Upper Control Arm... and the other stuff

[Bumbo]

I have been tempted by a full ICON kit since I found out about them, but I see a lot of people mix and match more often than not.

Is there a reason to keep everything from one vendor?

I see people using UCA from the cheapest ebay options to the blingy machined ICON arms. Not sure what route if generally considered "best bang for the buck, or the wise choice"

I don't really care about looks, just function. But I do care about overall build quality, construction, and features if they serve a functional purpose. I like to keep things simple and maintainable.

I am enjoying my 6112 and stock UCA as they are very low maintenance and have an OEM feel... After putting them on, there isn't much to do as even there are no threaded coilovers, just the pre-set adjustable set increments.

ICON also has a bunch of other rear suspension components like those trailing arms or pan hard bar? Not sure the proper names. Why do we need them, and do we have alternate options?

Last question... is there functional value just going with one of their full kits?

 

[Inv4drZm]

For the UCA's the most important thing is the uniball size and material. Not much is different between the manufacturer's. For example, the Total Chaos UCA's have a full stainless steel uniball but they are more expensive to replace from what I've seen. They will all get you roughly the same alignment numbers, important when over 2 inches of lift.

Every uniball UCA needs the uniball replaced at a certain number of miles depending on how clean you keep them and can squeak if not properly maintained and sometimes if they are. The uniball UCA's have another advantage, they give you the clearance needed to run the "extended travel" coilovers. (Not long travel)

A balljoint UCA stays cleaner and requires less maintenance than a uniball but usually has less travel and can't be run with the extended travel coilovers.


I don't see much difference with buying an Icon "stage" kit or similiar vs piecing together your own if you so choose.


Here is a guide for lower links my brother put together:
Lower Link Comparison Guide - Toyota FJ Cruiser Forum

The stock lower links can bend easy on the trail which is why most people upgrade to the beefier aftermarket options. Some of these options are also length adjustable to push your axle further back if you rub by the rear doors and to gain back the stock wheelbase after you lift your truck. Some are also offset to allow more travel if you have long travel shocks in the rear to take advantage of this.

 

[blackoutt]

All great info above ^. Opinion is what it really comes down to. What you're going to do with it, budget, and how fancy you want to go. You don't NEED any of it but somehow we all justify it lol.

One little point of clarification is that at least the newer style ball joint SPC/Light Racing ball joint UCA's can be run with the "extended travel" coilover options, advertising 80° of articulation (maybe that means 40 to left and 40 to the right?). Bilstein 5100's are slightly longer full extended length than FOX "extended travel" and people even run the 5100's with stock UCA's all the time. Edit: Just looked up your 6112's and they are in between the standard and extended travel length and full extension. Various 4th gen front shock lengths

For the ball joint maintenance reasons and additional caster/camber adjustability is why I went with the SPC's. I also snagged a great deal on ebay but they have since regulated their prices on the market and I would advice buying from a direct distributor for warranty purposes. Ebay and Amazon resellers aren't always going to help with warranty.

 

[EdmundGTP]

All great info above ^. Opinion is what it really comes down to. What you're going to do with it, budget, and how fancy you want to go. You don't NEED any of it but somehow we all justify it lol.

One little point of clarification is that at least the newer style ball joint SPC/Light Racing ball joint UCA's can be run with the "extended travel" coilover options, advertising 80° of articulation (maybe that means 40 to left and 40 to the right?). Bilstein 5100's are slightly longer full extended length than FOX "extended travel" and people even run the 5100's with stock UCA's all the time. Edit: Just looked up your 6112's and they are in between the standard and extended travel length and full extension. Various 4th gen front shock lengths

For the ball joint maintenance reasons and additional caster/camber adjustability is why I went with the SPC's. I also snagged a great deal on ebay but they have since regulated their prices on the market and I would advice buying from a direct distributor for warranty purposes. Ebay and Amazon resellers aren't always going to help with warranty.

This is accurate.. I have the Fox extended travel front coilovers and the SPC UCA's will let the suspension droop to full coilover extension, and then some. Just for shits I put a 0.25" top spacer on top of the fox coilover and the SPC UCA allowed for the extra ~.5" of droop. CV angle was looking funky for sure, but the UCA allowed it.

 

[Tooltime19]

The best advice I can give is to build to your needs. For example, some of us desert dwellers might build our rigs for fast desert running. So therfore we might mix and match certain parts aimed specifically towards our needs. Other guys want slow trail cruisers, or even rock crawlers. Nothing upsets a customer more than when they spend big coin for a high tech chassis package only to find out it doesn't work for their needs. Take your time and be honest with yourself. Lastly, buy strength! A good off road rig is a strong rig.

 

[gm350reratliff]

There have been some issues with the earlier versions of the SPC upper control arm but most of the issues seem to be corrected. I'm going to go ahead and jinx myself by saying my SPC's have been on for over 60k and I haven't had an issue. I like the fact that they use a sealed balljoint and I definitely like all the adjustment they allow. They are quiet and smooth so far and like EdmundGTP pointed out, they don't restrict travel.

I run the Camburg balljoint UCA's on my 5th gen but I was disappointed that they really didn't add any additional caster and there's no adjustment either. They are quiet and smooth but they will touch the coilover at full droop. At the first sign of trouble I will probably change them out for something else (maybe another set of SPC's).

They only other arms that I may try are the JBA HD arms. They are supposed to offer additional caster and be compatible with extended length coilovers. I also like the fact that they use a GM bolt-in style balljoint. While probably not the strongest design, you can at least find a replacement balljoint just about anywhere and should be able to replace it without special tools. I work with some Jeep guys that rave about JBA's stuff as well.

Now if I was going to retire my 4runner from DD duty and only use it on the trails, then I would probably go with a uni-ball setup from Total Chaos or something like that.

 

[Drunner97]

For the UCA's the most important thing is the uniball size and material. Not much is different between the manufacturer's. For example, the Total Chaos UCA's have a full stainless steel uniball but they are more expensive to replace from what I've seen. They will all get you roughly the same alignment numbers, important when over 2 inches of lift.

Every uniball UCA needs the uniball replaced at a certain number of miles depending on how clean you keep them and can squeak if not properly maintained and sometimes if they are. The uniball UCA's have another advantage, they give you the clearance needed to run the "extended travel" coilovers. (Not long travel)

A balljoint UCA stays cleaner and requires less maintenance than a uniball but usually has less travel and can't be run with the extended travel coilovers.


I don't see much difference with buying an Icon "stage" kit or similiar vs piecing together your own if you so choose.


Here is a guide for lower links my brother put together:
Lower Link Comparison Guide - Toyota FJ Cruiser Forum

The stock lower links can bend easy on the trail which is why most people upgrade to the beefier aftermarket options. Some of these options are also length adjustable to push your axle further back if you rub by the rear doors and to gain back the stock wheelbase after you lift your truck. Some are also offset to allow more travel if you have long travel shocks in the rear to take advantage of this.

running Camburg balljoint UCAs with Icon Extended length coilovers and I didn't have a single issue this past week doing some gnarly full droop/stuff black diamond trails. I believe the difference is negligent and since I'm not running whoops and long travel at 60+ mph I really shouldn't have an issue.

There have been some issues with the earlier versions of the SPC upper control arm but most of the issues seem to be corrected. I'm going to go ahead and jinx myself by saying my SPC's have been on for over 60k and I haven't had an issue. I like the fact that they use a sealed balljoint and I definitely like all the adjustment they allow. They are quiet and smooth so far and like EdmundGTP pointed out, they don't restrict travel.

I run the Camburg balljoint UCA's on my 5th gen but I was disappointed that they really didn't add any additional caster and there's no adjustment either. They are quiet and smooth but they will touch the coilover at full droop. At the first sign of trouble I will probably change them out for something else (maybe another set of SPC's).

They only other arms that I may try are the JBA HD arms. They are supposed to offer additional caster and be compatible with extended length coilovers. I also like the fact that they use a GM bolt-in style balljoint. While probably not the strongest design, you can at least find a replacement balljoint just about anywhere and should be able to replace it without special tools. I work with some Jeep guys that rave about JBA's stuff as well.

Now if I was going to retire my 4runner from DD duty and only use it on the trails, then I would probably go with a uni-ball setup from Total Chaos or something like that.

According to Camburg the extra caster is built into the arm. I've been running them for just over a year and haven't had a single issue with them or getting aligned correctly. In fact, just got my alignment done yesterday and they were easily able to give me 3 degrees on each side. With stock arms and lifted you're generally limited to around 1.5-2.0 because the cam tabs max out. It's that extra caster that helps reduce wandering.


All that being said, buy what you want. My understanding is that the droop between uniball and balljoint really isn't that much. If you really need to squeeze that extra 1/2" - 1" of travel then go uniball. Most of us don't really need it and the hassle of maintenance is more than enough to stick with balljoint.

 

[Inv4drZm]

running Camburg balljoint UCAs with Icon Extended length coilovers and I didn't have a single issue this past week doing some gnarly full droop/stuff black diamond trails. I believe the difference is negligent and since I'm not running whoops and long travel at 60+ mph I really shouldn't have an issue.

I know all the manufacturers 'recommend' the uniball UCAs with their extended travel coilovers. Usually 'recommends' means 'can be used against you in case of a warranty claim'.

I suppose aftermarket ball joint UCAs that are stronger and allow more travel over stock could fit under 'performance UCA' and maybe that's what ultimately the coilover manufacturers want their consumer to use with their extended travel shocks.

 

[Bumbo]

Thanks for the information everyone...

I like the idea of sticking with a UCA with a balljoint, but I really don't know what I am going to end up with. I want a setup that has strength.

At this point in time, I am almost 97.545% sure I would end up with ICON 2.5" RR CDCV coil overs and shocks front and rear... but that still leaves me with decisions to make on rear, spring, front UCA, and the other rear suspension tid-bits.

Does anyone know what ball joint UCA would work well with the ICON front coils. I would really like to go with their extended travel, but don't know if I want to deal with a uniball and maintenance. That said, I'm sure its not that bad.

Just to confirm, when we talk about extended travel, we are not talking about upward compression travel, we are talking about leg extension / droop when a wheel goes in the air?

Also uniball vs balljoint... does lift height matter 2" vs 2.5" vs 3", or this is only a conversation about droop?

 

[Drunner97]

Thanks for the information everyone...

I like the idea of sticking with a UCA with a balljoint, but I really don't know what I am going to end up with. I want a setup that has strength.

At this point in time, I am almost 97.545% sure I would end up with ICON 2.5" RR CDCV coil overs and shocks front and rear... but that still leaves me with decisions to make on rear, spring, front UCA, and the other rear suspension tid-bits.

Does anyone know what ball joint UCA would work well with the ICON front coils. I would really like to go with their extended travel, but don't know if I want to deal with a uniball and maintenance. That said, I'm sure its not that bad.

Just to confirm, when we talk about extended travel, we are not talking about upward compression travel, we are talking about leg extension / droop when a wheel goes in the air?

Also uniball vs balljoint... does lift height matter 2" vs 2.5" vs 3", or this is only a conversation about droop?

Like I said earlier, I'm running Camburg ball joint with the 2.5 Extended travel Icons (up to 3.5" of lift) I put the front setup through the tests with everything from fast fire road, to sandy switch backs, to crawling over black diamond (even 3 wheeled it at least once) and didn't have a single issue with the setup. I've been running the Camburgs themselves for a year with 5100s/885s, and not a single complaint.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Thanks for the information everyone...

I like the idea of sticking with a UCA with a balljoint, but I really don't know what I am going to end up with. I want a setup that has strength.

At this point in time, I am almost 97.545% sure I would end up with ICON 2.5" RR CDCV coil overs and shocks front and rear... but that still leaves me with decisions to make on rear, spring, front UCA, and the other rear suspension tid-bits.

What are you going to be driving over?

Does anyone know what ball joint UCA would work well with the ICON front coils. I would really like to go with their extended travel, but don't know if I want to deal with a uniball and maintenance. That said, I'm sure its not that bad.

The extra maintenance involved with the uniball is a squirt of tri-flow after you wash your truck or whenever you notice them squeaking. Ball joints theoretically last longer mileage-wise.

Just to confirm, when we talk about extended travel, we are not talking about upward compression travel, we are talking about leg extension / droop when a wheel goes in the air?

Yes, all droop.

Also uniball vs balljoint... does lift height matter 2" vs 2.5" vs 3", or this is only a conversation about droop?

Droop/misalignment amount. Uniballs theoretically give you more misalignment range as previously debated. Sometimes the UCA's lower cup contacts the coil on full droop depending on the individual setup and spring size, but can sometimes be solved by rotating the spring. Most of the time not an issue.

 

[Bumbo]

What are you going to be driving over?

D. All of the above... Daily driver use, fire roads, mountain and desert trails, some light to medium rock crawling, long overland style excursions, exploring around in the desert so sandy washes and the general obstacles we see out there... Anywhere my adventures take me and harder stuff as I get more experience and try new places and thing.... Occasional light duty towing (ATV or UTV)...

The extra maintenance involved with the uniball is a squirt of tri-flow after you wash your truck or whenever you notice them squeaking. Ball joints theoretically last longer mileage-wise.

I have a bottle of that already so not that big of a deal... that said, I never wash my rig haha. So when they get bad, is it a difficult process to replace them? Can it be done with the UCA still installed in the rig?

What about ball joint replace? Same deal?

.[/QUOTE]

Droop/misalignment amount. Uniballs theoretically give you more misalignment range as previously debated. Sometimes the UCA's lower cup contacts the coil on full droop depending on the individual setup and spring size, but can sometimes be solved by rotating the spring. Most of the time not an issue.

Last visual inspection I noticed a small scuff on the outside edge of my 6112 coilovers... I am using the stock UCA, but I presume this was most likely caused by that. That said, when the front end is jacked up, clearance looked fine. A rock perhaps? That said, I still have my front sway bar on so I haven't seen what it looks like when flexing.

Thanks

 

[whte4r]

I have similar questions as the OP, as well as similar driving conditions..rock crawling, fire roads, and occasionally desert roads. I already purchased the rear ICON 2.5 RR extended travel cdcv shocks. And am waiting to receive the 3" overland shocks and the front 2.5 extended travel shocks. Im currently running the light racing spc UCAs. Is it necessary to replace these with something like camburg or icons? If I were to get a snorkel and trying to plan for increased water exposure, would one be better than the other (uniball vs balljoint)? Also, if your going for 'do it once, do it right' would you replace the rear lower links, upper links, and track bar at the same time? Would this make it possible to fit 35s? Any input on other additions to the setup or things you think would be a good idea to include in this upgrade would be appreciated! Steel bumper with a winch is on the list as well...which should hopefully be done in October.

 

[Inv4drZm]

D. All of the above... Daily driver use, fire roads, mountain and desert trails, some light to medium rock crawling, long overland style excursions, exploring around in the desert so sandy washes and the general obstacles we see out there... Anywhere my adventures take me and harder stuff as I get more experience and try new places and thing.... Occasional light duty towing (ATV or UTV)...



I have a bottle of that already so not that big of a deal... that said, I never wash my rig haha. So when they get bad, is it a difficult process to replace them? Can it be done with the UCA still installed in the rig?

What about ball joint replace? Same deal?




Last visual inspection I noticed a small scuff on the outside edge of my 6112 coilovers... I am using the stock UCA, but I presume this was most likely caused by that. That said, when the front end is jacked up, clearance looked fine. A rock perhaps? That said, I still have my front sway bar on so I haven't seen what it looks like when flexing.

Thanks

For your range of uses, those shocks are the perfect choice. When its time to replace the uniballs, you need to take them off the truck to use a press to get them out I'm pretty sure, but I've never done it. No idea if this is necessary on the balljoints.

 

[Inv4drZm]

I have similar questions as the OP, as well as similar driving conditions..rock crawling, fire roads, and occasionally desert roads. I already purchased the rear ICON 2.5 RR extended travel cdcv shocks. And am waiting to receive the 3" overland shocks and the front 2.5 extended travel shocks. Im currently running the light racing spc UCAs. Is it necessary to replace these with something like camburg or icons?

Not necessary as some people have wheeled the snot out of their SPC UCA's. Some have had trouble with welds breaking or something on those but were warrantied and supposedly fixed by the manufacturer. I would just run them unless they give you issues, unless you get bored with them or have a bunch of money laying around.

If I were to get a snorkel and trying to plan for increased water exposure, would one be better than the other (uniball vs balljoint)?

Balljoints are more sealed but as long as its not salt water uniballs should be fine. Because balljoints are more enclosed, I could see them more easily trapping water inside vs uniballs which would easily air-dry so its probably a wash between the two.(See what I did there?)

Also, if your going for 'do it once, do it right' would you replace the rear lower links, upper links, and track bar at the same time? Would this make it possible to fit 35s?

They might help a little bit, you can fine-tune the position of the rear axle if they are adjustable depending on where you rub under compression. But they are mostly just durability upgrades over the stock gear.

Any input on other additions to the setup or things you think would be a good idea to include in this upgrade would be appreciated! Steel bumper with a winch is on the list as well...which should hopefully be done in October.

I'd be too afraid to go wheeling in rocks without my sliders and a full set of skid plates, but that's because I'm a broke college kid. Also total chaos spindle gussets are cheap insurance from bending a spindle on the trail if you know a guy who can weld them on.

Capability wise, after your mentioned 35's, would be a rear locker. An e-locker retrofit 3rd member from an FJ would run $600 if your handy but a full ARB air locker like most do is probably at least $1500. Your ATRAC system can get you through a lot though, I'd stick with ATRAC for the time being and see if the trails you run call for a true locker.