TechWrench
Senior Member
Right out of the owners manual, pg 262.
weight distributing hitch
- Thread starter drnick
- Start date
Right out of the owners manual, pg 262.
TechWrench
Senior Member
You are correct, an air bag kit, or helper springs will only reduce the amount of suspension drop when the load is placed on the hitch. They will not help with transfering some of the load to the front axle. Only a WD system will acomplish that. IMHO, if necessary, an adjustable air system is the better choice. You can adjust the amount of lift based on the load, and when not loaded, reduce the assist and return to normal ride height and ride comfort.
Also, installing an air lift system will most likely mean you will have to re-do the setup for the WD system to achieve proper weight transfer and a level trailer.
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TechWrench
Senior Member
Looks like you got a good deal on the receiver hitch. It is interesting to note that the manufacturers appear to have reduced the max tongue and tow weight ratings over time, compared to when I got mine. If Toyota still locates the electrical connection in the same place as mine ('03), then you will have to relocate yours to the bracket on the new hitch. I had to remove two of the wire-ties holding the wiring harness to the underside floor of the vehicle, next to the spare, to get enough slack to let it reach the new mounting location. And, unless they made it easier, the bigest obstacle you will have is removing the oem hitch. Unless it has changed from my vintage, it is mounted to the rear crossmember with 6 large bolts. Only two are easily acccessed. I had to remove the bumper cover to get the other 4. Not too complicated, just a lot extra work.
Good luck, and watch out for those knuckles................
TechWrench
Senior Member
There are several companies making aux trans coolers, but I installed a Hayden and am very happy with it. They make several different sizes (and at the moment I can't remember which one I have). I installed mine in series after the oem radiator cooler. I mounted it in front of the radiator/A/C condenser, and it works great.
OrdnanceMarine
New member
Good luck, and watch out for those knuckles................
Bustin' knuckles is part of the fun. It's when you bust knuckles that still haven't healed from their last good bustin' that it actually starts to bother me! Actually I manage to wear thin gloves when I can and am good friends with a bottle of New-Skin for the rest of the time.
TechWrench
Senior Member
I have been twisting wrenches for over 40 years, and gave up counting the scars and other assorted 'modifications' that I have been 'blessed' with over the years. Fortunately, none of them were serious, only cosmetic........:cheers:
TechWrench Since my last post I have been checking into the WD hitch and the V-6. I am yet to find ANY documentation from Toyota confirming this. I have talked to a service manager and a parts manager at a dealer and they can find nothing from Toyota to confirm this.
It does state that for the V8 to carry it full weight you need a weight distributing hitch. But I have been unable to find any claim from Toyota stating or advising against using a WD hitch with the V6.
Where do you get your info? I do see posts from individuals who say what you say but I see post from individuals that disagree. Peoples opinions are just that, opinions. What proof is there to say that you shouldn't use a WD hitch with a V6?
I am currently on hold with a Toyota rep who is researching this.
They mentioned exactly what is in the manual:
Towing capacity (trailer weight + cargo
weight), kg (lb.):
For weight carrying hitch 2268 (5000)
Also for weight distributing hitch2UZ- FE engine only
Two- wheel drive models
3311 (7300)
Four- wheel drive models
3175 (7000)
According to the rep I spoke to there are no issues, notices warning or whatever that speak about problems or other issues using a WD hitch with the V6. The rep then stated had there been any problems associated with this they would be able to reference them.
I have checked with Toyota three different ways and I have found nothing from Toyota that states there is a problem using a WD hitch with the V6 as long as I stay within the recommended weight limits outlined in the owners manual.
It does state that for the V8 to carry it full weight you need a weight distributing hitch. But I have been unable to find any claim from Toyota stating or advising against using a WD hitch with the V6.
Where do you get your info? I do see posts from individuals who say what you say but I see post from individuals that disagree. Peoples opinions are just that, opinions. What proof is there to say that you shouldn't use a WD hitch with a V6?
I am currently on hold with a Toyota rep who is researching this.
They mentioned exactly what is in the manual:
Towing capacity (trailer weight + cargo
weight), kg (lb.):
For weight carrying hitch 2268 (5000)
Also for weight distributing hitch2UZ- FE engine only
Two- wheel drive models
3311 (7300)
Four- wheel drive models
3175 (7000)
According to the rep I spoke to there are no issues, notices warning or whatever that speak about problems or other issues using a WD hitch with the V6. The rep then stated had there been any problems associated with this they would be able to reference them.
I have checked with Toyota three different ways and I have found nothing from Toyota that states there is a problem using a WD hitch with the V6 as long as I stay within the recommended weight limits outlined in the owners manual.
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CAN-03runner
New member
I think this was cleared up already, but here is "my" attempt for the benefit of others and for myself if I got this wrong to be corrected. After a bunch of time trying to figure this out here is what I came up with.
This link
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/94003-tow-hitch-2.html#post826896
shows the standard hitch "Reciever" found on the 4th Gen V6 4Runner. It bolts up to the middle of the last crossmember hidden by the plastic bumper cover rated for 5000lbs. On the V8 this is also rated for 5000lbs.
This next link is a hitch receiver that is similar in concept to the optional V8 hitch receiver. There is nothing stopping you from installing this type of receiver onto a V6 4Runner. Notice that it bolts to the frame rails on both sides and not just right in the middle. That is key here in its' ability to distribute weight. Alos note that there are 2 weight ratings.
Weight Carrying: 600/6,000 lbs. (TW/GTW)
Weight Distributing: 730/7,300 lbs. (TW/GTW)
So now if the truck that this gets bolted onto, is capable of pulling and stopping the load, it now has a "receiver hitch" "Rated" for 600/6,000 lbs. (TW/GTW) "weight carrying" meaning that the total weight of the load, trailer+whatever is on the trailer weighs max 6000lbs.
http://www.hiddenhitch.com/content/products.aspx?lvl=3&parentid=1000&catID=1040&part=70779
If you then add this contraption, you will be able to make use of the Weight Distributing: 730/7,300 lbs. (TW/GTW) "Rating" of the hitch receiver. Even on the V8, without this contraption you probably shouldn't be towing the 7000lbs. It is not just the receiver that dictates you capacity, but the whole weight distribution system.
Common Weight Distribution and Sway Control Questions | etrailer.com
This link
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/94003-tow-hitch-2.html#post826896
shows the standard hitch "Reciever" found on the 4th Gen V6 4Runner. It bolts up to the middle of the last crossmember hidden by the plastic bumper cover rated for 5000lbs. On the V8 this is also rated for 5000lbs.
This next link is a hitch receiver that is similar in concept to the optional V8 hitch receiver. There is nothing stopping you from installing this type of receiver onto a V6 4Runner. Notice that it bolts to the frame rails on both sides and not just right in the middle. That is key here in its' ability to distribute weight. Alos note that there are 2 weight ratings.
Weight Carrying: 600/6,000 lbs. (TW/GTW)
Weight Distributing: 730/7,300 lbs. (TW/GTW)
So now if the truck that this gets bolted onto, is capable of pulling and stopping the load, it now has a "receiver hitch" "Rated" for 600/6,000 lbs. (TW/GTW) "weight carrying" meaning that the total weight of the load, trailer+whatever is on the trailer weighs max 6000lbs.
http://www.hiddenhitch.com/content/products.aspx?lvl=3&parentid=1000&catID=1040&part=70779
If you then add this contraption, you will be able to make use of the Weight Distributing: 730/7,300 lbs. (TW/GTW) "Rating" of the hitch receiver. Even on the V8, without this contraption you probably shouldn't be towing the 7000lbs. It is not just the receiver that dictates you capacity, but the whole weight distribution system.
Common Weight Distribution and Sway Control Questions | etrailer.com
Attachments
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There is more than the hitch. You have brakes, suspension, drive line (axels and gears), aux coolers. There may be other components or structural differences that need to be considered.
CAN-03runner
New member
Right, that's why I never said bolt this up and go out and pull 7000lbs. I'm just saying the basic hitch is officially rated for 5000lbs, this hitch is officialy rated for 6000lbs and 7300lbs if you have all the weight distributing goodies and your truck can handle it.
I put up the picture and links to hopefully try to make sure we were all talking about the same parts and that the full weight distributing hitch is not just made up of the receiver. I think one of the points that people are talking about here is that the weight distributing torsion bars should only be used with a weight distributing hitch receiver and not the standard 4Runner hitch bolted to the center of the last crossmember if you are going to come close to the max rating of the hitch receiver.
Just like you can bolt this up to a yaris, doesn't mean you should pull a trailer with it, and because your pickup can pull 12000lbs..but not with a ClassII hitch.
I have sucessfully pulled 6000lbs with my V8 4runner sport with OME suspension and the standard 5000lbs hitch several times for about 40miles almost all highway. Its not that far, but not around the block either. It did very well. Now I am installing the 6000lbs hitch receiver. But enventhough the hitches are made with a lot of over doing it.
What I would identify as the key element is trailer brakes. I really could feel them slowing the trailer down, and I didn't feel like the trailer was pushing me at all or that I had to press harder on the brake pedal.
I put up the picture and links to hopefully try to make sure we were all talking about the same parts and that the full weight distributing hitch is not just made up of the receiver. I think one of the points that people are talking about here is that the weight distributing torsion bars should only be used with a weight distributing hitch receiver and not the standard 4Runner hitch bolted to the center of the last crossmember if you are going to come close to the max rating of the hitch receiver.
Just like you can bolt this up to a yaris, doesn't mean you should pull a trailer with it, and because your pickup can pull 12000lbs..but not with a ClassII hitch.
I have sucessfully pulled 6000lbs with my V8 4runner sport with OME suspension and the standard 5000lbs hitch several times for about 40miles almost all highway. Its not that far, but not around the block either. It did very well. Now I am installing the 6000lbs hitch receiver. But enventhough the hitches are made with a lot of over doing it.
What I would identify as the key element is trailer brakes. I really could feel them slowing the trailer down, and I didn't feel like the trailer was pushing me at all or that I had to press harder on the brake pedal.
There is allot of misunderstanding here. Adding the WD will not increase the amount that the V6 will pull but it will tow better. Nowhere does Toyota state you cannot use a WD hitch with the V6. There are people who claim it can't but there is nothing to base that on.
CAN-03runner
New member
Ross, I'm not sure if you are agreeing with me, or disagreeing with me.
In the quoted text of mine, I don't say "bolt this on and go out and pull more than 5000 lbs".
And in the bolded text I'm saying the torsion bars of the weight distributing system works best with a weight distributing hitch receiver.
The tounge weight also increase with one of these hitch receivers, with or without the distribution system.
Also if you were going to pull more than 5000lbs, then the standard hitch is not officially rated for more than 5000 lbs.
As additional info concerning the V6 I can add this. I have 2 trail buddies who pulled camper trailers with V6 FJ cruisers that weigh more than 5000 lbs. One guy added a tranny cooler. To be fair one of those guys went and traded his FJ for a dodge ram instead. The issue is the transmission is hunting for the right gear when going uphill. But I'm not sure if they keep it in D or 4, and also that guy might have wanted a big pickup anyway...so that was his excuse in his mind.
In the quoted text of mine, I don't say "bolt this on and go out and pull more than 5000 lbs".
And in the bolded text I'm saying the torsion bars of the weight distributing system works best with a weight distributing hitch receiver.
The tounge weight also increase with one of these hitch receivers, with or without the distribution system.
Also if you were going to pull more than 5000lbs, then the standard hitch is not officially rated for more than 5000 lbs.
As additional info concerning the V6 I can add this. I have 2 trail buddies who pulled camper trailers with V6 FJ cruisers that weigh more than 5000 lbs. One guy added a tranny cooler. To be fair one of those guys went and traded his FJ for a dodge ram instead. The issue is the transmission is hunting for the right gear when going uphill. But I'm not sure if they keep it in D or 4, and also that guy might have wanted a big pickup anyway...so that was his excuse in his mind.
g8r4runner
New member
Ok, now I"m thoroughly confused. I understand the WCH and WDH. I have an 06 V6 4WD, with hitch. I looked and it is mounted to the rails, not simply the rear crossmember. So I can mount a WDH, correct? And remain under 500/5000#? We're looking at travel trailers and want to make sure we'll be ok.
TechWrench
Senior Member
I got my information directly from the Toyota oem owners manual that came with my '03 V6 4Runner. The following is a direct quote from page 264, upper right corner, under the heading "HITCHES"
"Use only weight carrying hitch hardware designed for the total trailer weight with the factory installed hitch." I added the color highlighting to emphasize the area in question.
Just because the Toyota dealer personnel aren't aware of the issue, doesn't mean it isn't valid. I have found quite often, over the years, that some dealership employees are less knowledgable about the vehicles they sell than many of the enthusiasts that frequent this forum. I have done my best to explain the reason why a weight distribution system is not a good idea with the factory V6 receiver hitch that is mounted to the rear crossmember. It is up to you to decide what you do with your vehicle.
TechWrench
Senior Member
If you are sure the receiver hitch on your vehicle is mounted directly to the two main frame members on either side of the spare, then you should be able to use a weight distribution system properly rated for the size/weight trailer you intend to pull. Just remember, the oem V6 factory hitch is mounted by six bolts to a crossmember, which passes directly behind the spare, and is welded to both frame members. That rear crossmember is not designed with the same strength as the integral crossmember that all frame mounted receiver hitches rated for weight distribution are. Also remember that not all frame mounted receiver hitches are built or rated the same. Different manufacturers have designed them for different max ratings. Just look at some of the different models listed, for the same vehicle, on any of the aftermarket hitch suppliers sites, and see the difference in ratings between them. One should know exactly what the equipment they are using, or intend to use, is rated for.
CAN-03runner
New member
I say yes. The truck and hitch is rated for 500/5000 and toyota says you can pull 5000 so why wouldn't it be able to. But I would make sure the trailer has brakes and a transmission cooler if your 4runner doesn't have one already.
To make your towing experience more enjoyable, have peace of mind, whatever, you may want to look into the extras and goodies like load balancing and sway control and maybe air bag helper springs. Maybe you'll need it, and maybe not.
My experience has been very good without that stuff. Except I have a lift with OME weight carrying springs.
According to those I have talked to from Toyota, you can use a WD hitch with a 4th gen V6. There is nothing additional you will need to mount to your vehicle. The hitches you plug into your vehicle will be different, there are a couple of torsion bars that mount to that hitch and it then attached to the trailer usually with a chain. The chain attaches to amount that is attached to the trailer.
TechWrench
Senior Member
According to those I have talked to from Toyota, you can use a WD hitch with a 4th gen V6. There is nothing additional you will need to mount to your vehicle. The hitches you plug into your vehicle will be different, there are a couple of torsion bars that mount to that hitch and it then attached to the trailer usually with a chain. The chain attaches to amount that is attached to the trailer.
If the 'experts' at Toyota tell you to use a WD hitch with your V6 oem hitch, then by my guest, it's not my vehicle. But, if the rear crossmember bends out of shape, will they be willing to make it good for you? I bet not!!!
FYI, the picture of the two system in your post, IS a Weight Distribution hitch system. Any tow system that uses spring bars attached to the ball mount head, and connected to the trailer frame with either adjustable chains or support brackets is a weight distribution system. Any tow system that uses only a ball mount to support the trailer weight without any type of spring bar or leveling system is a Weight Carrying system. The two systems are not the same, and they each affect the tow vehicle differently.
I have done all I can to explain my position on this issue. If I am not getting through, I guess I have failed in my many attempts at explaining myself. If anyone feels that the 'brilliant' service people at these Toyota dealers know more than all the experienced towing experts I have read and talked to, then by all means do as you wish. I see no benefit in my continuing this discussion any further.
OrdnanceMarine
New member
I'm not sure if some of us here are violently agreeing or whether there's disagreement or confusion or some of everything.
Page 365 of my 2007 Owner's Manual contains the following notice:
"Do not install weight distributing hitch to weight carrying hitch receiver because it will be damaged your vehicle" (their bad grammar, not mine).
Is anyone here of the opinion that this says anything OTHER than DO NOT install a weight distributing hitch (parts containing the hitch ball and spring bars) to a weight CARRYING (not distributing) hitch receiver (a.k.a. the stock receiver that is bolted to the aft crossmember)?
So, you need one of these 2007 Toyota 4Runner Trailer Hitch | etrailer.com in order to use one of these WD Only Up to 10000 lbs GTW Weight Distribution | etrailer.com
Page 365 of my 2007 Owner's Manual contains the following notice:
"Do not install weight distributing hitch to weight carrying hitch receiver because it will be damaged your vehicle" (their bad grammar, not mine).
Is anyone here of the opinion that this says anything OTHER than DO NOT install a weight distributing hitch (parts containing the hitch ball and spring bars) to a weight CARRYING (not distributing) hitch receiver (a.k.a. the stock receiver that is bolted to the aft crossmember)?
So, you need one of these 2007 Toyota 4Runner Trailer Hitch | etrailer.com in order to use one of these WD Only Up to 10000 lbs GTW Weight Distribution | etrailer.com
TechWrench
Senior Member
:thumb3: Just what I have been trying to say, but it appears to be falling on some deaf ears. There are those that feel the dealership personnel are the last/best source of technical information on our 4Runners. Saddly, it has been proved to me over and over again that this is not the case. I am sure there are some very competent Toyota employees out there, and I appologize to them, but there are many who know very little when it comes to general sales and how to perform basic service on a vehicle.
