Tire/Wheel Size Pros&Cons for offroading?

[techoguy]

Alright, experienced overlanders, trail guys, I'm looking for your expertise and advice. I'm hoping this will be good information for others to reference as well.

I'm working on a lift and new wheel/tire combo for my 04 4runner. I've been reading all over this forum and other sites to get more information. There is some great info on this site but one thing I haven't been able to find out is how does tire/wheel selection affect offroading ability? I don't mean brand etc, but sizing, offset, etc.

In my case,
lift: icon stage 2 setup with TC UCAs set to 3"/2" I'm looking at
Wheels: Pro Comp 36 wheels 17x9 -6 offset (4.75" backspace) or ?
Tires: 285/70-17, 275/70-17, or 265/70-17.

1) What do you guys think about a wider rim (9" vs 8")? How does that affect running lower pressure, wheel grinding, etc? I actually wanted 8" but the rim I like comes in 9" wide.

2) While i'm sure taller tires are better, at what point is rubbing more of a concern? how do you know if your setup will rub with full travel vs just driving on the street? In my case, is 285/70-17 going to cause too much rubbing with full travel, would it be better to stick with 275 or 265?

3) What concerns/benefits should be considered between tire widths if any?

Thanks for all the help!

 

[Bumbo]

Most of the successful trail guys and overland builds I see end up using a thinner tire... and that what I did for myself too.

Its only the sand dune guys that really benefit from a wide tire as its all about flotation. The thinner tire actually gets you more pounds per square inch on your available contact patch which actually ends up increasing grip/traction. Seems a bit counter intuitive but it is what it is.

I went with a 255/75/17 which works out to a 32.1" tire on a 7.5" rim, which is 0.5" wider than the stock SR5 rim anyways.

Just something to consider before dropping coin on tires if you are using them for wheeling / trail / overland.

 

[techoguy]

[MENTION=144483]Bumbo[/MENTION] thanks for the response. This is exactly the kind of stuff I'm looking for. I mainly was considering the 285 for the height so I'm still open to other solutions. I was also concerned about too much rubbing with the 285 and offset. The 9" wide rim might have to go too if I pick a skinnier tire.

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[Bumbo]

[MENTION=144483]Bumbo[/MENTION] thanks for the response. This is exactly the kind of stuff I'm looking for. I mainly was considering the 285 for the height so I'm still open to other solutions. I was also concerned about too much rubbing with the 285 and offset. The 9" wide rim might have to go too if I pick a skinnier tire.

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Per your original sizes...

285/70/17 = 32.7"
275/70/17 = 32.2"
265/70/17 = 31.6"

So comparing the 285 to the 255, you are only talking about a 0.6" difference in overall diameter so the truck would only sit 0.3" higher than my 255. Its hardly noticeable...

Point I was trying to make is that consider the application first, then pick the right tire, and hope it comes in a size that works for you.

If anything you can go even taller with a skinner tire and doing that only gets you more tasty sidewall if you stick with a 17" rim. Another thing to keep in mind is weight of the tire... you can really start to notice and it will change how you drive the rig.

I'm still on stock UCA, on 6112 shocks so I cant really comment or help on clearance.

 

[rickashay]

Alright, experienced overlanders, trail guys, I'm looking for your expertise and advice. I'm hoping this will be good information for others to reference as well.

I'm working on a lift and new wheel/tire combo for my 04 4runner. I've been reading all over this forum and other sites to get more information. There is some great info on this site but one thing I haven't been able to find out is how does tire/wheel selection affect offroading ability? I don't mean brand etc, but sizing, offset, etc.

1) What do you guys think about a wider rim (9" vs 8")? How does that affect running lower pressure, wheel grinding, etc? I actually wanted 8" but the rim I like comes in 9" wide.

2) While i'm sure taller tires are better, at what point is rubbing more of a concern? how do you know if your setup will rub with full travel vs just driving on the street? In my case, is 285/70-17 going to cause too much rubbing with full travel, would it be better to stick with 275 or 265?

3) What concerns/benefits should be considered between tire widths if any?

Thanks for all the help!

I'll chime in. I've ran a lot of different tires, and a lot of different tire sizes, on several of my built rigs. My experience with the 4th Gen specifically is limited but I have built several Rubicon/Overland worthy rigs, and I always tell people one thing when building a rig: pick your tire size and build your truck around it.

Going back to your original questions, the thing you need to determine is your end uses. Be honest with yourself, will you overland more and do more gravel type travel? Will you crawl on harder trails? Will it be a combination of the two? And where do you plan on going to these places? ie. What typ of conditions will you encounter?

I do not believe the skinny tire mantra personally. But that opinion is also derived from my personal uses and experience wheeling in muddy/wet/rooty and deep snow conditions. Flotation and footprint size are everything. Skid plates and better wheel placement can help you avoid ground clearance issues most of the time, but again that could be the difference in perspective between wheeling in Moab on dry slickrock vs. the mountain wheeling I might experience.

I also prefer fatter tires on thinner rims to a degree. I have my current 315/75/16's (35's) mounted on an 8" rim. I routinely air down to 8 psi in the winter to conquer that deep snow. That being said I wouldn't go much beyond a 12.5" tire on an 8" rim. I think with your tire choices above, stick to a 7-8" wheel. This will give you more "bulge" on the sidewalls which also help protect the face of your wheel against damage on rocks etc.

Good luck!

 

[Bumbo]

35s are some pretty big tires... rig starts to become pretty application specific at a certain point. I also forgot about snow... we dont get much of that here in SoCal... but its similar to sand where flotation is a key component. Going that big you need some gearing which is another additional cost that should be considered... and if you are going to go to the trouble of gearing, you might as well throw in some ARB lockers while you are at it...

I like your tip about being honest with yourself... because at the end of the day the truck needs to work for you.

I took into consideration that even for off-road trips, there may be hundreds of freeway miles, sometimes thousands, before getting to a destination. I recently did a two major trips which also happened to be road trips with camping along the way. 3k miles on each trip were logged.

I really had to strike a balance between on-road and off-road performance... I feel I achieved that, at least I feel I got as big as I can go without needing to re-gear the truck. It seems once you get into that 33" or larger size, it pretty much becomes a necessity.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Suspension lifts only help with rubbing on the street. A body lift is the only thing that keeps you from rubbing on your wheel wells unless you drop bumpstops or hammer your wheel wells in. I agree about building your rig and suspension setup around your tires. Your decision on tires comes from what you plan on driving over. If you are a dedicated offroader and can do a bit of work, 35's are doable. 34's like 285/75r17 and 305/70r17 are a tad thinner than 35's, not much shorter, and can pretty easily fit if you have a dremel and a hammer and do a body mount chop. 33's (285/70r17 and their thinner varieties) Easy to fit with a basic lift and possible a BMC.

I had no problem driving on a 2k mile trip through Colorado and all the mountains to Moab and back with 33's and my V8 (stock gears). Neither did my brothers FJ (V6 and stock gears and 34" mud terrains) and neither did my friend's FJ (V6, stock gears, and 35" mud terrains). It all depends what you want to put up with. Even all our gas mileages were within 2-3mpg of eachother. My 23 gallon tank was awesome though.

For me, I'm going with 35's next.

 

[S p a r k y]

[MENTION=135392]Porqupine82[/MENTION] has 255/80/17 and he is very happy with those doing Overland, many others run the same

 

[sport2004]

I always tell people one thing when building a rig: pick your tire size and build your truck around it.

Reading my mind here. I've been wondering this for about a week and was about to post a question to that effect...

 

[techoguy]

Thanks for all the great info.

I might have to re-think my wheel tire combo a little.

If I'm being honest with myself, I'm new to overlanding/offraoding. I've done mild stuff in the past. Now I'm wanting to build a rig that I can take to the Sierra mountains, camping trips, shorter overlanding trips, some sand dunes, and stable on the road as I'll drive it regularly too. I have two young boys and a wife that'll be coming along on many of the trips. I don't expect to do too much rock crawling, but want to be able to do mild-moderate Moab trips, Big Bear, Lake Tahoe, etc.

With that said, I also have a limited budget so I understand the idea of building your rig around your tires, but that also seems there could be a lot of unknown costs that might crop up on me when done that way. Right now I want to keep it a bit more conservative until I have more experience and really know what I need.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Right now I want to keep it a bit more conservative until I have more experience and really know what I need.

In my mind, 285/70r17 are the "jumping off" point. Decently cheap with lots of tread options. Easy to fit on our rigs. Don't need to regear.

Any taller tires, some people may want to regear and a body lift will make your life easier. You might as well add lockers once you open the diffs... Wider tires need wider aftermarket wheels, the list keeps going.

 

[rickashay]

I am in no way suggesting to go with 35's. They don't work for everyone. My Tundra was built around that tire size and I had to tub the firewall to make that happen with only an inch of lift.

OP, for your purposes, I say go with a 285 or 33". Its totally the tipping point - you can reliably run a 33 on some difficult trails, without breaking parts, and without having to mod your vehicle excessively. Lots of guys have even done the Rubicon on 33's. I would say its the "best all-rounder" for adventure 4x4 touring that allows a combination of offroad and overland travel. My $0.02

 

[jrm]

I just want to add that

with the 275 your adding almost an inch .83" and the 285 your adding 1.3" in width not to mention additional weight over a 255 @ 10.0" and comparable weight of the OE tire size in C or P config.

I'm on 14' SR5 wheels, 255s ICON lift 2" up front and 1.25" rear.

Per your original sizes...

285/70/17 = 32.7"
275/70/17 = 32.2"
265/70/17 = 31.6"

So comparing the 285 to the 255, you are only talking about a 0.6" difference in overall diameter so the truck would only sit 0.3" higher than my 255. Its hardly noticeable...

Point I was trying to make is that consider the application first, then pick the right tire, and hope it comes in a size that works for you.

If anything you can go even taller with a skinner tire and doing that only gets you more tasty sidewall if you stick with a 17" rim. Another thing to keep in mind is weight of the tire... you can really start to notice and it will change how you drive the rig.

I'm still on stock UCA, on 6112 shocks so I cant really comment or help on clearance.

 

[techoguy]

[MENTION=63060]rickashay[/MENTION] and [MENTION=130999]Inv4drZm[/MENTION]
Thanks for the info. I had the same thought that right around 33" is what I want. I guess now the question is what width? I was set on 285/70-17 but then I was reading about the BMC and didn't really want to have to do that.

So when most people go with an added offset of about 1-1.5" (spacer or new rims) with 285s what kind of mods do you usually have to do so there is no rubbing?

I'm sure, taking off the mud flaps, but what other mods? How likely do I have to do the BMC?

If going with a 265 or 255 at the same height helps avoid that, I would probably lean towards those.

Thanks!

 

[Roadtripr]

Snow is better done with a skinny tire and good sipped thread. Once the sierra cement gets too deep you won't be able to go forward regardless.

Here is whole description of why to chose a narrow tire for most things (except deep sand and mud)
Expeditions West: Tire Selection for Expedition Travel
(ever notice how expedition vehicles have narrow tires?)

Most of the trips to and from destinations will be on highways so modify it to suit both for trails and on-road handling. Go on trips now and find out where the needs are (you might find you want more ground clearance). Then start conservative as you drive this daily too (2-3" lift, 32"-33" tire height should be sufficient for overland).

 

[Inv4drZm]

[MENTION=63060]rickashay[/MENTION] and [MENTION=130999]Inv4drZm[/MENTION]
Thanks for the info. I had the same thought that right around 33" is what I want. I guess now the question is what width? I was set on 285/70-17 but then I was reading about the BMC and didn't really want to have to do that.

So when most people go with an added offset of about 1-1.5" (spacer or new rims) with 285s what kind of mods do you usually have to do so there is no rubbing?

I'm sure, taking off the mud flaps, but what other mods? How likely do I have to do the BMC?

If going with a 265 or 255 at the same height helps avoid that, I would probably lean towards those.

Thanks!

My SCS wheels with my 285 duratracs don't rub the body mount. Just barely clear by a 1/4" or less. New tread on a squarer profile tire could rub on my setup. A body mount chop isn't difficult if you have access to a cutoff wheel and/or grinder. Don't even really need to weld it back afterward. I'd recommend the 285 width.

About the same gas mileage is lost between C to E load range rating as the 255 vs 285 argument I'd guess. Heck, a heavy 255 could be about the same as a light 285. I wouldn't guess much difference (ride or mpg) although I've never ridden or driven a skinnier-tire T4R except for when mine was stock. I still get good mpg with all the crap on my truck; 15mpg going 75mph. 160lbs of skid plates and sliders along with a full suspension + 1.5" body lift.

 

[techoguy]

Here is whole description of why to chose a narrow tire for most things (except deep sand and mud)
Expeditions West: Tire Selection for Expedition Travel
(ever notice how expedition vehicles have narrow tires?)

Thanks! great reference and good read. For my needs, it's looking like a narrower tire than a 285 would be what I want... Now I just have to find one I like for SoCal. I would love to get a 265/75 but that doesn't seem to be common. so it might have to be the smaller 265/70 or skinnier 255/75.

The main reason I would still want the 265 vs 255 is more stability on the highway at higher speeds. I do like to drive my rigs fast
:lookout:
I'm used to longer trucks, so I'm going to have to be a little more careful with the 4runner.

 

[RonJR]

I have 255/75/17's on mine and it's rock-solid stable on the highway. I'm very happy with them.

 

[techoguy]

I have 255/75/17's on mine and it's rock-solid stable on the highway. I'm very happy with them.

What brand do you have?

I'm noticing as I search for the 255 that my choices drop dramatically.

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[dagen]

Thanks! great reference and good read. For my needs, it's looking like a narrower tire than a 285 would be what I want... Now I just have to find one I like for SoCal. I would love to get a 265/75 but that doesn't seem to be common. so it might have to be the smaller 265/70 or skinnier 255/75.

The main reason I would still want the 265 vs 255 is more stability on the highway at higher speeds. I do like to drive my rigs fast
:lookout:
I'm used to longer trucks, so I'm going to have to be a little more careful with the 4runner.

Cooper makes the AT3 in a 265/75/17. A lot of people here, myself included, have and/or do run the AT3's. I use my 4Runner in the desert and the Sierra's a lot and it performs well in both.

Here's a link to an article about some of the tire choices (manufacturer, not size) out there. It's a good, informative, read.
Where the Rubber Meets the Road | Expedition Portal