Towing Travel Trailer in the Rockies

[monty876]

Hello,

I'm a newbie on this forum and wanted to ask any of that may have towed a travel trailer in the Rockies at any time. I have a 2010 Trail model that I typically tow a 4400 pound travel trailer in the flatlands of Michigan area.

I wanted to ask if there are any modifications that would be recommended to tow in the Rockies? I've heard of some adding additional cooling fans, but not sure if that is needed or not.

Any help or advice would much appreciated.

Thank you.

 

[wfo9]

I can't provide input from direct experience with the t4r, but I'm guessing towing with it in that environment is not going to be good at all. It's just not built for it. Its a struggle in the Rockies with anything other than a HD diesel truck. Even those get a really hard workout on some of the passes.

I'm sure you will get better responses from someone who has tried to tow in that environment with the t4r. My guess is that the tyranny cooler will need some help just to keep it from slipping.

Its going to be working really hard (depending on exactly where you are going). Very good move to post here and get some input before attempting it.

 

[G8RB8_12SR5]

I have a 4800lb travel trailer I've towed through the 6 or 7 passes down I-5 in far norther California/southern Oregon and to the Sierras. A few things that will make life far easier (and legal in some cases) if you don't already have them.

- A weight distribution hitch (I have a Pro Series I got on E-trailer.com)

- A brake controller (Tekonsha P3 which is only $20 more than the P2 also on E-Trailer)

- AirLift 1000 rear air bags (not required but they keep the truck at factory rake to level and make handling WAY better, especially in the mountains)

- Last but not least a tranny cooler (I don't have one but I also haven't towed through the rockies which is when I think it would be worth while).

Outside of that, I tow with original OEM tires and stock suspension, air bag make the most sense first because of the improved handling (after the whole legal requirements of working brakes and the manufacturer requirement for the 4Runner that if you tow over 1950lbs you shall use a WDH). Enjoy your trip!

 

[Biggcrisp]

Webfu opinion:

Should be able to maintain 45 mph while going up most grades.

Torque converter may unlock and build heat going upgrade.

Brakes should be up to the task, though you might be heating up the trailers brakes.

How far are you planning on traveling each day? 300 miles per day on flat ground is normal. Maybe you can limit mountain driving to less than 100 per day?

Keep us posted.

 

[monty876]

Thanks for the responses, much appreciated. I am already set up with w/d hitch and brake controller. The air bags sound like a good idea though. I haven't seen a need for them yet traveling here in the midwest, but makes sense in them helping to keep the vehicle more level, in turn, giving better overall control.

I imagined that a tranny cooler might be in order too because of the long gradient climbs out there. We simply get short steep stuff here in the midwest, so the TE seems to tackle those without much problem.

We aren't looking (unfortunately), to circumnavigate the state of Colorado. At this point, I think we're planning on heading into the mountains in Boulder, spend some time in the Keystone/Breckenridge area, then head south and back out of the mountains through Colorado Springs to head back east.

So do any of you have any suggestions for a good tranny cooler and what kind of cost I should be paying? The air bags I'll probably get off of Toytec as I have had good experience with them in the past.

On complete side note, those of you that have traveled through Colorado, any suggestions as to must see/visit/stay places in Colorado? We're traveling with two children and a couple of labs.

Thanks again for your help.

 

[iRide4Runner]

I pulled my 14ft pop up from MO to Silverton last summer. Pulled on 70 west from Denver to Grand Junction and then south on 550 over red mountain. I had a brake controller and a weight distributing hitch. As somebody else has already said, the 4runner just isn't built for it. You'll be in second gear winding it up quite a bit trying to pull up those steeper sections. Slow is your friend lol

 

[forwheeler]

On complete side note, those of you that have traveled through Colorado, any suggestions as to must see/visit/stay places in Colorado? We're traveling with two children and a couple of labs.

With dogs, your best bet is to stay away from the National Parks, they don't allow dogs on the trails. With that said, the dog park in Estes Park is amazing, with a lake for the dogs to jump in and cool down on a summer day. The Indian Peaks wilderness (Indian Peaks Wilderness - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) is just South of Rocky Mountain N.P. and allows dogs on leashes.

If you take your dogs hiking in the front range, be careful of rattlesnakes. Every year in Boulder a few dogs die from rattlesnake bites.

Camp Dick is a really nice campground and pretty close to Nederland to get supplies. There is also a stream for fly fishing, if you're into that. The biggest issue for me, when camping, is avoiding the fire bans that pop up in the summer. Its hard to predict which area will have a fire ban, but check out the various national park/forrest websites beforehand. We've had a bunch of snow this winter, which may help limit the need for fire bans.

Most of all, just have fun and enjoy the mountains and the relaxed pace of life.

 

[monty876]

Awesome information Forwheeler! Thank you. Definitely would be wise to check for fire restrictions. And the dog/snake thing, have thought about that...just not sure what to do about it really. I'm sure the rattlesnakes can be found just about anywhere really outside of a town. Will have to just make sure to keep the dogs by our side and listen.

Thank you for the link.

 

[WODWorldWide]

Awesome information Forwheeler! Thank you. Definitely would be wise to check for fire restrictions. And the dog/snake thing, have thought about that...just not sure what to do about it really. I'm sure the rattlesnakes can be found just about anywhere really outside of a town. Will have to just make sure to keep the dogs by our side and listen.

Thank you for the link.

We took the dogs to Eldorado Canyon State Park yesterday and had a great time. There is a creek for the dogs to splash around in and a rather nice trail (uphill) in the west end of the park. It's a must see if you ask me. $7 per vehicle or park before the town and walk in.

Also, if you are in the Boulder Area, The Chataqua Trailhead to Royal Arch is another good but a little strenuous one. We did take the dogs and they had a great time. Make sure to bring the leash unless your dog is certified to be off the leash.

If you drive past Vail, check out Hanging Lake, Its 1000 foot elevation gain in 1 mile but it's worth it. Get there really early though or later in the afternoon to find parking otherwise there is none.

As for towing a 5th gen on 70 up to the mountains, it'll be a challenge. I have a hard time just driving up there with my '14 trail with ski gear and a few passengers. Well the shifts are just really awkward.

 

[Phaedrus]

I've towed in Colorado most of my life. For Spring Break, I rented a Hybrid trailer (3500#) and took the family to Moab from Denver. The 4Runner pulled it just fine up to Eisenhower and Vail Pass, between 45-55mph in second and third gear. If I was going to be buying a trailer and towing it up here, I would definitely get airbags and a transmission cooler. My engine temp never varied, but I have no way of knowing how the transmission was doing...

Is the 4400# a dry weight? If so, be prepared to stay in second gear and have fun in the right lane with your blinkers on.

I'm not comfortable putting a weight-distributing hitch on here, without a real hitch. And by real hitch, I mean one that is bolted to the frame, not teh rear cross member like ours is. It might be fine, right up until the point it isn't.

 

[monty876]

Thanks WODWW, we will definitely check out Hanging Lake, sounds awesome!

4400 pounds is loaded, minus carrying water. My plan is keep most of the food out of there too, although that weight is pretty negligible. We'll stock up on food once we get to the destination.

Speaking of which, those of you that have been traveling Colorado, do you have any suggestions for some decent camping facilities in the Keystone/Breckenridge area? I don't carry a generator, so we'll need at least electrical hookup.

I'm sure the passes will be slow. I plan on hitting what I can either early in the morning or later in the evening to hopefully hit the cooler temps.

 

[Catchlight]

4Runner AT cooler standard in Canada

Monty876, your 4Runner might already have a factory transmission fluid cooler, like the ones sold in Canada do.

We have a travel trailer on order which will weigh 4300 pounds wet and ready to camp, and plan to tow it with my 2011 Trail Edition. I'm assured by experienced people on the trailer camping forums that the 4Runner will do adequately when climbing up the mountain passes. Some of them tow the same trailer as mine with FJ Cruisers, Honda Pilots, and Honda Ridgelines, all of which have the same 5000 pound tow capacity as your TE. To reduce the number of gearshifts stay out of overdrive, shift manually, and learn to get the torque converter to lock up when in 4th gear.

Another way to reduce the AT temperature might be to switch to a premium synthetic AT fluid (Amsoil, Mobil1, etc.).

Note that the Toyota Tacoma's tow capacity is rated at 6400 pounds, although its engine produces a bit less torque and horsepower than the 4Runner's. The Taco weighs about 600 pounds less than the Trail Edition, but that still leaves the truck with an 800 pound higher tow rating despite its less powerful engine. Apparently the Taco gets its higher tow rating because of its longer wheelbase.

 

[JohnJerk]

Well, having just travelled from park city, ut to page, az and back again over the Easter holiday I can say that there will be many older, worse matched, and over loaded tow tow rigs on the road next to you. But like my mom always says - it isn't good enough just to be better than the worst...

Having owned a '10 LE, I found towing over 3k pounds on long trips is work. The truck can do it and not breakdown and will be safe if you are not rushed and have trailer brakes. Airbag need is a function of tongue weight but can't hurt. You will need to be in 4th to protect the tranny from heat. Bottom line - lighten up, mod for towing to the extent you can per the previous posts and go slow and safe.

 

[JeremyB]

I've towed in Colorado most of my life. For Spring Break, I rented a Hybrid trailer (3500#) and took the family to Moab from Denver. The 4Runner pulled it just fine up to Eisenhower and Vail Pass, between 45-55mph in second and third gear. If I was going to be buying a trailer and towing it up here, I would definitely get airbags and a transmission cooler. My engine temp never varied, but I have no way of knowing how the transmission was doing...

The engine temp gauge is most likely a glorified dummy gauge. I'll check tomorrow on the way to work to see where it stops, but every other late model vehicles I've driven (which isn't all that many) doesn't move the needle once it gets close to operating temperature. I know the 4Runner stays constant from 180-195.

 

[dsfra]

Two Words: Transmission Cooler.

I was unpleasantly surprised at the high transmission temps the first few times I towed my ~ 2,200 lb trailer through some of the Northwest's mountain passes, even in mild (60 - 70 degree) conditions it was 220 degrees and rising. The cooler helps, but even at that you need to monitor the temp, stay out of 'D', and be patient. Even when not towing, on hot days going up steep passes the trans was seeing temps > 200 degrees.

One More Word (or maybe two?): ScanGauge.

Having the ScanGauge has been a real eye-opener. Seeing the tranny temps vary according to gear selection (D vs. S4), load, speed, etc has been enlightening, even entertaining. And it sure is nice to have an engine coolant temp gauge with real numbers on it.

 

[wfo9]

I would also spend a few bucks and get an app that lets you monitor trans temp. and a few other towing related parameter not on the dash

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/157752-torque-app-2014-a.html#post1572762

It will cost you about $20 max and I'm assuming everyone has a smartphone these days. This will should allow you to pull over and cool down in a safe place if the need arises.

 

[JeremyB]

The engine temp gauge is most likely a glorified dummy gauge. I'll check tomorrow on the way to work to see where it stops, but every other late model vehicles I've driven (which isn't all that many) doesn't move the needle once it gets close to operating temperature. I know the 4Runner stays constant from 180-195.

Compared OBD temp vs gauge on the way to work today. It crossed the bottom gauge tick at 115 deg F. However, I couldn't tell when the gauge needle stopped moving as the needle stops well short of the tick marks. Probably on purpose since it's a dummy gauge.

edit: eyeballed it. My gauge stays at 6.5 ticks from 168-195+.

 

[1F7]

dsfra, do you know how many degrees the B&M 70264 transmission cooler lowers the transmission fluid temperature? Is the temperature drop different towing versus non-towing? Did you install it in series with the stock radiator transmission cooler, and if so, is the B&M after the stock cooler?

I have a scangauge and was going to watch the transmission temperatures on our western trip to see if I needed a cooler, but maybe I should just do it.

Thanks,
Bill

 

[dsfra]

I can't say exactly what the temperature drop is with the cooler; obviously there is no way to switch the cooler in and out on the fly, and it would be difficult to have run in controlled conditions before and after installing it. I would say that the drop is something around 20 degrees, based on repeated trips over the same passes in similar conditions. I mounted the cooler as close to the A/C condenser as possible (about 1/8" or maybe even less) so that at low speeds the engine fan will suck air through the cooler, and at higher speeds the air will go through the cooler instead of around it. This also speeds the cool-down time when I pull over and sit at fast idle in neutral to let the ATF cool down (which I still seem to have to do more than I would like).

As I mentioned, even when not towing anything, in hot weather going up steep hills the ATF was getting too hot for my taste, and the cooler took care of that issue. In any case, use S4 to keep the torque convertor locked: find a long steady uphill grade, towing or not, switch back and forth between D and S4, and watch what your ATF temp does.

I installed it in series with the stock radiator transmission cooler, with the B&M after the stock cooler: tranny to stock radiator to B&M and then back to tranny. A good feature of the 70264 cooler is that it bypasses the cooler when the ATF is cold. Highly recommend that you use "fuel injection" hose clamps, not the cheap worm gear kind.

The B&M web site used to have a good pdf techdoc but it appears it's no longer there. Fortunately, I grabbed a copy of it:

 

[1F7]

Thanks dsfra for the informative post.

What's a reasonable maximum transmission fluid temperature? A chart posted awhile ago said 235 degrees required changing after 12000 miles. Certainly over 200 degrees is not desirable, but at what temperature do you stop and fast idle?

Bill