the toyo. dealership is putting new tires on at their cost for me. should i keep the 65 series or go to the 70s? i live in chicago. it snows in winter time. we dont get a whole lot, but i would like good snow traction. whats the consensus here? revos are pretty good to go with? what happens to gas mileage with 70 series vs 65s?
Revo's or Destination AT's
- Thread starter DTro
- Start date
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Even Steven
Guest
RoyB said:
Personally, I would stick with the 65s. I think the 70s look too bloated on the 4Runner, unless you have at leat a 2 inch lift. Thats just my opinion though, others may disagree.
All else equal, the 70 series tire will be heavier than the 65 series tire. More mass=heavier weight=higher rolling resistance(inertia)=lower fuel economy. In other words, if you don\'t want to decrease your fuel economy, stick with the stock size tires. In all honesty though, I doubt you would realize a noticeable loss of fuel economy with the bigger tires. You might even notice a bigger loss by choosing an AT tire with higher rolling resistance than the stock tires.
Uneek
Super Moderator
pipspeak said:
California chain requirements in detail.
Link.
I think since the highway will usually be shut down before 4WD/AWD are required to have chains, most 4WD/AWD owners don't have and carry chains. All of my boarding buddies that have 4WD/AWD don't have chains and they cite not having to deal with chains is why they sprung for a 4WD/AWD vehicle when I asked them about chains. I wonder what WRX and Evo owners are thinking when blasting up I80 with their summer tires.
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Even Steven
Guest
Hey guys, I did not want to start a major debate over this snowflake symbol thing. I was just expressing my own real world experiences.
I spend a lot of time in upstate NY every winter, so driving in snow is very common. Most of my friends have 4wd SUVs (or trucks), so I have a good idea about which tires work in snow and which ones do not.
Thai has a point when he says there are too many variables to make a 100 percent accurate conclusion, but I dont think it has to come down to a scientific conclusion for me to form my own opinion on how good an AT tire may work in snow.
If the tires with a snowflake symbol on them were regularly outpeforming the tires without the symbol, then I would probably agree that the symbol means something to me. On several occasions, I have witnessed identical vehicles using different tires on the same snowy trail and guess what? The vehicle with snowflake tires (that sounds funny!) has been repeatedly been left stuck behind.
But Thai is right about this: If I didnt have my own experiences, I would probably put more weight on the snowflake symbol before buying my next set of tires. Fortunately for me, I know better!
I spend a lot of time in upstate NY every winter, so driving in snow is very common. Most of my friends have 4wd SUVs (or trucks), so I have a good idea about which tires work in snow and which ones do not.
Thai has a point when he says there are too many variables to make a 100 percent accurate conclusion, but I dont think it has to come down to a scientific conclusion for me to form my own opinion on how good an AT tire may work in snow.
If the tires with a snowflake symbol on them were regularly outpeforming the tires without the symbol, then I would probably agree that the symbol means something to me. On several occasions, I have witnessed identical vehicles using different tires on the same snowy trail and guess what? The vehicle with snowflake tires (that sounds funny!) has been repeatedly been left stuck behind.
But Thai is right about this: If I didnt have my own experiences, I would probably put more weight on the snowflake symbol before buying my next set of tires. Fortunately for me, I know better!
Camprunner
New member
I missed some good posts on this one ........... I had to go out to Chicago on business "Great city had a good time"
Anyway to the subject I have mixed fealings on the M-on the Flake stamp I just think that there are some older tires on the market that are great in the snow that have never bin tested that are not a major brand .......... But then Tahi brings up a good point about what ells are the small tire Co's skimping on??
I think the hard thing is to pick a tire that is good in a mix of areas and not just one thing like snow. If I were to pick the best A/T snow tire then I would go back to the "Sport Kings" I ran on my Dodge but then I have to put up with the bad ride, bad wear, and bad noise.
Anyway to the subject I have mixed fealings on the M-on the Flake stamp I just think that there are some older tires on the market that are great in the snow that have never bin tested that are not a major brand .......... But then Tahi brings up a good point about what ells are the small tire Co's skimping on??
I think the hard thing is to pick a tire that is good in a mix of areas and not just one thing like snow. If I were to pick the best A/T snow tire then I would go back to the "Sport Kings" I ran on my Dodge but then I have to put up with the bad ride, bad wear, and bad noise.
Thai
Elite Member
Here is a list of snowflake tires on TireRack: http://www.tirerack.com/images/winter/TiresSuitableforSevereSnow.pdf
As stated in the article above, Oregon state allows the substitution of studs with a snowflake tire.
Most would agree that Nokian tires are good winter tires. Their website (along with EVERY snow tire manufacturer) fully endorses this snowflake symbol as a standard in severe snow conditions. In fact, if you do a search on GOOGLE, then you will see that not a single person/website is against this standard or have found any fault with this.
Oh well, i guess that i have posted enough about this....
As stated in the article above, Oregon state allows the substitution of studs with a snowflake tire.
Most would agree that Nokian tires are good winter tires. Their website (along with EVERY snow tire manufacturer) fully endorses this snowflake symbol as a standard in severe snow conditions. In fact, if you do a search on GOOGLE, then you will see that not a single person/website is against this standard or have found any fault with this.
Oh well, i guess that i have posted enough about this....
Koz
New member
Falls said:
None taken! I ran them on the same truck (2WD Tacoma w/supercharger, which has a SERIOUS traction problem). Comparing them on different vehicles is apples and oranges. The KOs were as good, at first, but after 20K miles they were slipping and sliding badly. They were also hydroplaning badly. The REVOs never hydroplaned. I think the biggest difference between them is that the REVO uses a dual compound that really makes a difference when they have some miles on them. I can remember my neighbor laughing at me because I could not move my truck from the street, with about 3 inches of snow on the ground. I would bust his balls when I would see him always working on his Ford pick-up and his Harley.
Koz
Thai
Elite Member
Koz said:
Why do you think the REVOs do not have the snowflake symbol?? The Bridgestone Blizzards have it...so, it shows that Bridgestone does subject their tires to the test. And Bridgestone is not a small company. REVOs just came out a few years ago with great expectations...thus, REVOs have no excuse other than the fact that REVOs are not as good in snow/ice as the snowflake tires.
In fact, if you look on Bridgestone website, then you will see that Bridgestone does indeed advertise this on their winter tires.
What is your take on it??
Koz
New member
Thai said:
I don't understand what your problem is with REVOs (and Toyota) but somehow in your mind you think REVOs are a failure. Despite what you may think of REVOs they are a great success and the people that own them have shown that they are very satisfied. I guess because you feel the KOs are the best tire in the world, no other tire can be better, even when THOUSANDS of owners of BOTH tires feel the REVOs are better in most aspects. I can admit that the KOs are more durable for rocky off-roading and they last a little longer but overall the REVOs are a better all-round tire, even without the snowflake (and majority of owners of both agree).
Koz
It was not like apples to oranges , they were both suv's , Tahoe had BFG , Revo on the 4R.
Pick up trucks ( especially yours ) are a totally different animal , then your comparing apples to oranges.
I've had BFG's on many of truck's and never experienced those issues of hydro , no more than any other tire. I've been running them for 25 years. My uncle got me started on them as he was the V.P. of BFG for 20+ years. Everytime I wanted new tires I just took a road trip to Ohio and .... DONE , and until about 10 years ago I never paid for 1 set.
As for the Revo dual compound ??? its all subject I guess , I do like them in wet weather but thats all since I think they suck in snow from day 1, but that also subject to the type of snow. I was extremely disappointed in them. I dont take much stock in their dual-compound sales pitch. My tires after 27k miles are worn low enough I will swap them by fall.
I'm never going to say BFG is the best at all , as a matter of fact there are alot of others I would like to try but can't afford to do that.....lol.
I stopped today to look at some GY Silent Armor tires , they look real nice , naturally I got the best of tire sales pitch....yada,yada...whatever.
The Revos are an ok tire , my local (BS) dealer even told me they were more of an all season tire than an all terrain tire when I talked about off roading..... again whatever...... Everyone has their opinion and sales pitch.
I was just expecting superior snow traction when I got them from all the hype here. I do believe in severe weather ratings with tire's. I don't think its a gimmick at all , but your own real life experience is always the best guide. Some people just try to justify their purchase in some of the reviews .
Next tires I will put 4 different ones on 4 different corners of my truck........ then I can argue points about all different brands...........lol.
Pick up trucks ( especially yours ) are a totally different animal , then your comparing apples to oranges.
I've had BFG's on many of truck's and never experienced those issues of hydro , no more than any other tire. I've been running them for 25 years. My uncle got me started on them as he was the V.P. of BFG for 20+ years. Everytime I wanted new tires I just took a road trip to Ohio and .... DONE , and until about 10 years ago I never paid for 1 set.
As for the Revo dual compound ??? its all subject I guess , I do like them in wet weather but thats all since I think they suck in snow from day 1, but that also subject to the type of snow. I was extremely disappointed in them. I dont take much stock in their dual-compound sales pitch. My tires after 27k miles are worn low enough I will swap them by fall.
I'm never going to say BFG is the best at all , as a matter of fact there are alot of others I would like to try but can't afford to do that.....lol.
I stopped today to look at some GY Silent Armor tires , they look real nice , naturally I got the best of tire sales pitch....yada,yada...whatever.
The Revos are an ok tire , my local (BS) dealer even told me they were more of an all season tire than an all terrain tire when I talked about off roading..... again whatever...... Everyone has their opinion and sales pitch.
I was just expecting superior snow traction when I got them from all the hype here. I do believe in severe weather ratings with tire's. I don't think its a gimmick at all , but your own real life experience is always the best guide. Some people just try to justify their purchase in some of the reviews .
Next tires I will put 4 different ones on 4 different corners of my truck........ then I can argue points about all different brands...........lol.
Koz said:
Thai
Elite Member
Koz said:
As stated previously, i don't really have a problem with REVOs or Toyota...i have a problem with your blind enthusiasm. You need to look at things with an open mind and without bias. I love Toyota...as evidenced by what i have in my garage. But, they are not without faults either. I am like Fox News...fair and balance!
Your statements/arguments are usually full of holes (LS as benchmark, or IS as class-leader, REVOs the best AT tire, TireRack feedback is without faults, etc.).
BTW, if you notice, then you will see that i recommend either Goodyear Wrangler SA or BFG AT KO, depending on their needs for an AT tire.
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Even Steven
Guest
One thing that really bothers me about this snowflake symbol thing is that there are so many different types of conditions that we must drive in the winter.
How does the test work? Do they actually test in snow? If so, what type of snow? Is it dry snow? Wet snow? How deep is the snow? An inch or two? Ten inches? How cold? Well below freezing or just below freezing? What type of road conditions? Asphalt? Concrete? See my point? There are just so many variables to consider.
Does anyone know the specifics of the testing procedures? I am curious to know.
How does the test work? Do they actually test in snow? If so, what type of snow? Is it dry snow? Wet snow? How deep is the snow? An inch or two? Ten inches? How cold? Well below freezing or just below freezing? What type of road conditions? Asphalt? Concrete? See my point? There are just so many variables to consider.
Does anyone know the specifics of the testing procedures? I am curious to know.
