Totaled '99 advice request

[niwtsol]

Hey all, two weeks ago I was letting some friends drive my 4runner back from a camping trip and I got the dreaded call "hey man, we were in a wreck" - everyone is safe, thank goodness, but I just got word from insurance company they want to make it a total loss.

1999 164k miles, no problems, just did timing belt, starter, water pump, tires 1 year old - no problems with her at all. (To be fair, my last post on these forums is to the guy selling it to me!)

I live about 400 miles away from where the wreck happened and I have not been able to make it up to check it out in person so I am just going off of these two photos. Looking at them, it looks like just some cosmetic outside damage - looks like the front bumper strut (is that what you would call that?) is messed up pretty bad, but I think the collision is high enough up the body that the frame should be fine, the main engine components are probably okay. Just the air intake, windsheifl wiper fluid reservoir, some wiring messed up - is there anything else over on the passenger side that is critical that could be real expensive? I know you want to replace the radiator at ~200k anyway, so if that got damaged could replace it just to be safe?

Is there anything you guys can see from these photos that would make you believe trying to retain ownership and get difference of salvage to value ? I just think this one has a lot of legs left to it and I can probably do most of the cosmetic repairs myself.

 

[jgue467]

I tend to agree, cosmetic and some other front end stuff. What else can your friends tell you? Did doors open/close without a fuss? Any engine noises? Any dash lights?

Depends on how bad you want it, could be worth the drive to check it out better. Not sure about Cali but texas makes insurance companies sell totaled vehicles to owners for 15% of book value. Luck. :cowboy:

 

[TheDurk]

I don't see any airbags? If they did not deploy, that suggests any impact to the frame was lateral, which is a very good thing. I'd check into it further, for sure. 164k is nothing. Barely broken in.

 

[niwtsol]

Exacccctly - she is so young. Thanks for the quick replies!

Doors opened fine, it was still running after the wreck, but after it sat for about an hour, it wouldn't turn over. No airbag deployment. I don't know if any lights were on the dash.

I am definitely going to go up there, I am thinking of just renting a uhaul car trailer and bringing it down to my garage. I just don't know if insurance is going to try and rush me to make a decision before I have all the information...

 

[19963.4lsr5]

The 96 was T-Boned at drivers door and front wheel area. Frame was pushed in about 2".

Look to see if both wheels are strait. With drivers wheel and steering wheel at strait ahead. If your upper A arm ends up being bent I don't think it's good.

My insurance totals anything that requires 75% of its value to repair it. Doesn't matter if frame is strait or not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[octanejunkie]

My insurance totals anything that requires 75% of its value to repair it. Doesn't matter if frame is strait or not.

THIS

Every insurance co is different. The formula is cost of loss to vehicle value ratio varies. Some insurance companies will fix a 70% loss to value while others will total a 60%. Most all insurance cos will total an airbag deployment.

Older vehicles cost more to insure because of "lower safety ratings" which is why they are quicker to total an older vehicle in many cases, and the lower residual value and lower payout is a win win for them.

 

[TheDurk]

THIS

Every insurance co is different. The formula is cost of loss to vehicle value ratio varies. Some insurance companies will fix a 70% loss to value while others will total a 60%. Most all insurance cos will total an airbag deployment.

Older vehicles cost more to insure because of "lower safety ratings" which is why they are quicker to total an older vehicle in many cases, and the lower residual value and lower payout is a win win for them.

This is why comprehensive/collision coverage on older vehicles is usually a bad choice. It costs you a lot, and if you do get to file a claim, what you get isn't much. The window between deductible and total is minuscule. I went liability only on my '99 after six years. Pure profit for me because I have never had a claimable event.

 

[octanejunkie]

This is why comprehensive/collision coverage on older vehicles is usually a bad choice. It costs you a lot, and if you do get to file a claim, what you get isn't much. I went liability only on my '99 after six years. Pure profit for me because I have never had a claimable event.

The key is never having a claimable event. If we could guarantee that why would anyone ever get insurance? :mod:

With a multi-line discount my comp and collision are low, and I have a 0 and 100 dollar deductible, respectively. Mind you the last two accidents I had were not my fault and the other guy's insurance paid me both times, so my insurance was just an expense.

I may need to revisit my coverage considering my 99 is probably a $3500 write off to them.

 

[octanejunkie]

Such a bummer man, sorry for the loss and headache

Is there anything you guys can see from these photos that would make you believe trying to retain ownership and get difference of salvage to value ? I just think this one has a lot of legs left to it and I can probably do most of the cosmetic repairs myself.

I'm the least qualified here to comment, but besides the obvious bumper and body parts, I would suspect you would have to replace:
core support
AC drier, condenser and lines (plus charging)
radiator
hood latch
horn
wire harness
fog light
headlight
side marker
airbox
power antenna
cowl cover
windshield wiper res and motor
hood prop

Maybe also an issue
transmission flush at minimum (pink milkshake) coz it was running
clutched fan
fan shroud

There's always more than you think

 

[alanflies]

That core support and inner fender is toast...You will have to cut every thing from just forward of the firewall out and weld in new parts. If you can do, or pay a shop to do the cutting and welding of a new inner fender and core support, probably run 800.00 to 1000.00 to have a shop do just the cutting and welding. and you do all the rest, it probably could be fixed.

Doing the job yourself would probably still cost a couple grand in parts alone, so probably around 3500.00 best case...

Unless you have a special sentimental attachment to this truck, I would take the insurance money and go looking for another one.

 

[Scramble]

The key is never having a claimable event. If we could guarantee that why would anyone ever get insurance? :mod:

With a multi-line discount my comp and collision are low, and I have a 0 and 100 dollar deductible, respectively. Mind you the last two accidents I had were not my fault and the other guy's insurance paid me both times, so my insurance was just an expense.

I may need to revisit my coverage considering my 99 is probably a $3500 write off to them.

Agreed, I've always had full coverage on my truck. $76 a month.

 

[mmml4]

All depends on how much work you're willing to do. Thanks to my daughter I started with this.

 

[ladywolf]

Agreed, I've always had full coverage on my truck. $76 a month.

Yeah, I think mine is about 60 bucks a month for Full coverage for the 4runner alone and combined with the Chevy 1500 its about 100 bucks total.

I've even got rental reimbursement and towing on the 4runner, and towing on the truck.

 

[MissouriBreaks]

My questions for the OP are:

Have you thought not only about what it may cost to repair this? but also how long is it going to take to repair it? Do you have something else to drive during the repair time?

Many on this forum talk about not wanting to buy a vehicle that has been in a major crash or not wanting to have their 4Runners repaired after a major crash, because of safety, reliability, and/or resale concerns, yet you seem willing to want to disregard these concerns on a nearly 20 year old vehicle.

The thing I see wrong with wanting to fix this, is unless you are a repair expert, how are you going to really know what it needs to be fixed right. It is easy to see the cosmetic damage and think it can be fixed, but what about those hidden items that might pop up after you have spent thousands of dollars to get it into a semi repaired state?

My advice is to take the insurance money and either look for a low mileage vehicle of similar vintage to your 4Runner or consider upgrading to a newer 4Runner. In the long run it is going to be the easier solution with less stress and fewer headaches.

 

[octanejunkie]

Yeah, I think mine is about 60 bucks a month for Full coverage for the 4runner alone and combined with the Chevy 1500 its about 100 bucks total.

I've even got rental reimbursement and towing on the 4runner, and towing on the truck.

"Full coverage" is a fantasy phrase the insurance companies use to imply value. It simply means they are selling you a policy that at least meets the minimum state insurance requirements. In most states, however, only liability insurance is required.

Know what you kind of protection have
Liability coverage is protection against damage YOU cause to another driver, both car and medical.

Comprehensive and Collision coverage is damage caused to your vehicle by an accident while driving, comprehensive is damage to your vehicle to while not in motion; like someone sideswipes you while parked or a cow falls out of the sky and lands on you car.

Injuries you suffer in an accident are covered by the other driver's liability coverage. Hopefully they have it. This is where uninsured and underinsured coverage comes into play. Those also have their own sets of limits for liability and comp/collision coverage.

Example, two policies that cost the same
30/10 Full Coverage
A full coverage policy with 30K in liability and 10K in comprehensive and collision means they will only pay the other party $10,000 in the event you are at fault. That's 10K combined property and medical. If you happen to be at fault and wreck a brand new anything, you will be sued and on your own. God forbid there's a medical claim. The 10K comp and collision protects your property, but if your vehicle is totaled and worth less than 10K to them, you will never collect it.

Liability only
A 100K liability ONLY policy covers you at fault up to $100,000 towards the other guy's damage, car and medical, but nothing to protect you. If you are willing to take your own lumps, this is better coverage than a Full Coverage policy offering lesser protection for the same price.

Don't forget uninsured and underinsured motorist coverage. If you DON'T have Comp and Collision and the other guy is at fault, you rely on their insurance to cover your damages. Nothing worse than getting wrecked by a person with no insurance, no job, or no citizenship. We have TONS of those drivers out here.

Location, location, location
Living in Los Angeles, we have millennial idiots driving around in $100k+ sports cars, weaving in and out of stop and go traffic. I got cut off by a kid in a testarossa in between traffic lights in a retail district this week; if wasn't paying attention I could have easily have hit him. It is for this reason I have half a million in liability coverage.

If I lived in farm country, I'd carry less insurance, probably.

 

[octanejunkie]

My questions for the OP are:

Have you thought not only about what it may cost to repair this? but also how long is it going to take to repair it? Do you have something else to drive during the repair time?

Many on this forum talk about not wanting to buy a vehicle that has been in a major crash or not wanting to have their 4Runners repaired after a major crash, because of safety, reliability, and/or resale concerns, yet you seem willing to want to disregard these concerns on a nearly 20 year old vehicle.

The thing I see wrong with wanting to fix this, is unless you are a repair expert, how are you going to really know what it needs to be fixed right. It is easy to see the cosmetic damage and think it can be fixed, but what about those hidden items that might pop up after you have spent thousands of dollars to get it into a semi repaired state?

My advice is to take the insurance money and either look for a low mileage vehicle of similar vintage to your 4Runner or consider upgrading to a newer 4Runner. In the long run it is going to be the easier solution with less stress and fewer headaches.

A touch indelicate, but a prudent perspective.

 

[tarsun]

i do allot of (or at least i used to before my son was born) downhill mountain biking. the bikes are heavy and expensive.

i was lazy one day and left the bike in the 4runner and went to work the next day. out of curiosity i called my insurance company to see if they covered the contents of the vehicle if everything was totaled. they do not... ok not a big deal.

but the shock came when i asked them what they valued my 4runner at. they explained that it does not matter how much work i did to the car (t-belt, water pump, rad, shocks, struts, springs, calipers, rotors, trans services, valve cover gaskets, plugs, wires, bearings, 1year old tires, seats, and a bunch of other things i am forgetting) that the "value of the car" is assumed to be in working condition... so all of that work is factored into the value already.

it turns out that my F***ing bicycle, in the back of the 4runner, is worth more than the actual 4runner.

hows that for a kicker... lol

 

[octanejunkie]

i do allot of (or at least i used to before my son was born) downhill mountain biking. the bikes are heavy and expensive.

i was lazy one day and left the bike in the 4runner and went to work the next day. out of curiosity i called my insurance company to see if they covered the contents of the vehicle if everything was totaled. they do not... ok not a big deal.

EDITED

it turns out that my F***ing bicycle, in the back of the 4runner, is worth more than the actual 4runner.

hows that for a kicker... lol

The real kicker is that the bike is NOT covered under your auto policy, but your homeowner's policy. If you rent an apartment and you don't have homeowner's insurance, or in that case renter's insurance, you would get nothing.

but the shock came when i asked them what they valued my 4runner at. they explained that it does not matter how much work i did to the car (t-belt, water pump, rad, shocks, struts, springs, calipers, rotors, trans services, valve cover gaskets, plugs, wires, bearings, 1year old tires, seats, and a bunch of other things i am forgetting) that the "value of the car" is assumed to be in working condition... so all of that work is factored into the value already.

This is not an accurate statement, they lied to you. Depending on the state you live in, there is their value and YOUR value, this is a negotiable corridor, ESPECIALLY in the event of a total loss. Insurance companies are NOTORIOUS for undervaluing and underpaying claimants in total loss payouts.

The value of your vehicle is subjective!

• Any improvements made to the vehicle in the last 12 months MAY be able to be factored into the total value. This includes things like LBJs, radiators, projectors, stereos. Save your receipts!
• Just like houses, the value of similar vehicles in a 100 mile radius (comparable, or comps) should be used to help set value
• You are entitled to a refund of the balance of fees and taxes, like prorated registration fees you paid the DMV and sales tax
• The payout on a total loss is NEGOTIABLE

Sadly, this means you will end up arguing with your insurance company and they are pro at that. They usually prey on the fact that you need the cash so they speed to close; and most time people want that too because it was their daily driver and they are without a car. If you have another car you can drive, take your time and wring them out, otherwise take the check and your lumps and move on.

Depending on your state laws, you can often accept payment of the uncontested amount of payout while still arguing total value. Read the fine print and know your policy and local laws concerning insurance.

Insurance companies save millions of dollars a year cheating their insured. It's a business to them. Know your rights, know your policy, save your receipts.

FWIW, there are a few insurance companies out there that will provide a 'stated value' for your vehicle. This coverage costs more, but provides more protection. I have a policy like that on the Chevy in my signature because there is no blue book value for it. I set my own.

 

[IBallEngineer]

Hey all, two weeks ago I was letting some friends drive my 4runner back from a camping trip and I got the dreaded call "hey man, we were in a wreck" - everyone is safe, thank goodness, but I just got word from insurance company they want to make it a total loss.


Is there anything you guys can see from these photos that would make you believe trying to retain ownership and get difference of salvage to value ? I just think this one has a lot of legs left to it and I can probably do most of the cosmetic repairs myself.

OK, there are three things that really bother me on this forum.

Bad advice on alignment
Bad advice on electrical repairs
Bad advice on body repairs

OK, more than 3

Asking for help and then not responding
And asking a question that can't be answered. What does the above question even mean?

OK, sorry for the mini rant

Now let's try to ignore the bad advice, or the lack of advice and take a good look at your damage.

THIS IS REPAIRABLE but....

unless you have been doing body work for a long time I'd say this is...

NOT REPAIRABLE by you.

As one post said, the core support and rt side fender apron are TOAST. Those parts are welded on and if purchased new are actually made up of at least 5 parts. If you get them used they need to be cut out of the donor vehicle, trimmed to remove what you don't need, and then welded in to your rig.

The frame is most likely not damaged based on the picture, but I assure you the upper body is NOT SQUARE. It's not rocket science to make it square, but do you own a friction jack or a pulling post and have a way to anchor your truck?

As someone else said, even if you were uber-confident in your skills, this is not a weekend repair. Even for a highly skilled tech this is a multi-weekend repair just to get it to the paint stage. In a shop a body man could get that part done in a few days, but that would run you over $1000. Unless of course your brother in law is a body man and owes you big time.

I would fix it in a heartbeat if it were mine. I'd even buy it if I could and fix it. But I have 35 years of experience on my side, and I teach auto body for a living, and have access to almost any tool or equipment I would need.

If you choose to fix it, understand it will not be easy, fast, or inexpensive. If you feel an attachment that out weighs those things. Then GO for it!

:flamethrwoer2:

 

[3bears]

I would take the money and walk
or
take the money, buy it back and make it into a crawler