Tie Rod/Front Suspension Questions

[zimdba]

100K Sport V8: The steering on my 4Runner is getting to be pretty sloppy. I jacked up the front end 1 tire at a time and did the 9-3 and 12-6 "wiggle" tests. The 9-3 position had what I would call considerable play. At 12-6 I only moved the tire up & down.

What I understand is that this means the tie-rod ends are shot. My questions are thus. Your help is appreciated.

1) Do I need to examine the TRE's to see if I need an inner and an outer, or should I just plan on replacing both?

2) Is there anything else that could cause this sloppiness?

3) Moog vs. Deeza - any thoughts or are they both pretty good? I didn't find anything negative about the Deeza, and Moog appears to be the incumbent go-to provider.

4) I was also planning on replacing the sway bar bushings. When I have everything torn apart, is there anything else I should plan on replacing? My thoughts: I'd rather spend $40 on a part that's only 60% worn than have to rip everything apart again in 10,000 miles to replace it.

Thanks.

 

[stanleybb50]

Subscribed and bumped for those more knowledgeable.

Fyi that for the tie rods, cant go wrong with Moog.

 

[WHORERUNNER]

Not sure about deeza but moogs have lifetime replacement.

 

[earthrealm]

bookmarked for info too.

 

[aha2988]

you should be able to just replace your inner's. slop on the 9-3 tells me the steering rack/ steering gear is warn out not necessarily the rods or end links. as long as theres no slop in the TREL, then your slop is coming from inside the rack and pinion setup. you can replace the whole steering gear and rack assembly or go in and rebuild it. I would try replacing the inner rods with new seals and clamps and boots all acompanied with changing inner tie rods, also bleed the steering rack's hydraulic's as there could be air in the system causing the slop aswell. Make sure your powersteering pump resevior is full, as if it has become drained you may have a leak in the powersteering fluid system allowing air to enter the lines and or, you may have a leak in the suction line of the power steering pump allowing the pump to suck in air but not readily leak fluid. If air enters your power steering fluid lines you get the same effect as having air in your brake lines. air is compressible brake & powersteering fluid is not compressible... hope this helps

 

[Sungod]

Are you seeing movement in the tie rod ends? I would be sure before spending money on them. They are not typical parts that fail on 4 runners. Wheel bearings are a lot more common and can result in the same type of movement.

 

[zimdba]

@Sungod: I thought that if it were a bearing, I would have slop at the 12-6 positions as well. I don't have any movement there. Note that I don't think I've ever done anything on the bearings. If it wasn't detailed in a 60K/90K maintenance then I doubt my mechanic did anything either. Time for more research.

@aha2988: So how would I go about looking for steering rack issues? I'm not even sure what to look at. I've always run stock tires, so I'm not putting added stress that way.

It appears as if I have more investigation to do before throwing money & time at the problem. I'll jack it up this afternoon & check for slop at the *outer* tie-rod ends, but other than that I'm not sure what to do other than take it to the mechanic and ask what's wrong for $50.

Once I get this taken care of I'm sure I'll enjoy driving it a lot more. Driving my wife's new car has really highlighted how bad the steering is in the 4Runner.

 

[aha2988]

You should save 20 dollars of that 50 and invest 30 bucks in a haynes manual lol full of info ill help you out this time...

 

[aha2988]

heres some more info on the rod ends and checking the rack out....(like we need help checking out racks:girl:...lol)















I've got a few more to add continued in next post

 

[aha2988]

Hope this helps









:cheers:

 

[zimdba]

OK, I took a more critical look at the front-end and unfortunately, I'm a bit of an idiot. I was muscling the tire and the opposite (grounded) tire was moving! Add tire flex to that and that was 95% of the movement. Apparently I need to ease up on the P90X.

I did, however, notice *some* movement not related to the TRE. I grabbed the rim itself and there was a little deflection all around. This, I'm assuming, is related to the wheel bearing? I still need to do more research but is this a maintenance or replacement item?

More details:

UCA: Bushings look ok, firm but still rubbery. Huge gap between the bushing and the bracket. Should I assume this is by design?

LCA: Rubber is very hard & brittle. I don't really know what else to look for.

TRE's: I grabbed ahold of it and couldn't get it to budge. No movement whatsoever.

Sway Bar: The end-links looked ok, but the bushings attached to the frame look pretty pathetic. Like I said I'll probably change all that out anyway since it's cheap & easy & it gets me out of the house.

Overall everything looks pretty good. Any suggestions are appreciated.

 

[zimdba]

I guess you posted while I was composing. Anyway you are correct! I just ordered the Haynes manual - $17.80 from Amazon & should be here by Saturday. Thanks for posting the pix I'll review them now.

 

[aha2988]

its all up there in black and white for ya... sounds like you could just change your lower control arm bushings and swaybar bushings and be back to tighter steering.

If your getting any play in the wheel by pushing on the 12 oclock position and pulling on the 6 oclock position then rocking that motion back an forth then you have a bad wheel bearing that needs replaced. you can buy the bearings and take your hub to a machine shop and have them pressed in this way you know your getting good qaulity bearings or you can buy hub assemblies with bearings already pressed in just not sure what qaulity they come with bearing wise (timken is a good bearing brand). you should be able to find a source for the hubs or bearings using a google search or if you want you can have your mechanic pic out parts for you but i dont recommend that.

 

[aha2988]

I guess you posted while I was composing. Anyway you are correct! I just ordered the Haynes manual - $17.80 from Amazon & should be here by Saturday. Thanks for posting the pix I'll review them now.

lol as i guess you posted while i was composing.. I didnt post how to change the bearings its in the manual as well i'd post them for ya but since you've ordered one ill let you get some use out of it lol

 

[Sungod]

You can also download the Factory Service Manual. It has all the same information as haynes or chilton. I don't like the FSM as much because at times it seems like it was written by idiots, but they are year specific as opposed to haynes or chilton that cover many years and sometimes you have to sort out the different models.

 

[talonjade]

Here is my solution which is holding up FANTASTIC!


http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/114337-heavy-duty-tie-rod-ends.html

 

[zimdba]

@sungod: The FSM didn't seem to have the analysis/troubleshooting information that the Haynes manual appears to. Otherwise I'm just replacing parts & hoping that fixes it.

@talonjade: Your thread is really about stabilizer bar end-links & bushings. I definitely plan to replace all of that either at the same time I figure out the numb steering or separately.

I should get the manual on Saturday & go through all of the troubleshooting steps this weekend. Hopefully then I'll have a more defined plan of attack.