Something doesn't seem right (new CV)

[viggen337]

So as some of you may know, I've spent the last few days replacing the CV axles on my 4Runner in between work and crappy weather. The driver side went smoothly once I had the clip facing the correct direction, and I had the passenger side 99% finished late last night. The only thing left was to install the spindle nut retainer and cotter pin. I dropped them in the dark last night, so I just waited until today to put them on, since I was planning to fill up the front diff, anyway.

This afternoon, I went to install the retainer and cotter pin, when I discovered that the CV axle isn't fully seated into the hub. I had already torqued the spindle nut to 174 ft. lbs, but there isn't enough room to install the retainer and cotter pin, because the hole is not out far enough past the nut. The CV axle is sitting about 1/4" too far out of the hub, compared to the driver side, and it will not go in any further.

:wtf:

I took everything apart and retried, and it still sits at the same place. What gives? I don't want to destroy my new CV or my wheel bearings, so I'm not driving it at all until I get this resolved. I hope I haven't already destroyed something by torquing that nut down before the axle was fully seated. I had no problems like this on the driver side.

Anyone ever have this happen? I really need to be able to drive this tomorrow and at this point, I am fed up with what should have been a pretty straightforward repair. :ybrick:

Any help would be appreciated. I will add a few pics in a minute.

 

[viggen337]

Here's a few pictures for reference.

Driver side:


Passenger side (the seal is still visible):


Spindle nut before I removed it. It was already properly torqued:


Here you can see how little space there is for the cotter pin to fit:


Here's the end of the CV axle:

 

[cmoua]

Something is not adding up here. Either you got the wrong axle or something is binding in the axle. Do you have the original axle that you can compare to to ensure the same length? I didn't see the axle rubber booth stretch out yet you mentioned you torqued the nut to 170 ft-lbs. With that much torque I would expect the rubber booth to stretch out. Are the axle the same size for the passenger and driver side? If not maybe it's installed on the wrong side? Don't know if this helps?

 

[BlackWorksInc]

What are you using to torque it down? Normally I'll hit them with an impact wrench because trying to do it with a breaker bar doesn't pull the axle through the splines enough if their gummed up with rust and such.

Try taking a wire brush and scrubbing the new splines and old hub splines, then lightly oil them. If you have a large socket that fits OVER the axle shaft you can try hammering it some to get it to seat a little better.

 

[viggen337]

Yes, both axles are the correct ones, and they are the same. I checked each one as I swapped them.

I used my 1/2" air impact wrench to tighten the nut, then followed it up with my Craftsman 1/2" drive 25-250 ft. lb. digital torque wrench, a present I bought myself for not spending $750+ for my local shop to do this job. I felt a very clear, solid click on all the bolts that I torqued.

I'll take a shot at giving the splines a thorough cleaning with a wire brush. I used brake cleaner, but didn't really scrape it with anything.

I will also try hammering the hub using the socket since a rubber mallet doesn't seem to be cutting it. I know I shouldn't hammer directly on the axle, I certainly don't want to have to pull it all apart to retrieve seals from the differential. I'll use my 35mm impact socket over the axle and give it some light taps with my 4-lb engineering hammer.

I just left my local dealer parts department. I ordered two new axle nuts, since those are not supposed to be reused. I will have to put the new ones on when they come in on Thursday.

Thanks so far for the quick replies, I'll keep everybody posted.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

If you are going to hammer the axle out, do it the right way; use either a drift in the divet in the center of the axle shaft, or thread the axle nut over the threads (I would use the old one) and hammer on the nut.
The idea behind using the socket over the axle is to beat on the hub to push it in, wish you the best of luck.

 

[Love4myRunner]

My new axle sits the same way and I don't know why either... been like that for over a month now but nothing is leaking. Only issue I have is during turns I can feel and hear the axle boot rubbing or stretching. Not sure. Hope you solve this issue because mine sits the exact same way.

 

[viggen337]

My new axle sits the same way and I don't know why either... been like that for over a month now but nothing is leaking. Only issue I have is during turns I can feel and hear the axle boot rubbing or stretching. Not sure. Hope you solve this issue because mine sits the exact same way.

Jay, were you able to put the cotter pin in yours?

Just an update for everyone:

I didn't get much time to work on it tonight, since I have to get up at 0300 for work. I will be out there first thing tomorrow when I get home around 1200.

I did try to remove it again when I got home so I could at least clean everything before it got too dark, but the axle is completely stuck in the hub. My old one was in there for who knows how long, and it wasn't that hard to remove.

Tomorrow I will see what I can do with it. I don't have any brass drifts, and the closest thing I have is a set of cold chisels and center punches. I don't think those will be much use unless I want to destroy something.

It figures that I was just at Harbor Freight on Sunday, and they're about an hour away from me. I'll have to see if my local Napa has something. I know Lowe's, Home Depot, Advance Auto, and Autozone don't have those. If all else fails, I'll just put one of the old nuts back on and hammer it out that way, as gently as possible.

If anyone has any other input, please keep it coming. I will update you all sometime tomorrow after I take another crack at it. Thanks for all the advice, so far. You guys rock!

:cheers:

 

[97hb]

I used a little Castro synthetic grease on the lip that slides into the hub and also on the splines. Slid right in. Don't get any on rotors or pads.

 

[viggen337]

Okay, I just got home from work, and it is beautiful outside, finally! I will be out there within the hour to see if I can make some progress today.

Didn't have much luck tracking down brass drifts locally, so I will use the old nut to tap it out. Hopefully after a thorough cleaning with a wire brush, and another good greasing, I'll be able to get it fully seated.

Wish me luck!

 

[Love4myRunner]

Jay, were you able to put the cotter pin in yours?

Just an update for everyone:

I didn't get much time to work on it tonight, since I have to get up at 0300 for work. I will be out there first thing tomorrow when I get home around 1200.

I did try to remove it again when I got home so I could at least clean everything before it got too dark, but the axle is completely stuck in the hub. My old one was in there for who knows how long, and it wasn't that hard to remove.

Tomorrow I will see what I can do with it. I don't have any brass drifts, and the closest thing I have is a set of cold chisels and center punches. I don't think those will be much use unless I want to destroy something.

It figures that I was just at Harbor Freight on Sunday, and they're about an hour away from me. I'll have to see if my local Napa has something. I know Lowe's, Home Depot, Advance Auto, and Autozone don't have those. If all else fails, I'll just put one of the old nuts back on and hammer it out that way, as gently as possible.

If anyone has any other input, please keep it coming. I will update you all sometime tomorrow after I take another crack at it. Thanks for all the advice, so far. You guys rock!

:cheers:

Yup. My pin is in with no prob so i figured some after market axles just fit like that.

 

[viggen337]

Okay, finally got out there a little while ago and took a look at it.

I got the axle back out of the hub pretty easily. I disconnected the 19mm bolts next to the lower ball joint and then threaded the old nut on backwards and gave it some taps with a 4lb. engineering hammer. It came off after a few minutes. I'm sure I could have gotten it out faster, but I don't like the idea of beating on the axle too much, with or without that nut on there.

I cleaned the spindle area really well with brake cleaner and a small wire brush. I got quite a bit of rust out of the hub section, and it looks like a lot of that had been transferred to the axle, so hopefully that was the cause.

I greased everything, including the inside of the hub and the end of the axle. i hit all the metal surfaces that will make contact on either side.

Here's where I'm at right now:





Here's the back of the hub while I have a clear view. Anybody see anything I should be concerned about? I'm thinking I should clean this up while I have everything apart, but not sure how to proceed with that:



I'm hoping that everything goes together smoothly this time around.

 

[HokieRunner]

Okay, finally got out there a little while ago and took a look at it.

I got the axle back out of the hub pretty easily. I disconnected the 19mm bolts next to the lower ball joint and then threaded the old nut on backwards and gave it some taps with a 4lb. engineering hammer. It came off after a few minutes. I'm sure I could have gotten it out faster, but I don't like the idea of beating on the axle too much, with or without that nut on there.

I cleaned the spindle area really well with brake cleaner and a small wire brush. I got quite a bit of rust out of the hub section, and it looks like a lot of that had been transferred to the axle, so hopefully that was the cause.

I greased everything, including the inside of the hub and the end of the axle. i hit all the metal surfaces that will make contact on either side.

I'm hoping that everything goes together smoothly this time around.

Looks pretty good man. Hope it goes back smooth. even a small amount of rust can make all the difference on those tight tolerances!

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Looks fine, even a little rust will cause spline bind.
See if it goes in a little better now, I would use a the large socket to press the hub against the axle to ensure a tight fit.

 

[viggen337]

Well I am HAPPY to report that it seemed to go smoothly this time around. At first, it still felt like it was sticking at the same point just like before. I stayed on it longer with the impact gun, and it finally pulled all the way into the hub. I think the seal on the axle was sticking or something. Whatever it was, here's the end result:



I reused the factory nut since I used the newer one to beat the axle out earlier. I was able to get the retainer and cotter pin fully seated:





As it turns out, a friend of a friend is a Toyota tech and called me earlier after hearing that I was having trouble with this. He said that according to his documentation, the torque spec on that axle nut is actually 217 ft. lbs. Maybe that was part of the problem the whole time, who knows. After tightening with the impact just enough to get the pin in place, I checked it with my torque wrench, and it was at 210.5 ft. lbs, so I went ahead and tightened it to 217. Coincidentally, I found the exact same torque spec listed in one of the write-ups here. Check out the torque specs near the bottom of post # 9 of this thread:

04 front CV/shaft problem

Regardless, everything is just about wrapped up. Now on to the final step:



I got new crush washers for both plugs, and I already have a pump for the fluid, so at least this part should go smoothly. Also, I am planning to replace both axle nuts with brand new ones from the dealer this weekend. I will just go ahead and torque both to 217 ft. lbs. My wife thinks it's funny to keep reminding me not to come home without my nuts tomorrow... :shocked:

Thanks for all those who gave advise, it is greatly appreciated. I'm grateful for this site and everyone here for their help! Can't wait to install my lift kit in the fall...

:thanks:

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Yeah, sometimes I'll really run the impact on those axle shafts because they get stuck. Its not really a great thing to do, but most of the time it gets the job done.