Who's had both? KDSS and Non KDSS.

[gjcarving]

Hello. I'm looking at picking up a 2020 in the near future. I'll first start by saying I have read all the KDSS/non KDSS threads I could find. The problem is many of the posts are opinions and not actual facts or experiences.

I am hoping to get some input from people that may have owned both and can give their actual pros and cons of their experiences.

I also have a few questions about KDSS in certain situations.

1. If I lift the truck with KDSS does it impede any function of the system? I know a lot of people do it but for me if it doesn't

2. I've driven both and the KDSS definetly feels tighter on road. But, haven't had a chance to stretch their legs on even extended test drives. Does the KDSS actually slow better articulation and a more planted ride? And, how is the feel on washboard roads? I will be doing a lot of that in my state.

3. The skid plate. I can see that the KDSS plate sticks more forward than the non. I've rad a lot of responses of people saying it's a problem. Problem is most I've seen don't even have the KDSS option. Wondering if try experiences of clearances and usage.

I have a 13' Tundra that will stay. The 4R will be my main driver and will keep it stock or mostly stock other than tires. I may go a 1 +|- inch lift, but will be keeping stock size tires. I will be using it extensively on F/S road and trails throughout the 4 Corners states and beyond.

Any other input or knowledge would be greatly appreciated. thank you for your time!

 

[llDemonll]

1. No. Generally you just can't lift KDSS above 3". System will still function fine with a lift.

2. Can't comment, haven't driven a non-KDSS in those scenarios. Unless the washboard is really uneven height between left and right side of the car you won't notice anything.

3. Skid plate, unless you're doing some really gnarly approach angles, won't be an issue.

 

[mteolus]

I don't own the non-KDSS, but for #1 (as long as it is 3" or less) it will only impede your articulation if you don't get extended length shocks. There are two other ways to improve your articulation on KDSS as well, one is installing a Sonoran Steel Trac bar and the second is being developed by someone who is a member of this message board.

 

[thirteen]

I have KDSS and it's great with curvy mountain highways, but it does nothing for washboard roads. It's still a rough ride. The simple solution is to air down your tires, KDSS or not.

 

[Hans Moleman]

Keep in mind while it's a $1000 option, it's a $3000 to $4000 repair bill if it goes south on you after the warranty is over.

 

[am0767]

Keep in mind while it's a $1000 option, it's a $3000 to $4000 repair bill if it goes south on you after the warranty is over.

i spoke with a toyota tech about the KDSS. it is expensive to fix. and he said to me that the ones that have problems, start at around 70k or 80k miles

 

[baldrik78]

1. If I lift the truck with KDSS does it impede any function of the system? I know a lot of people do it but for me if it doesn't

2. I've driven both and the KDSS definetly feels tighter on road. But, haven't had a chance to stretch their legs on even extended test drives. Does the KDSS actually slow better articulation and a more planted ride? And, how is the feel on washboard roads? I will be doing a lot of that in my state.

3. The skid plate. I can see that the KDSS plate sticks more forward than the non. I've rad a lot of responses of people saying it's a problem. Problem is most I've seen don't even have the KDSS option. Wondering if try experiences of clearances and usage.

1. I have 3.25"/2" Front/Rear lift with KDSS and it functions normally. Stay away from long-travel setups and don't lift the rear more than 2" - these can over-extend the KDSS pistons.

2. KDSS definitely feels tighter on the roads. It will feel rougher on washboards above 12 mph, as that is when the front-to-back valve closes. I get very good articulation below 12 mph. What helps more than anything on washboards is to air down. 18-20 psi will still let you move at a pretty good clip, while feeling a lot softer.

3. Never really had an issue with the front skid plate. I'm pretty sure the front skid is the same across the board, with the exception of the Pro front skid. Even then, you can still use that skid plate with KDSS, but you'll have to cut notches in the sides for the sway-bar to articulate.

 

[MikesTE]

I've had two 4Runners with KDSS and one without. The 'without' is a Pro so it still may be apples to oranges. I can tell you, emphatically, the KDSS rides great. It stays a lot more level in the corners. Having said this, it doesn't help nose dive (obviously)... I didn't notice much negative affect of having KDSS off-road. On one of the the two 4Runners w/ KDSS I swapped out the front struts with Bilsteins to level it a little and also offset nose dive. The tech at the Goodyear place had no problem fitting it around the KDSS stuff. In comparison, the ride of the Pro is a lot more plush. I would say it 'wallows' a little but in a good way, if that makes sense. Contrary to popular belief, I see no downside with KDSS (particularly if you won't mess with suspension). Harder to find though and obviously adds a bit of $. I would be hard-pressed to not recommend KDSS. The Pro is a much nicer all around suspension to me, who won't ever upgrade from a factory suspension. Everyone else's points were valid/good too.

 

[BobsTrail]

What helps more than anything on washboards is to air down. 18-20 psi will still let you move at a pretty good clip, while feeling a lot softer.

It's a nuisance, but I always air down for washboard and rough roads. Softens the ride, is easier on suspension parts and better for the passengers.

 

[DigitalAviatorZ]

I had a 2011 Landcruiser which has kdss, and I have a 2020 ORP without. The LC was a perfect highway vehicle discounting the efficiency. Smooth and controlled on everything from mountain roads to the interstate.

I had a bad experience lifting the LC, which impacted my decision to not get it on the 4Runner. The lean and asymmetric solutions like a trim packer on one side are not worth it IMHO.


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[Jeff_DML]

.. I didn't notice much negative affect of having KDSS off-road. ...

I thought KDSS was supposed to help offroading since it effectively disables the sway bars?

 

[mteolus]

I thought KDSS was supposed to help offroading since it effectively disables the sway bars?

Yea, don't exactly know what he meant, but KDSS does give you better articulation off-road.

 

[jhguth]

didn't own KDSS, but rented one for long trip that included offroad before buying my current 4Runner

1. no problems <2.5-3", but if you are going more than that or doing long travel that doesn't work with KDSS

2. KDSS feels better at speed and does articulate better as stock. washboards are harsher with KDSS with the stock tires, on my AT tires it's a much smaller difference but i'll still drop the tires ~3-5psi if i have a long stretch of washboard gravel

3. KDSS does limit you a little in regards to front skid, although there are mulitple options compatible with KDSS. similar story with lower control arms, but there are now at least a few KDSS compatible options for KDSS

KDSS is very reliable and used in tons of vehicles, not just 4Runners

 

[AMLOR]

i spoke with a toyota tech about the KDSS. it is expensive to fix. and he said to me that the ones that have problems, start at around 70k or 80k miles

"The more complicated the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the toilet."
James Dohan aka Scotty

Mercedes ruined me for "hydraulic suspensions". My old S600's last repair was a $5200 bill for the Automatic Body Control system. and you can't just disconnect it, as the struts are made to work exclusively with the ABC system.

Traded the S600 on the 19 TRD PRO WITHOUT KDSS. Not interested, no thank you & you couldn't pay me to have it!

 

[jhguth]

few people have had expensive repairs, it's overwhelmingly reliable to high mileage

 

[llDemonll]

Mercedes ruined me for "hydraulic suspensions". My old S600's last repair was a $5200 bill for the Automatic Body Control system. and you can't just disconnect it, as the struts are made to work exclusively with the ABC system.

Traded the S600 on the 19 TRD PRO WITHOUT KDSS. Not interested, no thank you & you couldn't pay me to have it!

Yes, Mercedes, the pinnacle of reliability...

 

[Keith M]

I had a 2017 with KDSS with 5100's front and rear. There were no issues at the .85 setting. I now have a 2020 TRD ORP that is stock. I miss the KDSS ride. Never took the 2017 off road but can tell you that the road handling was really, really nice. Predictable with very little sway. My only influencing factor for not getting it on the 202 was this:

Keep in mind while it's a $1000 option, it's a $3000 to $4000 repair bill if it goes south on you after the warranty is over.

Good luck.

 

[SilverTR_D18]

I’ll echo most of the above as far as great stability for a large (midsize?) suv. My gripe may or may not have to do with the kdss but the turning radius is not great. Not a huge complaint but for those with tight parking quarters or for those that actually get off-road, I would question whether the non KDSS could navigate tighter turns (meaning very low) speeds.

 

[BlueEyedDevil]

I just got a 2020 TRDP. I traded in a 2013 Trail with KDSS.

I find that the Pro is a little softer in cornering, where the Trail with KDSS had a little less lean.

I did have a 2/1 Toytec leveling kit on the Trail and have no idea if that helped keep it tighter on corners, so there’s that.

 

[kyle13]

I have KDSS on mine and recently got the opportunity to take a non KDSS version for a couple days. Night and day difference, I’d never drive a 4runner without it again.

Body roll was awful on the non KDSS version in corners, on the freeway it was like driving on rolling waves, very springy feeling.

Now, that being said, KDSS does have some cons too, it makes the ride stiffer, and “limit” you when it comes to lifts/skid plates etc (need to buy compatible ones) but not dramatically.


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