This will be interesting...

[STX4Runner]

FWIW - Ford killed it. Absolutely hit it out of the park on this one.

I'd need to drive one before forming any real opinion - but it look absolutely killer on paper.
Factory beadlocks, 35s, 92:1 crawl ratio, 310hp/400ftlbs, removeable top, real skid plates, modern infotainment, and less$ than a TRD Pro? I think this is going to take a bunch of sales from both the 4R and Wrangler. Frankly - I think it's going to make a real challenge to some UTVs too. It's in the same price range as a lot of high spec UTVs and might be a real replacement. Possibly including my own if Toyota doesn't massively upgrade the 4Runner. The 4R was great in 2010. It's not so great in 2020. And if Toyota actually waits until 2024 to bring out a new 4Runner - I'll be long gone by then.

My hesitations are Ford quality. Let's not forget that a Tundra is still likely to win a head to head desert race with a Raptor despite all the advantages the Raptor has on paper. Because it's simply far more durable. The Raptor is fragile. I really hope that the Bronco solved many of the quality and engineering shortcomings of the Raptor. Visually it looks like a lot of them are resolved. Time will tell.

I'm also very curious about the top. How easy is it to remove? Can it be done alone? And most importantly how is the driving experience with the top on? Long highway trips in a wrangler are exhausting due to noise from the top. The removal is a breeze now. But it's still poorly sealed for wind noise and that makes family road trips a no-go. Hopefully Ford went over and above to make a great hard top.

The other issue for me personally is that the interior is small and with a kid - camping requires a lot more crap. Also the tow capacity is pretty low and the brakes must be small if it fits 16" wheels. I do frequently tow a camp trailer and am looking at upgrading to a slightly larger one that would be over the limit of a 3500lb tow capacity. Even most pop top offroad campers exceed that weight. I suspect with the v6 ecoboost and 10 speed it actually tows much better than the 4R. Not sure why the weight rating is so low unless it's a cooling capacity issue.

I also haven't seen mpg numbers yet. But I'd bet they're better than the 4R.

I'm guessing there are some aftermarket companies that are not so happy. It's rolling off the lot with most of what people add. If you compared the as-built cost of a 4Runner with a lift, tires, bumpers, skids, beadlocks, etc. It's probably $10k or more cheaper.

Agree on all points. This looks unbelievable and Toyota better do something to the 4Runner to keep me in one when I'm ready for a new vehicle. The only thing that makes me ponder is cargo space. The Bronco's looks tiny. Camping with a family of 4 (you are selling a 4 door model, remember Ford) requires a lot of stuff. We have the cargo area full of the fridge, luggage, food, bedding, heavier camping gear, etc. and the roof rack is full with camp chairs, cots, ground tent, propane tank, lighter or bigger stuff that won't fit inside easily, etc. The Bronco might struggle with all that. It depends on what type of roof rack you can get when dealing with removable roof panels.

 

[Hybryd40]

Not that I would replace my 4Runner for one (maybe the wife's), but I could see myself adding a "Carbonized Gray" or "Area 51" colored Bronco on 35's, front/rear lockers ect to the garage one day.......I have to admit, they look pretty good.....Just picture a roof rack, sliders, and a lift on this thing....

I am with you on that. Add it to the Stable

 

[Gecko]

I didn't realize ALL Broncos are convertibles with different lift-off options. I understand that's true to heritage but yikes. There is no fixed top option.

Once you guys pick up your Broncos, take a few highway road trips and let me know how relaxing and quiet it is. And please get back to me around 30k miles and let me know how your roof seals are holding up.

Lucky for you guys, the 6th gen will be on dealer lots by then, but there's no way it's going to be the Toyota Bronco some of you are wishing for right now.

I joke above (somewhat), but the more I read, the more I realize how different this is from a 4R, which is a good thing for most of us. I think for those of you wanting to build hardcore off road vehicles with little regard for the everyday commute/usability will enjoy the Bronco. There will be others, like many former Wrangler owners I know, who come running back to a 4Runner because of overall refinement... which is just hard to perfect in a vehicle with so many removable parts.

 

[thennen]

I think you are on the right track, though I don't want the 4runner to become the vehicle you envision they develop. Perhaps it could be the NG FJ or something different? I hope the Next Gen. 4Runner retains a mid-sized SUV status and is comfortable and practical enough as a vehicle that is great for the family while also being great as an overland vehicle where range, payload, safety and performance and are balanced.

Do I wish the 79 was sold in the US? Absolutely! But look at the economics on that vehicle. Only comes in a diesel, is extremely expensive, and they didn't even think it was worthwhile/viable to correct the track. It has little competition for what it does once the defender went away. Will a 79 series, upgraded with a gasoline engine sell well in the US? I highly doubt it. It will be expensive, and lack most of the creature comforts or the on road performance that folks here would demand. I doubt it would be a viable product even in the Aussie market if it weren't for ranchers/farmers and miners. The troopy, stock, looks like an old ambulance van to those who don't know better. Unless you are "Jeep", with the tradition and cult following in the US, I seriously doubt that you can make a brand new solid front axle vehicle profitable in our market. Just imagine the reviews it would get for ride, comfort or practicality.

I'm all in on Toyota developing a smaller 4x4 truck that they've ignored since they took the FJ away. I think even an FJ brought back with a more efficient engine and some cosmetic upgrades could sell well in the new market that appears to be willing to pay for these capabilities. I just don't think the 4Runner should change to become that. Not unless they follow that up with a sub $50K next gen landcruiser which could occupy the void left by the 4Runner if this were to happen. The brilliance of the 4Runner is that it can attract buyers who would also consider something like the Jeep GC, or even things like the Explorer, and yet get a truck that is significantly more capable off road and more reliable long term. There really isn't anything in that category and I hope Toyota doesn't get out of this market in the future.

Well said.

 

[rushrunner]

No power auto back down window? NO THANKS. End of discussion. :yo:

 

[wcslv]

Just give me 350-400 hp and a eight speed transmission in the 4Runner and I’m good to go.

 

[I4CUTigers]

It’s cracking me up all the T4R owners jonesing over the Bronco spec sheet.

If you really wanted an off road monster, you already bought a Rubicon.

You bought a 4runner because it’s as close to bullet proof as they come, it can be driven comfortably Monday - Friday, you can tow a reasonable amount or load up a fair amount of stuff and go, and when you sell it, it will hold its value better than any other brand.

If toyota came out with this spec sheet, I’d be all over it. At the end of the day however, there are very few places my 4R won’t go, that a Jeep/Bronco will, and even if I could, I’m not sure I’d want to treat my truck like that. Once you weigh what you give up to get that extra 3-5% of performance, it’s not really worth it.

 

[bring_it_on]

20 MPGs when lifted, full of fuel and loaded is all I’m asking for I guess that’s like a 25 mpg stock performance. Not completely undoable but till then happy to save up for anauxiliary tank (my heart wants to think range while my brain and pocket wants to think MPGs )

On a lighter note, I wonder which “influencer” YouTube’r/IG would be first to switch over from a Toyota. I bet they are already writing the script ..

 

[zonzin]

The FJ would be the competition for the Bronco, not the 4R, if Toyota brings it back. Heck, the Bronco kinda looks like an FJ.



.

 

[tls3601]

Can two people sleep in the back of the 4 door Bronco? However, I kind of like the looks of the two door better. I have suspected Toyota has been working on something, I cannot believe they didn’t know that Ford was “bringing it” with the new Bronco. There are so many attributes that make the 4Runner attractive as an Overlander, 1650lbs of payload makes it one of the best. Reliability, quality of ride, dependability are all up there. Fun factor is missing, original had removable hardtop. I think Yota will do nothing to 4Runner. Maybe build a Wrangler/Bronco fighter but as another vehicle offering. They better act quick, Bronco has a winner at least on paper.

 

[Sp00ner]

You bought a 4runner because it’s as close to bullet proof as they come, it can be driven comfortably Monday - Friday, you can tow a reasonable amount or load up a fair amount of stuff and go, and when you sell it, it will hold its value better than any other brand.

I wont speak for others but, I bought it because the choices were basically a 4Runner and a Wrangler, and the 4Runner was the better choice of two due to the cargo space and ride quality/comfort, mainly, while still being able to do legit trails in factory condition. I have zero loyalty to any brand that was giving me an actual choice of BoF SUV with legit off road creds at a reasonable price point. Frankly, the options for that market are/were shit. Thank god there's another player in it now.

 

[thennen]

Just noticed the swing-out tailgate/door. I would tire of that, I think.

 

[AZ Craig]

The other issue for me personally is that the interior is small and with a kid - camping requires a lot more crap. Also the tow capacity is pretty low and the brakes must be small if it fits 16" wheels. I do frequently tow a camp trailer and am looking at upgrading to a slightly larger one that would be over the limit of a 3500lb tow capacity. Even most pop top offroad campers exceed that weight. I suspect with the v6 ecoboost and 10 speed it actually tows much better than the 4R. Not sure why the weight rating is so low unless it's a cooling capacity issue.

I also haven't seen mpg numbers yet. But I'd bet they're better than the 4R.

Interior space is marginally better than the Wrangler, but the 4Runner still wins. This is one of the reasons I switched to my 4Runner from a JKU in 2016 and am happy I did not wait for the Bronco (versus getting my 2020 Pro) since I thought it was going to end up on the small side.

The towing is also disappointing. I noticed this also and was surprised. Perhaps hitch design plays into things also? The Ecoboost engine should be good for towing at least 5000 pounds I would think.

I'm actually really considering a Defender in 2 or 3 years (probably to replace my Disco Sport before it comes off warranty) once Land Rover works out some of the initial growing pains as the I6 turbo is good to tow over 8000 pounds and the interior space is very close to a 4Runner.

They are pricey vehicles though.

 

[750ml]

There is no comparison. The two vehicles have vast differences. But they are competing for market share - as they should. 4runner folks love their 4runners.

 

[750ml]

I need to clear the home projects from my plate and get to work on the body restoration of my ‘73 Bronco.

Now that's a Bronco!

 

[4FL]

Watching the whole thing yesterday with its introduction. I will say I like it, but like it in the way I like a Jeep Rubicon or the old LR Defender, awesome, cool to have, but for me it would be like a second or third car. The 4R fills that everyday driver/highway cruiser thing quite well, lol.

But at that, when the 4R 6th gen comes around I by then will be looking at getting a second car, well, I love my current 4R so much I plan on keeping it, and cannot see not jumping into a 6th gen.

 

[I4CUTigers]

I wont speak for others but, I bought it because the choices were basically a 4Runner and a Wrangler, and the 4Runner was the better choice of two due to the cargo space and ride quality/comfort, mainly, while still being able to do legit trails in factory condition. I have zero loyalty to any brand that was giving me an actual choice of BoF SUV with legit off road creds at a reasonable price point. Frankly, the options for that market are/were shit. Thank god there's another player in it now.

So you bought it because it drivable Monday thru Friday, the fact you can load it up with stuff, and still have a highly capable off roader?

That’s exactly what I was pointing out. The market is what it is. Bronco’s entry is closer to the wrangler than the 4runner. I don’t think it sways the decision making process for most eventual 4R buyers who are valuing reliability, comfort, cargo, daily Drivability, and while retaining trail worthiness (which is most people who end up with one).

 

[Tuco Ramirez]

Built/Assembled in michigan or mexico. L-O-L

 

[tls3601]

I think the 4Runner still is they best Overlander. 1650 lbs of payload capacity set it apart from Wrangler 4 door 875 and even the new Bronco 4 door at 1350, which is the same as a 200 series Landcruiser. And of course space inside. I think the payload in the new Defender is like 2100 lbs which is impressive but I just cannot embrace a unibody vehicle for off road

 

[Sp00ner]

So you bought it because it drivable Monday thru Friday, the fact you can load it up with stuff, and still have a highly capable off roader?

That’s exactly what I was pointing out. The market is what it is. Bronco’s entry is closer to the wrangler than the 4runner. I don’t think it sways the decision making process for most eventual 4R buyers who are valuing reliability, comfort, cargo, daily Drivability, and while retaining trail worthiness (which is most people who end up with one).

Assuming we leave out the part about reliability and resale, sure, close enough for government work at least, and lets be clear, being more comfortable than a Wrangler is a pretty damn low bar to clear.

I couldn't really care less about those other two factors.

My only point, really, is that if you're looking for something that does those three things, you have like, one option, so there's not a whole lot of choice there. If I hop on a yellow life boat when I'm drowning, it doesn't mean I like yellow, it just means I didn't want to drown.

If the Bronco had existed when i was looking, and has slightly better cargo room and less of a coffin feel than the Wrangler, it would have been the #1 choice by a mile for me.