Rotor Resurface?? is it needed?

JLMXD

New member
Ok went to the dealer today. Everything good except i need new brakes. all 4 pads were at 3mm. but they also said I need to resurface the rotors. The inspection sheet said my rotors with in the 12-7mm range which should be fine. so are they pulling one on me or is this a normal thing.

129k miles are on the car. bought it 3 years ago it had 80k on it then.

thanks for your help

FYI they want $344 for the front and $337 for rear, good or bad price?
 
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Ok went to the dealer today. Everything good except i need new brakes. all 4 pads were at 3mm. but they also said I need to resurface the rotors. The inspection sheet said my rotors with in the 12-7mm range which should be fine. so are they pulling one on me or is this a normal thing.

129k miles are on the car. bought it 3 years ago it had 80k on it then.

thanks for your help

FYI they want $344 for the front and $337 for rear, good or bad price?

Dealerships quote crazy prices. Can you do the work yourself? If not, find a good independent shop to do it for half that.
 
The thickness of your rotor will tell you whether the rotor can be resurfaced.

The difference in thickness across the rotor faces will tell you whether it should be resurfaced. As a general rule of thumb, I usually do resurface the rotors. It ensures that the rotor is flat.
 
I've never resurfaced rotors. Just bed new pads into them, or if the rotors are that bad, its just a few bucks more for brand new ones. Not worth the time/money, specially if it's your only vehicle.
 
Not that hard to change brakes and rotors just search youtube. I just changed the wifes gx470 front/back rotors and pads 2 days ago. Also bleed/flush the the brakes dot 4. Took me about 3-4hrs. Bought pads/rotors at rockauto cost around $ 220. I change rotors instead of resurface due cost of resurfacing is almost the same as new unless you install high performance brakes/ rotors. Even then cheaper than dealership.

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Those prices are ridiculous. I believe some auto parts stores will do it for you for $30 each which is tons cheaper. New rotors from those stores range around $50 a piece anyway so for the price they gave you I'd just buy new ones and DIY

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I stopped resurfacing rotors 15 years ago and have never had any noticeable braking degradation because of it. The plus side, besides saving money, is that the rotors will easily last 200,000 miles if you don't grind .010" off of them every time you change pads.

Shops usually like to resurface the rotors because (a) it's another job they can charge for, and (b) it covers them for the odd case when they actually need it, If they don't do it and a customer complains, the shop can wind up having to do the job over at their cost.

If you're replacing pads yourself, the economics are different. It's easy to replace the pads and then go for a test drive and safely check braking performance. If it's good (and for me it always has been), you're done. If you do have issues like pulsing or pulling, then you can come back and redo the rotors as well.

Generally though, if the brakes are operating smoothly with old pads, they'll perform the same way with the new pads.
 
Steer clear from the dealership and find a good local mechanic to do the work. My mechanic replaced all brake pads, turned the rotors ($20ea) and replaced both front calipers that had seized up on me for around $700.
 
Eh I have to disagree with those saying resurfacing isn't needed.

The basic premise here is to return the rotor's surface to a clean, relatively rough surface compared to those that have been worn in.

What many people these days do not realize is that rotors do not really "warp" but rather the uneven surface/pulsation is actually caused by the brake pads vitrifying on the rotor itself. Braking systems work by friction, over time with heat and pressure the rotors and pads develop a smooth "glass-like" surface. Depending on the severity of the surface it can be something as mild as an annoying squeak at low speeds (ever rubbed two pieces of glass together?) to something a serious as reduced braking performance and pulsation (again, every tried to rub two pieces of glass vs. two bricks?)

Replacing just the pads means your rotors still have that smooth, glassy, baked finish (from minute amounts of brake pad material vitrifying onto the rotor's surface and filling it in), it's not entirely horrible if you're in a pinch. But realistically speaking you're hamstringing your own braking system and vehicle by doing only half the job. You want to resurface the rotors so that the bare metal is clean, relatively smooth (in terms of run-out), and ready for that gritty pad to grip it. When it comes to brakes it's 100% about friction and nothing else. Rubbing sandpaper on a sheet of glass isn't going to be as "grippy" as rubbing sandpaper on soft metal like cast iron.

Resurfacing vs. Replacing rotors comes down to how much effort you want to spend and if the rotors can be resurfaced. Usually you have about 4~5mm of leeway from brand-new to "minimum turn-to specification", that may not sound like much, but a good resurfacing on a rotor with very little run-out is going to be in the .010" range, which is .25mm; as long as your rotors don't need to be turned too heavily due to run-out issues, you should easily see 150k-ish on factory rotors (I'm at 127k on my originals and have done brakes and resurfaced them.)

Additionally $350 per axle isn't that outrageous for dealer pricing. You're looking at about 1.5~2hrs of flat rate labor per axle (typical labor charged by many shops) and the cost of the brake pads. We'll say typically dealership labor is in the $120~150 area depending on where you are and the cost of the pads at dealer mark-up could be around $50~80. So that pricing sounds about right for dealership.

If you're talking about independent shops, the labor will most likely be about the same; the savings comes from their lower labor rated (though honestly with how the industry is right now, some areas are almost dealer price because they've had to come up and dealers have had to come down to be competitive and turn a profit, so pricing is more regional) and cheaper parts. Now I'm not knocking aftermarket parts, but there's a lot of cheap crap out there that squeaks, glazes up fast, and doesn't perform as good as factory (even if the box says it does). So do your research on aftermarket parts, don't just slap on the cheapest stuff you can find, I have always maintained that the two main things an owner is absolutely stupid and irresponsible for doing is skimping on tires and brakes; they are literally the two things that hold you to the road and stop you. Put cheap tires and brake pads on your vehicle to save a couple bucks and you may find that when you need to make that emergency stop to avoid that car you'll lose traction on your cheap tires and your cheap brakes will not be as good at stopping the vehicle in time. So be smart, do your research and find the best stuff for the best price even if that means spending a bit more than "Jimmy John's Cheapie Brake Pads, Stops'em gud!"

Additionally there was (and I believe still might be) a rash of Chinese brake pads and rotors that were fracturing and literally disintegrating one peoples vehicles in the last 5 years or so. I am not sure if that's been taken care of, but keep that possibility in mind when you look at those no-name brands; stick to established brands.

IF You don't want to pay a dealership/shop to resurface your rotors. You can probably find good pads and rotors to slap on yourself for about 1/2~2/3 the cost of what was quoted per axle and will be as good as new.

You can do the job half-assed and shrug your shoulders and say "it didn't hurt me none" until the one time it does; or you can do it right in my honest opinion. You'd be pissed at me if I as a technician half-assed a repair on your vehicle, why wouldn't you be pissed at yourself for doing the same?
 
Rotors are cheap.

Cheap rotor are cheaper. Quality rotors are a bit more.

OP: Your labor is free. The dealer will cut into your beverage and entertainment budget. It's your brakes your life but my kids you might hit. If there's any doubt here it off to the dealer please.
 
Cheap rotor are cheaper. Quality rotors are a bit more.

OP: Your labor is free. The dealer will cut into your beverage and entertainment budget. It's your brakes your life but my kids you might hit. If there's any doubt here it off to the dealer please.




That is the mechanics job, installing doubt ! No but really it happens, technology changes and the same automotive assumptions that worked for years are either not valid or directly the opposite of what should be done...does install some doubt but its why we have the forums to figure out based on real world experience....

The great thing about cars is consumable parts are designed to be interchanged, and generally they only go back together one way.

Doing my own since I knew what I was doing! I drive like a crazy teenager and I am hard as hell on brakes, so I get lots of practice !
 
Cheap rotor are cheaper. Quality rotors are a bit more.

OP: Your labor is free. The dealer will cut into your beverage and entertainment budget. It's your brakes your life but my kids you might hit. If there's any doubt here it off to the dealer please.

Even quality rotors aren't that expensive. For that price he could buy new rotors and pads off RockAuto and probably have a local shop do the labor and still come out cheaper.
 
I stopped resurfacing rotors 15 years ago and have never had any noticeable braking degradation because of it. The plus side, besides saving money, is that the rotors will easily last 200,000 miles if you don't grind .010" off of them every time you change pads.
you have never had "warped" rotors, or pulsating brakes in the last 15 years?
impressive....

well it sounds like I just need pads. appreciate the input
not if you want it done correctly.

with every pad change, you need to address the rotors also. either by resurfacing if they are thick enough, or replacing if they are not.

Eh I have to disagree with those saying resurfacing isn't needed.

The basic premise here is to return the rotor's surface to a clean, relatively rough surface compared to those that have been worn in.

What many people these days do not realize is that rotors do not really "warp" but rather the uneven surface/pulsation is actually caused by the brake pads vitrifying on the rotor itself. Braking systems work by friction, over time with heat and pressure the rotors and pads develop a smooth "glass-like" surface. Depending on the severity of the surface it can be something as mild as an annoying squeak at low speeds (ever rubbed two pieces of glass together?) to something a serious as reduced braking performance and pulsation (again, every tried to rub two pieces of glass vs. two bricks?)

Replacing just the pads means your rotors still have that smooth, glassy, baked finish (from minute amounts of brake pad material vitrifying onto the rotor's surface and filling it in), it's not entirely horrible if you're in a pinch. But realistically speaking you're hamstringing your own braking system and vehicle by doing only half the job. You want to resurface the rotors so that the bare metal is clean, relatively smooth (in terms of run-out), and ready for that gritty pad to grip it. When it comes to brakes it's 100% about friction and nothing else. Rubbing sandpaper on a sheet of glass isn't going to be as "grippy" as rubbing sandpaper on soft metal like cast iron.

Resurfacing vs. Replacing rotors comes down to how much effort you want to spend and if the rotors can be resurfaced. Usually you have about 4~5mm of leeway from brand-new to "minimum turn-to specification", that may not sound like much, but a good resurfacing on a rotor with very little run-out is going to be in the .010" range, which is .25mm; as long as your rotors don't need to be turned too heavily due to run-out issues, you should easily see 150k-ish on factory rotors (I'm at 127k on my originals and have done brakes and resurfaced them.)

Additionally $350 per axle isn't that outrageous for dealer pricing. You're looking at about 1.5~2hrs of flat rate labor per axle (typical labor charged by many shops) and the cost of the brake pads. We'll say typically dealership labor is in the $120~150 area depending on where you are and the cost of the pads at dealer mark-up could be around $50~80. So that pricing sounds about right for dealership.

If you're talking about independent shops, the labor will most likely be about the same; the savings comes from their lower labor rated (though honestly with how the industry is right now, some areas are almost dealer price because they've had to come up and dealers have had to come down to be competitive and turn a profit, so pricing is more regional) and cheaper parts. Now I'm not knocking aftermarket parts, but there's a lot of cheap crap out there that squeaks, glazes up fast, and doesn't perform as good as factory (even if the box says it does). So do your research on aftermarket parts, don't just slap on the cheapest stuff you can find, I have always maintained that the two main things an owner is absolutely stupid and irresponsible for doing is skimping on tires and brakes; they are literally the two things that hold you to the road and stop you. Put cheap tires and brake pads on your vehicle to save a couple bucks and you may find that when you need to make that emergency stop to avoid that car you'll lose traction on your cheap tires and your cheap brakes will not be as good at stopping the vehicle in time. So be smart, do your research and find the best stuff for the best price even if that means spending a bit more than "Jimmy John's Cheapie Brake Pads, Stops'em gud!"

Additionally there was (and I believe still might be) a rash of Chinese brake pads and rotors that were fracturing and literally disintegrating one peoples vehicles in the last 5 years or so. I am not sure if that's been taken care of, but keep that possibility in mind when you look at those no-name brands; stick to established brands.

IF You don't want to pay a dealership/shop to resurface your rotors. You can probably find good pads and rotors to slap on yourself for about 1/2~2/3 the cost of what was quoted per axle and will be as good as new.

You can do the job half-assed and shrug your shoulders and say "it didn't hurt me none" until the one time it does; or you can do it right in my honest opinion. You'd be pissed at me if I as a technician half-assed a repair on your vehicle, why wouldn't you be pissed at yourself for doing the same?
agreed. thanks. I get so tired of typing this out every couple months...

Even quality rotors aren't that expensive. For that price he could buy new rotors and pads off RockAuto and probably have a local shop do the labor and still come out cheaper.
more expensive than having them resurfaced.

though, I saw some people above mentioned $30 each? that's insane. we charge $12.50. you aren't buying quality rotors for less than $15. hell, I doubt you can even get them for less than $30...
 
A lot of this has been said, but if you have high quality rotors in good condition, you may not have to turn them. However, if they have any warping, it could be amplified by the new pads and cause a shimmy, vibration when braking, which means fixing it again by turning or replacing the rotors. I notice that many new car rotors tend to warp easily.

Either way, the rotors and calipers will need to be cleaned really well. The reason I like to do my own brake work, is I know a mechanic won't take the time to properly lubricate the pistons and clean the brake gunk like I will. (Same philosophy for anything really-from a $$ standpoint, I'm better off letting a mechanic do it, but I know I'll ensure it is done right. I have seen too many cars have major problems due to bad mechanics (engine failures due to wrong filters, accidents due to improper brake repairs, engine failures due to improperly installed timing belts, engine full of oil due to overtightened oil filters (that was my tacoma, and it was the last time I let a dealer touch any of my cars).

The first time I replaced by brakes on my 4runner I did not replace the rotors. 20,000 miles later I replaced the rotors and half worn pads due to vibration.

On my older vehicles, the rotors seemed thicker and didn't seem to warp as much.

New CAFE standards seem to have car manufacturers make weight reductions wherever they can, including rotor size. The lighter rotors have less metal and more cooling fins, which equals more frequent maintenance or replacement. For me personally, I would rather use some Advance Auto coupons, get some decent rotors for a good price, and replace them every time.
 

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