Thinking About Stereo Upgrade

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DanielMaat89

New member
I have a 2009 SR5 with the basic stereo, The Rear Speakers are on their way Out. So I am going to build a new system from scratch. Here is what I plan on using. Thoughts?

Alpine CDE-HD149BT Going to Turn Off The Internal Amp and use the Pre outs.
Alpine CDE-HD149BT CD receiver at Crutchfield.com

Alpine PXA-H800 Processor and the RUX-C800 Controller
Alpine PXA-H800 Digital sound processor at Crutchfield.com

Alpine PDX-F4 4 Channel Amp to power all the speakers
Alpine PDX-F4 4-channel car amplifier — 100 watts RMS x 4 at Crutchfield.com

Speakers:
Polk Audio DB6501 For Front and Rear Doors, I will have to drill the panels on the rear doors for the tweeters.
Polk Audio db6501 6-1/2" component speaker system — also fit 6-3/4" openings at Crutchfield.com

And For the sub, I'm thinking of reusing my Infinity Basslink I took out of my exploder before trading it in, It's a few years old, but is small, self powered and still hits hard and sounds great.

I'm looking for great sound over loudness. Also, I'm going to run new wires for the speakers. The only wires I will use from the factory are the IGN wire, the Remote turn on for the antenna booster and steering wheel controls. I'm going to do my best to leave the factory wiring intact in case I sell/trade up.

This is my Daily and weekend off-roader. Having the bluetooth and iPod/iPhone control is defiantly going to be a plus on long roadtrips.
 
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Looks like it will be quite a system! I've had good experiences with Alpine.

A couple of thoughts:

For the kind of money you are putting into this, why use a class D amp? Unless you are mounting it in an enclosed space and need the lower heat output of class D, I think class AB generally sounds better (for otherwise equivalent amps).

Do you need components in the rear? I think tweeters in the rear doors will be hard to hear from the front, so you could save some money and installation effort by using coaxials. Alternatively, mount the tweeters on the rear pillars where the JBL tweeters would go.

Why the sound processor? It is the single most expensive piece of your system and a quality head unit + amp should give pretty good sound on their own. I think using that money on better speakers might give you more bang for the buck (not that there's anything wrong with the speakers you've chosen).

Lastly, have you considered soundproofing? Dynamat is the canonical approach but it is often criticized for being overpriced. This guy is well thought of on some of the audio forums; I have bought some of his stuff but have not installed it yet. Any kind of sound deadening will improve your audio by reducing road noise and keeping your speaker cabinets (doors) from resonating.

It sounds like you are already planning to use quality wiring so you're all set there. Good luck! I think you are going to be very pleased with the results.
 
I did a little more research since the first post. Thanks for the thoughts. As far as the amp is concerned, Infinity is coming out with the Kappa K4 which is a Class AB and the features look sick. Excellent power ratings as well. I have used infinity products in the past and have had nothing but great experience with them. As for the Components in the rear doors, Coax Speakers would be better and easier to install since I wouldn't need to modify or drill my panels, which are in excellent shape. I never even thought about using DynaMat. Looks involved to do the entire truck, but looks like it would make a big difference if I just did the doors, this may sound weird, but the road noise doesn't bother me too much, even with the radio off going 75, I think the interior is quiet, and when off-reading, it's nice to hear what the trail sounds like.
 
I'm a huge fan of Infinity amps and speakers, especially their Reference series! I do agree that the class A/B amps sound better for door speakers. As far as the rear speakers go though...I wouldn't put a whole lot into them. Before my new set up, I had Infinity Reference 6x9 in my front and rear doors. All were hooked up to an Audiobahn 4 channel amp that put out 75w RMS per channel. Right now I don't even have the rear speakers hooked up. I'm running Infinity Reference coaxial in my front doors and they're hooked up to a Pioneer GM-5400T amp that puts out 125w RMS per channel and I don't see the need for any rear speakers. Even sitting in the back seat, I can still hear a good clear sound.

Now, I'm not saying don't hook the rear speakers up, I'm just saying I definitely wouldn't spend a lot of $$ on them.
 
I happen to be a huge audio guy. I have the basic stereo in my 4 runner as well and am thinking about what I would like to do.

here is my input.


Unless you have passengers all the time, Why not just go with front speakers and forget the rear.

when you go to a concert, the music is in front of you, not behind you.

The door panels on the truck seam pretty large, and I was thinking today that a nice set of 3 ways would be nice in the front. with a nice 2 channel amp.

I have a 2000 ls400 that I intalled a pioneer double din, Zapco 4 ch amp bridged for the front Hertz speakers. I like the Hertz brand so far. and Im running a CT sounds 1000w amp to a Boston sub.

the factory rear speakers are being run off the pioneer deck, and I have them just loud enough for a rear "fill".


also dont forget sound deadening. I notice these trucks have almost none. I have a ton of deadening in my LS400, I can drive 80mph down the highway and you can barely hear any road noise.

I cant wait to start on this truck.

so that is my recomendation, whatever money you were going to spend on speakers all around, put that money into a nice set for the front.
 
I do not have experience with the jbl system. Someone had mentioned possibly installing tweeters in the rear in the stock location. I do not have the jbl system, but like the idea of rear tweeters because I do carry passengers often. I have the mirrors in the back. Where would they go if I had the jbl system?
 
DanielMaat89 said:
I do not have experience with the jbl system. Someone had mentioned possibly installing tweeters in the rear in the stock location. I do not have the jbl system, but like the idea of rear tweeters because I do carry passengers often. I have the mirrors in the back. Where would they go if I had the jbl system?
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Where those mirrors are. You should be able to pop those mirrors off. I don't know if the brackets are back there on the non-JBL trucks though.
 
cpark_12 said:
Where those mirrors are. You should be able to pop those mirrors off. I don't know if the brackets are back there on the non-JBL trucks though.
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The brakcets are not there in non-JBL trucks. I came from a JBL to a non-JBL and that was the first thing I checked
 
Cool, I could probably get just the brackets, or make them. I have a few metal speaker grills lying around that I could use. I never use the mirrors anyway.
 
I don't know a lot about sound, but fwiw I have the Alpine 143BT and it was my first bluetooth head unit. It has a few quirks but I think it sounds pretty great for a wireless connection. And for the convenience, I don't think I could ever go back now.
 
You could do Polk DB651 in the rear (or DB651s if you need slim ones). In my last car the only upgrade I did was switch the front speakers to DB651, and the sound quality was excellent.

The Total Harmonic Distortion (THD or THD+n) on that class D amp is too high for great sound quality. It's rated at 1%, and I know that I can hear improvement as that number gets lower than 1%. (but it might not matter in a vehicle with lots of road noise.) At some point you get diminishing returns, so below around 0.1% they are probably all the same. 1% is typical for class D, but maybe you can find something better? The only better class D I could find is this expensive JL Audio amp:
JL Audio HD Series HD600/4 4-channel amplifier 150 watts RMS x 4 at Crutchfield.com
Class A or AB amps should have much better THD numbers.

A good amp should not influence the sound at all. At some point you get diminishing returns, so spending a lot on an amplifier is silly.

Sound deadening/ blocking will help reduce fatigue and improve sound quality. Music generally sounds better when it's louder (up to a point), but if you have a bunch of road noise you need to play it even louder to overpower the noise and improve signal to noise ratio (SNR). If you block out the road noise you can lower the volume a bit and have less fatigue for the same quality of sound. An interesting hack would be to just wear earplugs and turn up the volume. The volume of music reaching your ears would then be the same as normal, but the volume of road noise would be reduced, so you increased the SNR. It's questionably legal to drive with ear plugs, but I don't think it's any less safe than driving a car with lots of sound deadening and loud music. Ear plugs are a lot cheaper and lighter than sound deadening treatment.

I have the JBL system, and it's OK, but not outstanding. Unfortunately I'd have to replace the whole thing to do it right since the amp is weird. I might eventually do sound deadening, and later upgrade the entire audio system.

Here's a good write-up on sound deadening:
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/91953-sound-deadening-new-audio-setup.html
 
I'm building the system in stages. Speakers first, then headunit and amp. And finally the sound processor. I have done more research and found an amp I am most likely going to use, it's not out yet, but will be soon. The infinity kappa k4. It's a class ab and has impressive specs. From what I have been reading about it and review videos, it had a low thd and clean sound. For about $100 more ill go with the better sound quality. I don't have any mounting constraints. I'm going to mount everything in the back out of the way, so cooling won't be an issue.
 
I do like how the guy in that write up mounted his amp. I have that compartment in the back which would work awesome to hide everything. I'll just have to get a small computer fan and put it in there to keep everything cool. I have boxes of them and I could just steal power from the rear 12volt jack for the fan.
 
Do you even need a head unit with the infinity kappa k4 if it has bluetooth built in and a remote? I can't find much info about it.
 
m85476585 said:
An interesting hack would be to just wear earplugs and turn up the volume.
Click to expand...

I used to do this on road trips in a previous vehicle. :music: It works to some extent but it distorts the sound (e.g. the highs do not make it through the ear plugs nearly as well as the lows). But you don't hear emergency vehicles and I wouldn't have felt safe using them anywhere except the highway.

DanielMaat89 said:
I do like how the guy in that write up mounted his amp. I have that compartment in the back which would work awesome to hide everything. I'll just have to get a small computer fan and put it in there to keep everything cool. I have boxes of them and I could just steal power from the rear 12volt jack for the fan.
Click to expand...

That location is a good candidate for a class D amp (like [MENTION=46025]HokieRunner[/MENTION] used). Unless the compartment is vented then a fan will be of limited use since the heat has nowhere to go. Maybe you could get one of the subwoofer covers from a JBL model? The grill for the sub would provide ventilation and the fan would do a better job cooling. But I think under-the-seat mounting fits a class AB amp much better from a cooling perspective.
 
DanielMaat89 said:
Cool, I could probably get just the brackets, or make them. I have a few metal speaker grills lying around that I could use. I never use the mirrors anyway.
Click to expand...

Heck, I'll sell you mine if you want them. I took the speakers out and I know I won't be using them anymore.
 
m85476585 said:
Do you even need a head unit with the infinity kappa k4 if it has bluetooth built in and a remote? I can't find much info about it.
Click to expand...

I'm interested more in it's power ratings, sound quality and size. From the looks of the design it is forced air cooled which would be great for where I want to mount it. I'm still in the research phase of this project and i'm just comparing things now. From experience in installing sound systems in buildings, matching the power ratings of the amplifier and the speakers gives the best sound quality.
 
dchild said:
I used to do this on road trips in a previous vehicle. :music: It works to some extent but it distorts the sound (e.g. the highs do not make it through the ear plugs nearly as well as the lows). But you don't hear emergency vehicles and I wouldn't have felt safe using them anywhere except the highway.



That location is a good candidate for a class D amp (like [MENTION=46025]HokieRunner[/MENTION] used). Unless the compartment is vented then a fan will be of limited use since the heat has nowhere to go. Maybe you could get one of the subwoofer covers from a JBL model? The grill for the sub would provide ventilation and the fan would do a better job cooling. But I think under-the-seat mounting fits a class AB amp much better from a cooling perspective.
Click to expand...

I could easily use 2 fans, an intake and exhaust on that compartment, but using the JBL grille is a neat idea. I don't want to mound anything under the seats because i do Off-Road frequently and would not want to fill my amp and processor with mud and water from people's feet. With all these ideas, I can't wait to get started!
 
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