Starting Problem, Battery Good!

[Pauly67]

About two weeks ago, my 02 4Runner failed to start after dropping off my pooch prior to vacation. I was able to get a jump from my friendly kennel owner and off I went. The odd thing was with the key in & not turned on there was a clicking sound( as if my hazards were on) from the fuse box next to the battery. Had to leave for vacation for a week and luckily not driving that vehicle.

After returning home, I totally forgot about it and drove the truck for 3 days before it did not start again on Tuesday morning, no clicking or anything. I put battery on charger, but keep getting the clicking sound from fuse box. Whenever I hook up the battery charger the relay starts clicking. My smart charger says the battery is 11.5 volts.

Is my starter relay bad, or solenoid, or starter? How can I isolate the problem?

I have some corrosion around my positive terminal that I will clean first to make sure I have good connection.

Thanks for your help in advance!
Paul

 

[Brian757]

A good way to tell if its your starter is by smacking the ba-jeeb-us out of it to get it to turn over, if your not starting. Cleaning terminals is a great idea, and could also be the culprit behind the intermittent starting.

If it were me, I would just replace the starter because you know the battery is good, maybe your not so sure about the alternator but the starter seriously sounds like the @sshole in your vehicles relationship. A bad starter can kill your alternator and battery(vice versa as well), which is why I would suggest a new starter. Your symptoms also relate to a failing starter. If your battery isn't deep cycle, don't let it die anymore. They don't do well with full battery cell depletion.

 

[Pauly67]

update

I was able to jump to get started, does this rule out bad starter or solenoid and assume battery may have bad cell or is it possible that a bad starter relay could be draining the battery?

 

[Brian757]

i was able to jump to get started, does this rule out bad starter or solenoid and assume battery may have bad cell?

EDIT: Ah, I just read your original post again. For some reason I assumed you put a BRAND new battery in. Sorry about that. Yes, it could very well be your battery. If you bring it into a Auto Store, they can charge it and test it for it's "CCA," or cold cranking amps. 11.5 Volts is low for a battery and does hint battery issues, you obviously want around 12, if not higher.

Your multimeter should read about 14 volts with the engine running. It should read at least 12 volts with the engine off. Auto parts stores have testers for batteries. These simulate the load of the starter on the battery and measure whether the battery has enough juice in it. The machine can also test the alternator while it's on the car to determine if it is charging when the engine is running.

Also there is a quick and dirty test you can do with a multimeter (Note: these are pretty inexpensive and are very useful in other DIY projects involving any electricity.) . Set it to the "Volts DC" scale. With the engine running, touch the red probe of the meter to the positive "+" post and touch the black probe to the negative "-" post of the battery. It should read 13.5 to 14.5 volts. If it is less, the alternator may not be charging.

You can jump-start with another truck and cables. If it cranks with a loud turnover noise and the truck just doesn't start it could be another problem. You also need to remember that the alternator is the equipment that charges your battery. If your alternator is bad the battery will just drain like a flashlight battery until it is dead. The alternator keeps your battery recharged as your car uses it while the engine is running. Just hope its the battery because an alternator is much more expensive.

Also, remember that if your battery isn't a deep cycle battery, each and every time it drains completely, it is damaging the cells in the battery.

 

[nissanh]

Start the engine and check the voltage at the battery with an ordinary volt meter, that should register at least 13.2 volts or more. If you get this voltage, your alternator is fine.

Some times, battery can have factory defects. CAn't you get a replacement?
You can pour hot water (close to boiling) on the terminals to get rid of any salt that has formed. then clean all the terminals.

Did you clean your engine with water some time ago? Water can get in a relay and can cause clicks.

Toyota starters are for life, all you got to do is replace the contact points inside it. Cost $10 max for the parts and again the starter is good for 10 years. Don't buy starters from auto parts store, this will only take you to more trouble.

Let us know.

 

[Grenvilleter]

Start the engine and check the voltage at the battery with an ordinary volt meter, that should register at least 13.2 volts or more. If you get this voltage, your alternator is fine.

Actually, a 12 volt car battery needs 13.8 vdc to enable charging. A fully charged car battery in theory should be 13.2 vdc (2.2 vdc/cell) but 12.8 vdc is a good number on a fully charged battery. If you hit the starter while monitoring the battery voltage, I should not drop below 12.2 vdc or your battery is suspect.

 

[JSwain]

To me it sounds like your starter is perfectly fine, since it starts with a boost...and that your charging system is the culprit. You'll really want to buy a multimeter if you want to test this yourself, they are cheapand very usefull. Your battery should stay well over 12+ volts with the key out of the ignition for 2 minutes. Even at 12.6~ thats only 50% capacity...you really want to see 12.8-13.2V. Most autoparts stores will test these for free if you let them know you'll buy the replacement from them, and if you don't have a multimeter then this may be the best route.

With the engine running and the multimeter hooked up to your battery, and set to measur 20v dc...you should be seeing 13.8-14+V, if not then you should switch your meter over to Ohms, and test the wires for a short in between them. First clean both ends of the wire you want to test, + side of batt to + side of alt and if you hook the meter up on each end of the wire and it doesn't jump down to 0-2 then you have resistance in the wire(a cut/split/bad corrosion) Also check the ground of your alt to the - side of the batt. If these cables test out good, and you've doublechecked the connection on the back of the Alt, along with the fuse, then you're looking at replacing or rebuilding your alternator.

If you get 13.8+V on your battery with the engine running then you either have a battery that isn't holding a charge, or a draw(something using power) on your battery when the trucks shut off, essentially slowly killing your battery when it's not running.

Now if you wanted to check for something draining your battery, shut the truck off, keys out of ignition, hood popped and doors closed. Let the truck sit for 5-10 minutes, then take off your - terminal on the batt and hook up a cheap test light between the battery and the disconnected terminal. If the light comes on real strong then you start pulling fuses, if the light stays on put the fuse back in and pull another. When the light goes out you have found the culprit circuit, and you know the drain is in it.

 

[Pauly67]

Update

To me it sounds like your starter is perfectly fine, since it starts with a boost...and that your charging system is the culprit. You'll really want to buy a multimeter if you want to test this yourself, they are cheapand very usefull. Your battery should stay well over 12+ volts with the key out of the ignition for 2 minutes. Even at 12.6~ thats only 50% capacity...you really want to see 12.8-13.2V. Most autoparts stores will test these for free if you let them know you'll buy the replacement from them, and if you don't have a multimeter then this may be the best route.

With the engine running and the multimeter hooked up to your battery, and set to measur 20v dc...you should be seeing 13.8-14+V, if not then you should switch your meter over to Ohms, and test the wires for a short in between them. First clean both ends of the wire you want to test, + side of batt to + side of alt and if you hook the meter up on each end of the wire and it doesn't jump down to 0-2 then you have resistance in the wire(a cut/split/bad corrosion) Also check the ground of your alt to the - side of the batt. If these cables test out good, and you've doublechecked the connection on the back of the Alt, along with the fuse, then you're looking at replacing or rebuilding your alternator.

If you get 13.8+V on your battery with the engine running then you either have a battery that isn't holding a charge, or a draw(something using power) on your battery when the trucks shut off, essentially slowly killing your battery when it's not running.

Now if you wanted to check for something draining your battery, shut the truck off, keys out of ignition, hood popped and doors closed. Let the truck sit for 5-10 minutes, then take off your - terminal on the batt and hook up a cheap test light between the battery and the disconnected terminal. If the light comes on real strong then you start pulling fuses, if the light stays on put the fuse back in and pull another. When the light goes out you have found the culprit circuit, and you know the drain is in it.

Thanks for the replies. I took it to Autozone for a TEST and the battery needed a good charge since it was only at 25%; however, he said the alternator is only putting out 12.25 volts which may be the problem as you described.

I got it home and fully recharged the disconnected battery & with my multimeter I'm getting 14.2v with truck running. After turning everything on it dropped to 14.1. Turned truck off & the battery is at 13.2v.......???? ( battery is 1yr old) Alternator is original w / 212k miles.

 

[Brian757]

Thanks for the replies. I took it to Autozone for a TEST and the battery needed a good charge since it was only at 25%; however, he said the alternator is only putting out 12.25 volts which may be the problem as you described.

I got it home and fully recharged the disconnected battery & with my multimeter I'm getting 14.2v with truck running. After turning everything on it dropped to 14.1. Turned truck off & the battery is at 13.2v.......???? ( battery is 1yr old) Alternator is original w / 212k miles.

Just keep an eye on the voltage of your battery. It could have only required a charge but something had to drain it completely. Make sure lights aren't on or something wired directly to your battery that is taking power 24/7, even with the engine off. The alternator could be your culprit, which I what I thought it would be. The only thing is that alternators are somewhat expensive but replacing it will give you that piece of mind.

 

[jaybee]

Also check the positive terminal going to your stater make sure it's hooked up properly..also clean all the negative terminal going to your frame. Sand it..

 

[JSwain]

You may have an intermittent charging problem, or one of the connections may have been just loose enough that when you hit the right bump you lose continuity between the battery and the alternator/ground. Since you have a multimeter I recommend you clean all the terminals and connections, making sure everything is tight(you don't need to break it, enough that it wont move around). Then throw the multimeter in the truck(making sure your booster cables are in the back) and continue driving it.
Check the voltage every morning before you start it, after its started - drive wherever you need to go - then check again before you shut it off, and one minute after you shut it off. If you do this everyday for a week and it doesn't lose power again pat yourself on the back because it was probably a loose or bad connection(although not guarenteed) However if you observe the alternator not putting out 13.8+ while running on occassion then your alternator will be soon going out, and you should consider finding someone local to rebuild...or replace the alternator.
I went through the intermittent charging problem with an ebay alternator(never again) after only one month of use, emailed the seller(eagle something or other) and he blocked me on ebay. Finally one day it completly gave out on me, an hour from home of course. I went to the smaller local parts store here and got one for $200 ish with a two year warranty that not only fit better but has been charging beautifully(knock on wood!) since, and if it goes out within the two years I'll rip it out and get a new one from them.
Don't go replacing anything until you've narrowed it down to the bitter end though, if you buy a new alternator and have the same problem because the ground on your battery was weak you(and probably your wife if she is anything like mine...) will definitely kick yourself in the butt

 

[greenman33]

Ever figure this one out? My 2000 V6 is having similar issues - trying to nail down the problem...

 

[408mustang]

So someone point me to the place to purchase said starter contacts for $10. My local Toyota quoted $25 for plunger another$12 to $15 a piece for the contacts... depending on which starter I have.
Does the starter need to be removed to get the numbers off it?
Thanks