 months or a year.

Yep.

It's also not just the notable MSRP increases from prior gen 2023's, there's of course the financing part. At least in my region, Toyota USA was doing 3.9% financing on Tacomas for the last three years straight. Currently, my region has no promotional financing rate available on 2024's. They'll probably have to change that pretty fast; that or start doing deep discounts like they did on 2024 4Runners.

Financing a $40k 2023 Tacoma at 3.9% is a lot easier than financing a $45k 2024 Tacoma at 7.0%. I really think Toyota will need to bring the promotional rates right back to not create a backlog of unsold trucks. Filling lots with a bunch of cheaper SR's isn't enough; financing $38k at 7.0% still sucks. I have to say that as much as I like the idea and price point of the SR's, having the lower power version of the engine in that trim is a total penalty box. For non-business use, I would want an SR5. At least the low-spec 2.4L is still worlds faster than the old 2.7L.

Toyota might also be wise to realize they swung for the fences with 2024 Tacoma pricing, and consider holding the MSRP flat for model year 2025.

This reminds me of the 2024 Jeep Gladiator, which despite getting a nice facelift and upgrades, LOWERED the MSRP $1,700 from 2023 MSRP. They just weren't selling. They'll give you $16k off a leftover 2023 Gladiator if any are still out there.


This is all to say I don't want to see a bunch of $52k 6th gen 4Runners on lots being offered with absolutely no promotional financing rates.

 

[AZ Craig]

The OT+ is more than I want to spend. Yes, the reduced cargo space in the LC 250 is a negative, but the improvement in fuel economy is significant. I’ve seen a post from an LC owner that he is getting 22 mpg, versus 17 mpg in a GX. That might not sound like a big difference, but it is about 30%. I’m nearing retirement and don’t drive a lot these days, so the cost difference won’t be huge for me. I still have an irrational disappointment that the GX doesn’t get better fuel economy.

I'm with you on the gas mileage honestly, but the advantages of the GX550 packaging and tow capacity are worth it I think. The GX550 is not going to be a huge step forward from the 5th generation 4Runner (or GX460) in terms of fuel mileage. I think it comes down to usage like you mention however. Even with 15K miles a year, you're talking probably less than $100 a month (with gas at or over $4 per gallon). If you want something with better gas mileage, get a unibody derived cross over with a turbo 4 or hybrid power train.

It's a consideration, but to me, not a show stopper. I do want to drive both powertrains though and see what I think of them. I've already started to watch for "unclaimed" vehicles coming through the Phoenix metro in hopes of driving something.

 

[AZ Craig]

They also definitely need to ease up on putting several thousand dollar packages on too many of their factory builds. Not every TRD OR buyer wants that $4,600 "offroad upgrade" package or that eye-watering $8,800 "Off-road Premium" package. Turns a $44k truck into a $53k truck real quick.

Saw it happen with 2023/2024 4Runners. In late 2022, it seemed like most Offroad Premiums they were building were loaded to the hilt with several thousand dollars in options. 9-12 months later, a LOT more low/no options builds started hitting dealers. No matter how much automakers want it, their wide middle class audience cannot reliably swing 55k vehicles--which makes me wonder what future sales of LC250s and 4Runners will look like.

Then to top it off you have dealers putting several thousand of BS on their cars that they will not remove like nitrogen filled tires and other cash grabs like GPS locator theft systems. So then your $53K truck is actually a $57K truck with a bunch of dealer added crap on it.

 

[et2041]

I love the looks but....

There is no way I'll be able to afford one of the pricier versions of the 4runner. I have a 12 year old 2012 Trail edition that has been the best vehicle I have owned in my lifetime. Trips to the Blueridge Mountains, and west to the Tetons and another trip to the Bighorns, the vehicle failed to disappoint off road.

But, she's 12 now and just about to turn 100K. I'm retired and looking for another, but at $60K to get what I want...I may just drive her another 12 years.

Toyota reliability and value is second to none as far as I'm concerned. I would never even consider buying Ford/GM/whatever they call Chrysler nowadays.

 

[AZ Craig]

But, she's 12 now and just about to turn 100K. I'm retired and looking for another, but at $60K to get what I want...I may just drive her another 12 years.

Toyota reliability and value is second to none as far as I'm concerned. I would never even consider buying Ford/GM/whatever they call Chrysler nowadays.

That would be Stellantis.

Seriously, as long as rust isn't a problem for you and the price of new vehicles has gotten prohibitive, run the 4runner for longer as you mention. If anything is going to last for 20 years and 200k plus miles with some nominal investment to keep it going it is one of these older Toyota trucks.

I love newer technology and am not anti turbo, hybrid or EV like some of the members on this forum. But for all the downsides of a 5th gen, longevity and bulletproofness are probably its strongest suits. I have even wondered if I should just hang onto my 5th gen as a third car and get something more efficient with a 3rd row as our family and crap hauler. After all, 9 years from now I can give it to my oldest kid and if it is a third vehicle I would be surprised if we put more than 5k to 10k miles on it a year (baasically use it when we need the ruggedness and otherwise use a better tool). I know it will last, especially in Arizona where rust is a non factor.

 

[trainman605]

Since we are talking price here it is going to be interesting to see where all these vehicles go in the future, starting today with their higher prices. Now for me the price is not the biggest consideration when buying a new vehicle, as I buy what I want, but I don't throw my money away either. The wife and I usually buy the premium models in what we buy, be it a Lexus, or a Toyota model and trade around every five years with around 40,00/50,000 miles on our vehicles. This is probably because we are retired and don't drive that much but like to stay up scale on our vehicles. With Toyota and Lexus both adding new models to their model list it is going to interesting to see what sells and what doesn't, or should I say, will 4 Runner buyers move up to the Land Cruiser and will the Lexus Gx 460 buyers move up to the GX 550, big price difference between the two. As many of these vehicles are new and some haven't hit the market yet I don't think we can really tell what is going to happen for a year, or two.

 

[MAST4R]

There is no way I'll be able to afford one of the pricier versions of the 4runner. I have a 12 year old 2012 Trail edition that has been the best vehicle I have owned in my lifetime. Trips to the Blueridge Mountains, and west to the Tetons and another trip to the Bighorns, the vehicle failed to disappoint off road.

But, she's 12 now and just about to turn 100K. I'm retired and looking for another, but at $60K to get what I want...I may just drive her another 12 years.

Toyota reliability and value is second to none as far as I'm concerned. I would never even consider buying Ford/GM/whatever they call Chrysler nowadays.

I really don't see 12 years old as a problem for a 4Runner.

Right now, we are happy campers with 3 very different vehicles:

The 2018 4R, which has been perfectly set for offroading for years. I hope to drive it 20 years. It will be dedicated chiefly to adventure missions from now on.

The 2024 Model Y AWD which we just got at 0.99% for 72 mo basically free money, 1,300$ cost of loan over 6 years. It is amazing in town, gets me 30+ miles to the dollar in town vs 4.5 miles to the dollar in the 4R or Subaru, and should get some of the non-offroading summer vacations under the belt as well.

The 2008 Subaru Tribeca. We all need beaters, and this one has been extremely useful, always used on brutal short hops, and yet still going strong.


For anyone seriously interested in offroading plus long-distance driving, I still think the 4Runner/Tacoma/Land Cruiser 250 are the ticket.


But for general purposes not including offroading or real towing, my wife and I briefly looked at Toyota and used Lexus and Subaru and once we drove the Model Y, it was game over instantly. Everything else under 50k or so felt obsolete, not to mention slow lol.

 

[gomiami]

Then to top it off you have dealers putting several thousand of BS on their cars that they will not remove like nitrogen filled tires and other cash grabs like GPS locator theft systems. So then your $53K truck is actually a $57K truck with a bunch of dealer added crap on it.

Yeah. The 6th gen 4Runner and the GX550 are both going to get this treatment. On top of this, the port is getting into the habit, at least here in the KC region, of adding thousands of dollars of options as well.

With both the port and the dealership slapping on bloat, the final price will be not what people are expecting...or maybe even willing...to pay.