The DC has a "u-joint" on each....what makes you think those can't or haven't failed? I can see that the "center joint" wouldn't fail, but there are u-joints one each end of the DC. If I'm going to work on this thing I'm going to do it right the first time.....as a Toyota owner I'm obligated to.....
Rear Driveline
- Thread starter coues7
- Start date
nevada
Senior Member
we cant know that, you have the vehicle there. you need to check it.
you may not need anything more than some grease.
those joints can be repaired, remove the driveline, and take it to a driveline repair shop. I expect it will be cheaper than a new driveline, but, maybe not by much.
Nelsonmd
New member
We typically don't just refer to the "u-joints" in the DC as u-joints because they can't just be replaced like the rear u-joint can. But basically, yes, the DC has 2 u-joints in it as well and the center ball joint. The u-joints in the DC typically doesn't fail because they are under alot less stress than the rear u-joint (rear u-joint being the one at the diff end of the DS). They see 1/2 the angle of the rear u-joint, and have the added support of the center bearing. They are not quite a CV, but they are close enough that a DC is generally considered a CV.
You definitely need to get under there and confirm which joints it is. You do not want to just "preemptively" service the DC, you are liable to do more harm than good. Just grease it up good until it is puking new grease out as you pump more in. Same goes for the rear u-joint. the slip yoke, just put a couple of pumps in there as you don't want to pack the slip totally full of grease so that it can't compress.
Nelsonmd
New member
Don't just try to to twist it, shake the hell out of the back end, and visibly inspect it as best you can. You don't mention anything about how it looks. Maybe take some pictures of the rear u-joint and post them here. Try to get pics of the inside of the bearings, so close ups.
why is everybody saying the u joints in a double carden joint cant be replaced. as long as your centering device is good the joints can be replaced they are a pain but it can be done. I have done dodge and Chevy shafts and also some very large 400hp to 900hp pto double carden joints. remember when checking a drive line the vehicle has to be in neutral to unload the shaft.
Nelsonmd
New member
This isn't a dodge or chevy forum, it's a toyota 4runner forum. Other OEM's may have done the intelligent thing and used very standard u-joints in their DC's, but Toyota didn't, they used a very unique u-joint that never really made it to the aftermarket so there are very few (as far as I know, only 1 remaining) options for replacement. From my reading, Toyota used Matsuba joints, and while Matsuba did product them for the service market, they don't appear to anymore (or at least don't ship to the US anymore), leaving just rockland, and possibly a Koyo that no one seems to be able to find either.
We never said they can't be replaced (or at least I didn't), I just said that they are difficult to replace, and probably not feasible for a non-experienced weekend mechanic.
MStudt
official vendor
You are correct in saying that they replacement process is the exact same.
It doesn't matter what the forum is the process is the exact same. So, [MENTION=90588]riverview[/MENTION] was correct with his statement. It doesn't matter what the make or model is.
Fun fact for the day. Did you know that Low Range Offroad sells replacement u-joints to be used in place of the Matsuba u-joints? This u-joint can be used in various models 1979-2010. This u-joint will also work in our 3rd Gen's, but only in a DC set-up. These can not be used in a regulat CV set-up. I've talked with Low Range and was told these would work for the OP's application.
Low Range Offroad
Nelsonmd
New member
Yeah, I saw that too. I wasn't sure if it was actually Matsuba, or just a replacement for it. Also, their little compatibility table says for the 4runner rear "non CV". I took that to mean not the DC (usually considered a CV), so I thought maybe the 2wd doesn't have the DC (hence it fits the front and rear non-cv joints). If they confirmed that that u-joint fits the 4wd DC, then awesome, that is even better. Though it also says it fits both the front and rear of the rear DS, which can't be correct, because the rear u-joint is a common part, and not the same as the joints in the DC (or so I read at least, I haven't taken mine apart to verify). If it really is the same u-joint in the rear of the DS and in the DC, then some folks just played a big joke on us...
The point still stands though that this isn't as easy as the rear u-joint, and most people probably are not up to it, especially if they don't have the equipment. I saw in one of those threads I posted that someone did it with a rented ball joint press (actually I don't think my autozones/oreilleys rent that big a ball joint press...) and one did it by pounding them with a hammer, but my experience has been that neither of those will be sufficient, and you really do need a press (then again, I have more rust than most...)
Also, I think we have the outside c-clamp design, which one of those posts mentioned is much harder to remove the cups because you can't press them all the way out, and they had to make a weld-on slide hammer.
EDIT: Actually, if the picture on their site is the actual part, then that is the inside clip design. I guess I need to check if I have the inside or outside design...
EDIT 2: Looks in this pic like we do actually have the inside clip design, so maybe that trouble the guys mentions doesn't apply to us...
So I still have a question about their compatibility table and whether that joint is actually correct, but if it is, then this should be doable, but again, I think not for the casual weekend mechanic.
I still have that gut feeling that if I tried to replace mine, it will still be a nightmare somehow...
The point still stands though that this isn't as easy as the rear u-joint, and most people probably are not up to it, especially if they don't have the equipment. I saw in one of those threads I posted that someone did it with a rented ball joint press (actually I don't think my autozones/oreilleys rent that big a ball joint press...) and one did it by pounding them with a hammer, but my experience has been that neither of those will be sufficient, and you really do need a press (then again, I have more rust than most...)
Also, I think we have the outside c-clamp design, which one of those posts mentioned is much harder to remove the cups because you can't press them all the way out, and they had to make a weld-on slide hammer.
EDIT: Actually, if the picture on their site is the actual part, then that is the inside clip design. I guess I need to check if I have the inside or outside design...
EDIT 2: Looks in this pic like we do actually have the inside clip design, so maybe that trouble the guys mentions doesn't apply to us...
So I still have a question about their compatibility table and whether that joint is actually correct, but if it is, then this should be doable, but again, I think not for the casual weekend mechanic.
I still have that gut feeling that if I tried to replace mine, it will still be a nightmare somehow...
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MStudt
official vendor
Changing the u-joints can be challenging to say the least. If they have been changed before, then it's not that bog of a deal. If they have not, that is another story. I've had to use a torch and 10 ton shop press to change some. I wouldn't recommend changing these on your own if you've never done it before. After seeing how hard it is to find these u-joints, and how much they cost. I think I'd just buy a new shaft that has common u-joints in it, and allows you to rebuild them if needed.
MStudt
official vendor
Just came across this from High Angle Driveline. They state the Matsuba u-joints they now sell will work with both CV joints, and non CV joints. I sent them an email, just waiting to hear back.
*Edit. Came across some more information about the u-joints High Angle sells. Found the Matsuba part numbers we use, and they sell both.
Non CV: UJ-238 (The person I talked to at Low Range was not giving the correct information)
CV: UJ-236 (I'll verify once High Angle gets back to me)
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jgue467
Senior Member
MStudt
official vendor
Just heard from High Angle, and this is what they had to say.
"We do have a few left there 33.00 - as long as there inside clip . Jess 530-877-2875"
Jesse knows his stuff! This should clear everything up for the DC u-joint issue. Contact High Angle Driveline if you need the DC u-joints that everyone says aren't made.
[MENTION=49395]coues7[/MENTION] [MENTION=56021]Nelsonmd[/MENTION]
Well I put the runner in neutral, set the parking brake and climbed under the vehicle. It appears that the U-joints/DC are ok, but I have some serious backlash issues going on with my rear 3rd member. Not sure how much play is supposed to be in the transfer case but if I hold the rear pinion and try to turn the drive shaft there is no place. If I just grab the driveshaft and turn it I get about 1/2"-3/4" twist out of the driveline before the rear gears grab inside the diff 
I'm guessing I'm going to end up having to redo my 3rd member.
I'm guessing I'm going to end up having to redo my 3rd member.
MStudt
official vendor
Well I put the runner in neutral, set the parking brake and climbed under the vehicle. It appears that the U-joints/DC are ok, but I have some serious backlash issues going on with my rear 3rd member. Not sure how much play is supposed to be in the transfer case but if I hold the rear pinion and try to turn the drive shaft there is no place. If I just grab the driveshaft and turn it I get about 1/2"-3/4" twist out of the driveline before the rear gears grab inside the diff
IMO, you should not have that much!
nevada
Senior Member
Well I put the runner in neutral, set the parking brake and climbed under the vehicle. It appears that the U-joints/DC are ok, but I have some serious backlash issues going on with my rear 3rd member. Not sure how much play is supposed to be in the transfer case but if I hold the rear pinion and try to turn the drive shaft there is no place. If I just grab the driveshaft and turn it I get about 1/2"-3/4" twist out of the driveline before the rear gears grab inside the diff
does the yoke screw in/out as you turn it?
pull the dline, and make sure the pinion nut is tight.
Good question. I'll check on that.
I agree. I have some slip/twisting/backlash, at the transfer case as well. I don't know if this is normal or not. All I can say is that the driveline/u-joints feel tight.
Subscribed...
OP: I am having the same issues. A wha-wha-wha-wha sound at 40-45 mph. I can feel mine though the floor. I jacked up the rear end and I have some slip/twisting/backlash at both the transfer case and differential. The only difference is that if I really yank on the DC, I feel and hear a popping sound, like its moving a bit. No motion at the differential though.
OP: I am having the same issues. A wha-wha-wha-wha sound at 40-45 mph. I can feel mine though the floor. I jacked up the rear end and I have some slip/twisting/backlash at both the transfer case and differential. The only difference is that if I really yank on the DC, I feel and hear a popping sound, like its moving a bit. No motion at the differential though.
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