Rotors replaced. Wobbling Steering Wheel Again...

swampy_swimmer

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I had this problem a while ago and I replaced front rotors and pads with Centric part rotors and matching pads about 15K miles ago. Maybe less.
Now I have the same issue when brake from 35-40mph speed. My steering wheel dances in my hands.
Is it possible for the rotors to be warped that fast again? Those Centric parts rotors had some Kryo coating on them, that supposedly resist all the warping for a long time.
Might it be a deeper issue then just rotors/pads?
 
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What size tires are you running? My 99 has always done it to a certain extent... But, I had it pretty tolerable until I put 285's on and it got a little worse


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Standard factory size. 265/16, if I'm not mistaken. But whatever factory standard, that I have.
Do you think they need to be rebalanced? Can rotors/pads go bad due to misbalanced tires?
 
Do u have the ability to measure the rotor run out to find your answer.

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The issue is probably your rear brakes...Yeah, I said it, rear brakes.

Here's what happens. Most 4Runner owners neglect the REAR brakes on their truck because they don't make much noise, they aren't very visible and most people don't know how to adjust drums brakes. Most rear brakes just wear until they are ineffective and we don't really notice the difference.

The rear drums are designed to do 30-40% of the total braking. The rear drums on most 4Runners are badly out of adjustment and neglected.

In turn, that causes the front brakes to do 90% of the total braking and the rotors warp prematurely.

So, Toyota gets blamed for a poor design and the owner installs Tundra front discs....BUT, this causes unintended problems. (Yes, I'm ready to be flamed, shot down, burned in effigy, etc).

The Tundra setup increases what engineers refer to as "unsprung weight." Ask an engineer about unsprung weight - it's not, uh, desirable.

Also, if the rear brakes are poorly adjusted the Tundra brakes are doing too much of the front braking and that's not good; it produces "throttle-off oversteer." (the rear of the truck wants to be in front, again, undesirable).

The solution isn't a fun answer because involves proper maintenance and adjustment. It's not fun because it doesn't involved upgrades or neato aftermarket parts.

The best solution is this: replace or turn your rear drums and replace the shoes with FACTORY parts. Make sure the rear drums are adjusted by someone who knows how to adjust drum brakes. Adjust them yearly, it's easier than you think. Then replace the front rotors and pads with factory parts. If you do this the right way I guarantee your front brakes will last 40-50,000+ miles. I had 70,000 since my last brake job.

The metallurgy on the factory rotors is far superior to the after market stuff, including the super-plasmatic-injected-cross-drilled, blah, blah, blah (you get it).

(And for the Tundra brake guys who think it was THE solution from everything from their truck probs and to saving their marriage - no offense intended).
 
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The rear drums are self adjusting. If they are too far out of adjustment, then a little ratchet clicks over to the next pawl on the adjuster and cranks it out a notch more.

My wife went through the same issue on her '96. It developed a shudder under braking. She replaced the rotors with new (Brembo branded). The shudder went away.

15K later, and it was back. Replaced them with a Tundra 231 upgrade that time, and it's been good ever since. Perhaps... 100K miles or so since then? (I'd have to look in her YT build thread to see for sure).

When I got my 99, it developed a shudder fairly early on as well. I didn't replace with stock rotors the first time around, learned from her experience and did the Tundra 231 upgrade. About 40K miles later, they're still working perfectly.

I think a big part of who warps the stock brakes and who doesn't is just down to driving conditions and driver's driving style. We live next to an arterial highway with 50 mph speed limits and stoplights and hills. You're frequently hauling the car down from 55 mph to a stop, headed downhill. It's just a bit more than the stock smaller brakes were intended to handle, I think.
 
OK, I should have added: the supposedly self adjusting rear brakes don't work.

I've had my eyes on about 10,000 brakes jobs in my life and I assure you, almost all 4Runner rear drums are out of adjustment.

Most of the time bubba pops off the rear drum and then announces with much fanfare; "heh, they got plenty of meat on 'em." then Bubba replaced the drum with adjusting the rear brakes and then you're off.

Poor maintenance is your cause.
 
The issue is probably your rear brakes...Yeah, I said it, rear brakes.
The best solution is this: replace or turn your rear drums and replace the shoes with FACTORY parts.

Previous owner of my vehicle had this done (front and rear break adjustment) by a dealer, they turned stock rotors back then for him. I'm not sure what they did exactly to the rear breaks, but it was at 91K.
I replaced my rotors at 115K (I think). Now I'm at 130K and back to sq. 1....
 
OK, I should have added: the supposedly self adjusting rear brakes don't work.

I've had my eyes on about 10,000 brakes jobs in my life and I assure you, almost all 4Runner rear drums are out of adjustment.

Most of the time bubba pops off the rear drum and then announces with much fanfare; "heh, they got plenty of meat on 'em." then Bubba replaced the drum with adjusting the rear brakes and then you're off.

Poor maintenance is your cause.

If your hand brake works, then the rear brakes are adequately adjusted. Granted, people with automatic transmissions probably don't use the handbrake much, both our 4Runners are manual trans.

Radically out of adjustment rear brakes will also cause more brake pedal travel, which most drivers would notice and not in a good way.

I recently replaced both rear shoes on my '99 because the passenger side had been contaminated with leaking axle oil. Well, that and that pivot on the left side that splits the handbrake tension between left and right wheels was sticking. In any case, new shoes on both sides, put the drums on with the adjustments way loose. Then I sat in the driver's seat and just up-and-downed the handbrake about 20 or 30 times, until it firmed up nicely. Adjustment: done.
 
If your hand brake works, then the rear brakes are adequately adjusted.

Sorry my friend, that statement is not true.

Out of adjustment rear brakes would NOT cause excess pedal travel. That's not how hydraulic systems work.

The increased travel in the slave cylinder would be equalized by more brake fluid entering the master cylinder from the reservoir.
 
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Sorry my friend, that statement is not true.

Out of adjustment rear brakes would NOT cause excess pedal travel. That's not how hydraulic systems work.

The increased travel in the slave cylinder would be equalized by more brake fluid entering the master cylinder from the reservoir.

I have a 1963 car that has manually adjusted drum brakes. It used to have them all the way around, until I swapped some discs onto the front.

As they went out of adjustment, the pedal travel would increase. To the point you'd have to 'pump' the brake quickly. Adjust them, and the travel decreased.

Once you depress the brake pedal even a little, the piston moves and cuts off the small hole leading to the reservoir. At that point, more fluid cen't enter the system. If it did, it would somehow have to flow in from the unpressurized reservoir and into the pressurized brake system (pressure caused by the piston being pushed).

Out of adjustment means there's too much slack at the back brakes, which in turn means that more fluid needs to be pushed into the system to shove the brake shoes out far enough to engage the drum. Disc brakes are self adjusting because there's nothing really forcing the pads to retract from the rotor, once extra fluid has been pushed into the calipers to account for wear on the pads, they jsut stay that further bit out.

But drum brakes are different. The shoes have springs on them. Any extra fluid required to push them out far enough to hit the drums doesn't stay, it gets forced back to the reservoir once the pedal is fully released, by those hefty springs on the shoes. You have to push that extra fluid each time, which results in more pedal travel. Unless the adjuster holds the shoes further out.

And like I said, the 4Runner automatic adjusters do work, unless someone has taken them apart and put them back together wrong. I put mine together loose as can be, and after 20/30/40 pulls on the handbrake the snugged up properly. You could feel it happening. The first 2/3rds or so the handbrake was going full travel, no resistance at the top. Then it started to hit resistance at the top, and slowly worked its way down to roughly mid stroke, where it stopped changing. Fully adjusted. This also happens automatically when you use the brakes, any time the shoes move too far, a lever reaches out past the next pawl and pulls it back, tightening the adjuster one 'notch'.
 
It's not your rotors, it's your lug nuts. Don't use an impact on them, tighten them to torque spec, and I guarantee the shimmy will stop. Did it on mine a few days ago
 
It's not your rotors, it's your lug nuts. Don't use an impact on them, tighten them to torque spec, and I guarantee the shimmy will stop. Did it on mine a few days ago

That is unusually interesting...
I actually never seen any repair or tire shop around here using torque wrench for anything, let alone wheels...
 
What kind of pads did you use?

Most of the time the shimmy isn't really warped rotors, it's deposits left on the rotors by cheap pads.

You can test this by getting the brakes good and hot and see if it comes off. Take the truck up to 60 or 70MPH and do several hard stops in a row, until you start to get brake fade. Then keep driving and give the rotors time to cool down, and repeat. Sometimes that will take it off.
 
That is unusually interesting...
I actually never seen any repair or tire shop around here using torque wrench for anything, let alone wheels...

I've been to some discount tire's that have torque limiter stick thingies when they hit the lug nuts with an impact.
 

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