rkntoy
New member
Will do. No danger of my list getting there in the near future
I do want to try and figure out less skid width for deep snow
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theesotericone's Trails and BS Thread
- Thread starter theesotericone
- Start date
I do want to try and figure out less skid width for deep snow
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thecole1098
New member
I know there's a lot of options out there for RTV, but I'll just throw another one out there that I've had great success with. Permatex Right Stuff. Super quick to set and super resilient. I used it on my tranny pan and no leaks after 7k miles so far.
theesotericone
New member
I want to figure out more skid width to keep from getting beat up on rocks. lol
A wide skid can high center you on snow for sure. A narrower skid can still high center you. Plus with the narrower skid you now start to pack snow into places then you might regret. This is all completely variable with snow conditions as well. You know those can change in an hour or less.
How many times have you broken trail on the way in in the morning without any issues other then the huge smile. Same section of trail 4 hours later on the way out has you swearing like Cartman.
My only snow incident I couldn't self recover from came early in my wheeling days. I went out on about 3 feet of powder. I was in my 86 Ford Ranger with a 302, 35's, 4" suspension lift and 1" body lift. Cruising along it was all fun. Then I parked for a bit to go do some fishing. I was about 2 miles in at that point.
I hit the stream and had a stellar few hours. I came to my truck just before dark. When I'd left it was still sitting pretty high on the snow pack. When I got back it had sunk at least a foot. I get in and fire it up. As soon as put it in drive I spin. A lot.
I get out and take a closer look. I'm totally high centered. It's well below freezing and I have no winch or come along. I was just going fishing so that shit wasn't needed. What a dumb ass. I try to dig out with a tree branch and quickly realize I'm screwed.
So I do what any 23 year old me does. I start hiking. I'm far away from my friends and don't know anybody in this area of upstate NY. I do know there's a bar and a hotel about 3 miles from the trail I turned off on. I hike to the road and start hitching. Nobody picks me up. I finish the hike and arrive at the bar.
After a few beers and a few rounds of pool I finally meet a dude who's got a rig that can handle getting my ass out. I buy him a bunch of beers and let him win a few games of pool. By midnight we're ready to recover.
We got me out and ended up back at the bar an hour later.
I learned some valuable lessons that day. Don't park a black rig in 3' of snow for 5 hours and expect to drive away. Always carry recovery gear even if your just going fishing. Always go to the local bar to find help. lol
rkntoy
New member
You would think that one lesson of "I don't need that gear, I'm just going _____". Long hikes out are great times for contemplation.
Everything is a trade off. Be careful where you park. In the deep stuff I always try to back up a slight rise when stopping for a while.
theesotericone
New member
Dual Cases Are In!
Today ended up being a fairly productive half a day in the garage. The duals are in, all electric is hooked back up, shifters are test fitted and they'll work. There's still some things I didn't expect and I'll touch on those later.
I know I give the city folk a lot of crap about clay bars, clean engine bays and trans jacks. I'll be honest here. There is no way in hell I could have redneck engineered a way to get these duals in without a trans jack. I'll give credit where it's due. That thing is awesome. I'm still not washing my truck or engine bay though. lol
Last night I managed to squeeze in some time to do 20 minutes of prep work. That involved RTVing the coupling to the transmission. Installing the tail housing. Then installing the new oil seal coupling.
Here's that coupling I've been waiting on in it's natural place.
Here's the tail housing back in place with the new oil seal coupling. Beating the oil seal coupling into place is kinda nerve racking. If it's not perfectly seated the chance of the duals mating to is are pretty slim.
After last nights prep it was off to the races. The first thing that needed to be done was to lengthen the 3 wires that come off the t-case. When adding duals you add 8 1/2" to the overall length of the drivetrain. I added 12" to each wire just so I didn't have to fight anything later. It's a lot easier to zip tie a bundle of wires in a tight space then re-crimp them.
After pulling the shifters off the duals I placed some cardboard over the shifter openings. The last thing you want is dirt falling into these things.
Now it was time to get that fancy trans jack into action. If you notice on my first go around I'm using the chain that come with the jack and a strap. A lot of folks seem to think that safety chain is shit. I agree. If you look at the final install there's two straps and no chain. The things a joke but that's the only complaint I have about this Torin jack.
One of the big questions of the day I had was would the duals even fit under my rig when they where on the jack. Take note here guys on 32's. It BARELY clears true 33's. lol
This is what the moment of truth looks like.
Right about 5 seconds after that last photo the "safety" chain slipped. I shouldn't say slipped as much as it bent both attachment point. That caused the whole unit to spin but luckily my second strap and my arm stopped what could have been a very shitty end to my day.
After firing off a quick email to Torin that started with "Dear *******s" I got back in the garage. This time I rigged it without the chain. Two 1" nylon webbing straps are a much better and safer way to go for sure. Here's the jack at an extreme angle with those straps. It never moved. If you have an auto there's only one way this thing goes in. This is the way.
If you try and go straight up you'll hit the rear crossmember mount. If you try and go nose down you'll clear the mount but bind on the 23 spline crawlbox input. Doing it this way here's your clearance on the rear crossmember.
Here's what the lower studs on the crawlbox have for clearance in the same position. As you can see it's a really tight fit with an auto.
With some spatial awareness and very small angle and level changes it eventually goes in just about perfect. Here's the proof.
This is after I put the crossmembers back in. It's full supported by the trans mount at this point. I still need to figure out the crawl box mount but I have a pretty solid plan in my mind.
If you guys remember I drilled out the center of the 99 cupholders and did some math so I could clearance the rear twin sticks before the t-case went in. Here's how that turned out.
And here's both shifters test fitted. I'd say it'll work just fine.
This is the sum total of left over parts for the job. Two of those I expected to have left over. One I didn't. TG uses two supplied bolts for the lower adapter plate to tail housing. So the two t-case bolts that you see I knew I'd have as leftovers. The surprise was the drivers side rear cross member inside bolt. There's know way that's going back in. Ever. lol
So the things I didn't expect are not that big of a deal. The first is the crossmember bolt. I'm fine having one instead of two so problem solved. The second is I'm 85% sure my front drive shaft is going to hit the front crossmember. Not by much. If it does I'll just clearance the crossmember a bit. The third is the rear twin sticks. The passenger side stick hits the 99 e-brake dead center. There's a few solutions to this. Bend the stick to clear or use my OG 97 console. I'll look into that more and go with what's easiest, urrrr, I mean best. lol
So that's all there is to dual casing these rigs guys. It may seem like a huge project but I'm less then 12 hours of my time invested so far. That would be closer to 16 if I had built the crawl box myself.
I chose to let Eric at Yotamasters handle that. If anyone ever wants to go that route I highly recommend him and his shop. He built it for not much more than I could have assembled the parts for, And he took care of sourcing everything. Including the crawl box core.
I'd also like to thank Wyatt from Rock Solid Toys. I called him twice during my research for the install. Both times he picked up the phone and answered my questions. That's just a solid thing to do considering I wasn't a customer. I'll be getting my shifter knobs from him as a thank you.
There's also a bunch of guys in the dual case thread that deserve a thanks. I'd have done this anyway but that thread helped me immensely. Most of the info you need is there. Most. The rest isn't that hard to piece together. So to all you guys that posted in this gem, thank you. And specifically, [MENTION=53470]Rockdawg84[/MENTION] . Once my shafts are made and I'm actually wheeling this thing again I would humbly request a spot on your list. I'll take 14 sine you have at [MENTION=102168]owyheerat[/MENTION] listed twice. lol
I also owe a big debt of gratitude to [MENTION=135317]rkntoy[/MENTION]. He went out of his way to not only source a 99+ center console and all the parts needed to swap it for me but he also shipped it. I owe you one brother. Let's find some deep snow to play in this winter.
So now I sit here waiting for shafts to be made. I'm really looking forward to actually driving this thing through some larger then average rock gardens soon. I'll update when I get the console and shifter thing figured out.
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Road Bull
Senior Member
Dang man! I am impressed with all the progress. That, and I can't wait to see this thing back out in its natural environment. Take plenty of pics and video if you can get your wife or someone to come along. I want to see this crawl in action if possible. Super stoked for you. :cheers:
theesotericone
New member
I spent a few minutes this morning playing with the consoles. Like my original math said the 97 console collided with the twins when they are in there rear most position. So, I'll be using the 99+ console. I just need to bend the sticks to clear the ebrake.
Thanks man. If you want to see it crawl you should come down and wheel. lol Pick a trial you want to run and let's make it happen.
I might post a vid someone where on the interwebs but I might not. My wife actually took a short vid of me trying to explain the dual case function to her. Then she posted it somewhere. Instfail maybe? AFAIK, it's the first video of me online anywhere.
rkntoy
New member
I lost track of how many times I took my sticks out to re-bend them.
theesotericone
New member
There in. Console's cut and everything has just enough clearance to work.
The rear twin sticks went in for a test fit. Did some math. Cut passenger side how I wanted it. Took it to a buddies to have him weld it. Put it back in. I had to cut a little more of the console then I would have liked but I'll get a boot made to cover it all. Or not. lol
Now it's just driveshafts. I'm expecting to talk to my guy about them tomorrow. If he's found the cores I might have this thing on the road by Saturday.
Stockwell45
New member
Good looking build, hope to see it out on the trail someday! Do you get up toward Lee Vining much? My family has a cabin out by Bodie state park that I'm at quite often throughout the year.
Tyler James Inc
Senior Member
I say not [emoji1360] You have boots under the console; I think it looks just great the way it is. Nice work.
You guys are making me want to build a dual case setup again [emoji848]
Rockdawg84
New member
Very exciting! So great that you got them in. looks super clean too. A boot would look good and it will help knock down more road noise. I saw that you linked to the Dual Case thread but feel free to post all the photos and install info there too. It will just make that thread even better. Again Awesome Job. You are going to love the difference it makes in the hard stuff :hungry:
theesotericone
New member
Thanks. A lot of thought and blood has gone into my rig. lol
I get up to Toulumne Meadows a few times a year to climb. I don't really wheel much up that way. Another two hours north in your in Tahoe. Lots of good wheeling up that way.
It does look pretty good but I think the right custom boot will make it look perfect. You know, kinda of like your engine bay.
Duals are pretty sweet. If you've run them before you know what your getting into. With your skill set I'm sure you'd get it done right and be enjoying it in no time.
I'm waiting for the driveshafts to come in. Once I trail run it a few times to make sure everything is good I'll post the full report in the dual case thread. I hope to have the shafts here Friday but it might be Monday. It's so hard to look at my rig just sitting there waiting to go for a test run. lol
AssBurns
New member
You and me both bud. Dusy can’t come fast enough. Well actually it can wait, I’m barely gonna have my locker in time. I called ECGS this morning and they are 3-4 weeks out on lead times. I’m gonna send my diff in tomorrow to help speed up things to 2-3 weeks. Fingers crossed that I can get it done without issues.
I can’t wait to see these dual cases in action!
theesotericone
New member
ECGS is pretty solid with there times. I'm sure they'll turn it quick enough. Plus that will leave you 2 weeks to get the traction beams in. lol
I ordered the driveshafts today. I ended up going with Tom Woods. Everyone else was a ways out. It'll have Spicer 1310's and not some crap knock off. I'm pretty confident they'll at least make it through the Dusy. I ended up going with a double carden on the front as well. That should push me out a few inches from the t-case flange and hopefully clear my cross member. I expect to see them Monday.
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theesotericone
New member
Paging [MENTION=118730]AssBurns[/MENTION] [MENTION=135317]rkntoy[/MENTION] and anyone else who might have some input.
I've been trying to decide what exactly to do with the crawlbox mount. In all that thinking I actually forgot to order the damn mount itself. A quick purchase from Marlin and it will be here Monday. Here's the mount.
On the bottom of the mount are 4 M8 x 1.25 mounting holes to bolt it a crossmember. My plan is to use those. Here's how.
So this is my Savage T-case skid. The plan has always been to keep these no matter what I had to do. With the extra 8.5" added to the driveline from the crawlbox I'll have to lower the skid 1/2". That still allows me 1/8" clearance off the bottom of the stock t-case. Here's what it looks like mocked up.
Two 1/4" washers welded together will be what I'll use for the spacers. It's less then I thought I'd loose so I'm pretty stoked.
Here's the plan for the crawl mount. If you look at this photo you'll see the mounting holes on the crawlbox. Once it's mounted I plan to drill through my skid to be able to use M8 pan heads.
There will be a gap between the skids and the crawl box mount. I'll the exact number the gap will be Monday but I'm thinking about 1.5" or so. Having the bolts that long with nothing between them could be a problem. This is where [MENTION=146407]Plastics guy[/MENTION] comes in.
Once I have that gap measurement I plan on asking him to make very hard piece of rubber to fill that gap. That would use the skids as the "crossmember". It would keep anything from moving and should keep the noise and vibrations down as well.
So, who sees any issues that may arise from preceding with this plan?
I've been trying to decide what exactly to do with the crawlbox mount. In all that thinking I actually forgot to order the damn mount itself. A quick purchase from Marlin and it will be here Monday. Here's the mount.
On the bottom of the mount are 4 M8 x 1.25 mounting holes to bolt it a crossmember. My plan is to use those. Here's how.
So this is my Savage T-case skid. The plan has always been to keep these no matter what I had to do. With the extra 8.5" added to the driveline from the crawlbox I'll have to lower the skid 1/2". That still allows me 1/8" clearance off the bottom of the stock t-case. Here's what it looks like mocked up.
Two 1/4" washers welded together will be what I'll use for the spacers. It's less then I thought I'd loose so I'm pretty stoked.
Here's the plan for the crawl mount. If you look at this photo you'll see the mounting holes on the crawlbox. Once it's mounted I plan to drill through my skid to be able to use M8 pan heads.
There will be a gap between the skids and the crawl box mount. I'll the exact number the gap will be Monday but I'm thinking about 1.5" or so. Having the bolts that long with nothing between them could be a problem. This is where [MENTION=146407]Plastics guy[/MENTION] comes in.
Once I have that gap measurement I plan on asking him to make very hard piece of rubber to fill that gap. That would use the skids as the "crossmember". It would keep anything from moving and should keep the noise and vibrations down as well.
So, who sees any issues that may arise from preceding with this plan?
theesotericone
New member
Do you mean the rear coil isolators? Yeah, there installed with the 861's.
phattyduck
Elite Member
Bolts through rubber with no sleeve won't work so well. Under compression, the bolts can get loose. If you tighten it down enough so it doesn't move, what's the use of rubber?
I'd suggest a solid/metal spacer of some sort. I'm not sure whether that would be thick-walled tube, box section or a solid bar (maybe aluminum for easy drilling). In a perfect world, you'd weld something on to the skid to bolt the mount directly to and drill larger holes in the skid so the bolts can be recessed up that inch or two, much like the stock trans/TC mount.
-Charlie
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