Tundra Brake (199mm vs 231mm)

[JayRolla]

I've had the 231s for a couple thousand miles and not noticed anything but better braking and no throbbing. But I drive like an old person…wait…I am an old person….

I did a complete rear brake job right before I did the 231s. If you're not using your emergency brake regularly, your rear brakes are likely out of adjustment and the extra load on the front would be more likely to trigger the ABS.

Got me curious, now. You'll find me in a snow covered parking lot doing panic stops as soon as we have snow.

It happens when you least expect it. Wife won't drive my rig in winter because of this issue.

 

[Myrunr2010]

It happens when you least expect it. Wife won't drive my rig in winter because of this issue.

This is my concern. My wife drives my truck all the time, and she has a little heavier foot than I do and follows a little closer than me. I'd hate for her to jump in the 4Runner to go somewhere and end up crushing someone from behind because the brakes locked up.

 

[Jhelms]

Been watching this topic and meant to test both my runners on dirt (01 and 02 both with 231's). However today, an asshat cut off several cars including me and I had to stand on the brakes HARD and ABS did trigger without question. Will see how it modulates on dirt or more loose conditions. Again though - this was in my 01 and the 01/02 have vastly different brake systems vs the previous gens.

I do want to add that I am very impressed with the way both my gunners stop. For a mid-sized SUV they come to a halt much quicker than I would expect. In some harder stops on the freeways here, I feel for idiots following to close behind me as their passenger cars have a hard time slowing at the same pace and usually lock them up.

 

[HeelAndToe85]

I'm very interested in this topic. I bought my '99 in January and it had warped rotors. I installed Brembo blank rotors soon after I bought it and brakes were working well until about a month ago when I started to get vibrations under braking again and it's getting progressively worse. I knew about the TBU, but I thought since I'm not towing and was buying high quality rotors it wouldn't happen to me for a long time. I was wrong.

Now I want to get 231s, but a 3rd-gen-owning coworker brought the front tires locking under ABS braking issue to my attention. Until yesterday there were so few cases out there experiencing this I thought I'd give it a try and ordered Tundra Brembo blank rotors, OEM 231mm pads and a shim kit online yesterday. Plan was to buy NAPA reman calipers once all the parts were delivered and do the install.

I was going to get objective and subjective braking data before and after for braking on both asphalt and gravel to see if the 231s would lock up with ABS or not. But now I'm leaning a bit more to returning the 231 bits and buying a 199 setup because I live in CO and highly value a realiably functioning ABS system.

So I guess I'm looking for input from the community? Do I do the 231 install and get good before and after data to share with the community? Do I return the 231 bits and just buy a 199 setup? I guess if the 231s do have ABS issues I can always sell that setup and go to 199s later. I like to do things right the first time and be done, which is why the 231 was so attractive in the first place in the sense of bigger is better, but now with the potential safety risk perhaps doing it right the first time means 199s.

 

[Scramble]

Wife won't drive my rig in winter because of this issue.

Thats a good thing right? :becky:

My GF cant drive stick.:eyebrows:

 

[violation]

Interested in this thread. I'm getting ready to do the TBU...

Is the consensus that 01-02 4Runners wont have the ABS issue?

 

[JayRolla]

Thats a good thing right? :becky:

My GF cant drive stick.:eyebrows:

Yes it is. My wife drives a stick very well. Why would you marry a chick that can "drive a stick"! HAHA.

I taught my women to drive a 400+whp AWD Turbo with a 2900lb race clutch. She can drive any stock clutch now.

 

[violation]

Yes it is. My wife drives a stick very well. Why would you marry a chick that can "drive a stick"! HAHA.

I taught my women to drive a 400+whp AWD Turbo with a 2900lb race clutch. She can drive any stock clutch now.

^ this guy gets it. :eyebrows:

 

[So Many Roads]

My $.02 on the 231 swap -
I put in typical kit and removed the ABS fuse.
They were bled/bedded correctly. I still retain OEM master cylinder.
I can stand on the brakes pretty hard and can't really get it to skid on pavement.
My rear axle seal in leaking, so my rears aren't 100% for sure,
but I figured I could get this thing to stop like a boss...

something must be off somewhere, any ideas?

Sonoran Steel believes the brake boosters have gone bad on many 4R's from 96 - 00. From their website:

"the vacuum dual diaphragm brake boosters on 1996-2000 are failing leading people to think that the stock brakes on the 3rd gen 4Runner are in adequate. 2001-2002 has a Hydroboost type brake master with no vacuum booster that directly controls the ABS, there is not separate controller block. When the trucks were brand new, the brakes were not in adequate. The test for a failing booster is put the truck in 4WD low. Drive forward 10 feet or so at 10 mph. Stand on the brakes and stop the truck as fast as you can. If the truck comes to a sudden stop, your booster is fine. If the truck slowly glides to a stop, guess what your booster is shot. So many people do the Tundra brakes thinking Toyota equipped the truck with inadequate brakes, that is not true."

 

[JZiggy]

Interesting note about checking your brake booster. I have always heard that after you turn off the engine and wait a few minutes the brake pedal should still go down easily at least a time or two, indicating the booster is not leaking.

Newbie question here -- Do the 199mm Tundra brakes require you to clearance the factory 6-spoke wheels like is needed for the 231's?

 

[Rock_Rat]

I absolutely love the 231 upgrade. Best mod I did. I wheel in mine (in 4WD and 2WD) on easy/moderate trails (blue), drive in the winter, and just recently did a 6-day trip in varied terrain mostly off-road without any problems.

I actually slammed on the brakes the other night when a deer jumped in front of me on my way home. No issues with ABS and no plans to "de-activate" it.

2001 4runner

Link to what I have installed is here

 

[HeelAndToe85]

I'm very interested in this topic. I bought my '99 in January and it had warped rotors. I installed Brembo blank rotors soon after I bought it and brakes were working well until about a month ago when I started to get vibrations under braking again and it's getting progressively worse. I knew about the TBU, but I thought since I'm not towing and was buying high quality rotors it wouldn't happen to me for a long time. I was wrong.

Now I want to get 231s, but a 3rd-gen-owning coworker brought the front tires locking under ABS braking issue to my attention. Until yesterday there were so few cases out there experiencing this I thought I'd give it a try and ordered Tundra Brembo blank rotors, OEM 231mm pads and a shim kit online yesterday. Plan was to buy NAPA reman calipers once all the parts were delivered and do the install.

I was going to get objective and subjective braking data before and after for braking on both asphalt and gravel to see if the 231s would lock up with ABS or not. But now I'm leaning a bit more to returning the 231 bits and buying a 199 setup because I live in CO and highly value a realiably functioning ABS system.

So I guess I'm looking for input from the community? Do I do the 231 install and get good before and after data to share with the community? Do I return the 231 bits and just buy a 199 setup? I guess if the 231s do have ABS issues I can always sell that setup and go to 199s later. I like to do things right the first time and be done, which is why the 231 was so attractive in the first place in the sense of bigger is better, but now with the potential safety risk perhaps doing it right the first time means 199s.

I wanted to follow up on this. I ended up buying NAPA rebuilt 231s, OEM pads, OEM shim kit and Brembo blank rotors for the TBU. Installed everything and was very impressed with the brake performance in every condition. Initial bite is better, total brake torque is better, brake modulation is better. I have had these installed for a month or so and have tested ABS in many conditions: dry pavement lockup, gravel road, wet road, ice, snowpack, high and low speeds. I have not found any condition where the ABS does not perform as intended.

Right now my truck is almost completely stock aside from the TBU. I compared all before and after performance on 265/70R16 highway all season tires (Toyo H/T Open Country).

 

[alwaysbored786]

I just bought the powerstop kit with the 231mm calipers, hope it turns out well! Will look into this ABS stuff.

 

[3bears]

argg

so I have a 2000 automatic 4wd

so am I reading this that the 2000 with the 231 calipers have issues with the abs, but don't have the issue with the 199's

ive been slowly piece meal my parts to do the 231 switch but maybe I should go with the 199's if this abs issue is real.
with my driving, the roads I hit, I don't want to loose ABS now that I am used to it

 

[kolelt]

I pulled my ABS bulb out. And cut the abs sensors in the rear axle. Whatever.

 

[HeelAndToe85]

argg

so I have a 2000 automatic 4wd

so am I reading this that the 2000 with the 231 calipers have issues with the abs, but don't have the issue with the 199's

ive been slowly piece meal my parts to do the 231 switch but maybe I should go with the 199's if this abs issue is real.
with my driving, the roads I hit, I don't want to loose ABS now that I am used to it

The point of my posting my experience with a 1999 is to help you make an informed decision. AFAIK 2000 automatic 4wd should be the same as my 1999 automatic 4wd and I haven't found any issues.

 

[Beau168]

A little off topic but I feel like the ABS is a little too intrusive and steps in too early, when the tires aren't close to locking up yet.

 

[trailbikerider]

Nobody has seemed to have answered this question yet, so I will ask it again.


This issue isn't prevalent on 2001s and 2002s, correct? My front rotors are warped ever so slightly, and I'm going to be towing a uhaul cross-country at the beginning of January, so I think I will be doing the TBU in the coming weeks. I need to decided whether I want to do the 199 or 231 upgrade.

 

[JayRolla]

A little off topic but I feel like the ABS is a little too intrusive and steps in too early, when the tires aren't close to locking up yet.

This is the main issue I had after TBU. I have had them engage just hitting a very small bump. It can be very dangerous if you dont know how to react.

 

[trailbikerider]

This is the main issue I had after TBU. I have had them engage just hitting a very small bump. It can be very dangerous if you dont know how to react.

Right, it seems to be a known issue on 96-00s, but I'm curious if 01-02s have the same issue since they use a hydroboost system.