Why doesn't any shop want to do undercoatings?

[shahsmerdis]

Hi there,

I called about 20 body shops today and only 1 said they would do undercoating of cars. I will probably have to go with them, but why the heck does no one want to do undercoating? I even called up manufacture they told me to call their distributors to get a hold of someone that does it. There is a huge disconnect here...

it is so darn simple. Yes people are going to say do it yourself, if its that simple, why doesn't anyone want to do it? Not the point of this thread. Doing it on a lift is 100 times easier and better results. Do non enthusiast just drive till their frame rots and get another one? I thought this would be fairly common trade to have more demand for...

I might amazon the sample kit of POR 15 this weekend, and put my car on a ramp and see how it goes..... Probably over thinking this.

Thanks.

 

[RedSled]

Hi there,

I called about 20 body shops today and only 1 said they would do undercoating of cars. I will probably have to go with them, but why the heck does no one want to do undercoating? I even called up manufacture they told me to call their distributors to get a hold of someone that does it. There is a huge disconnect here...

it is so darn simple. Yes people are going to say do it yourself, if its that simple, why doesn't anyone want to do it? Not the point of this thread. Doing it on a lift is 100 times easier and better results. Do non enthusiast just drive till their frame rots and get another one? I thought this would be fairly common trade to have more demand for...

I might amazon the sample kit of POR 15 this weekend, and put my car on a ramp and see how it goes..... Probably over thinking this.

Thanks.

They probably do not want to be responsible when the rust comes back, from the inside out. Just a guess on my part.

 

[MyHigh]

They probably do not want to be responsible when the rust comes back, from the inside out. Just a guess on my part.

I would have to agree with this, I'm sure they have no problem doing it new off the lot but later on in years there is just too much that can and will go wrong

 

[wadle5]

They probably do not want to be responsible when the rust comes back, from the inside out. Just a guess on my part.

I would have to agree with this, I'm sure they have no problem doing it new off the lot but later on in years there is just too much that can and will go wrong

It's exactly this. WE would do new cars before delivering to customers, but any used or slightly used new car we would not undercoat, as their naturally would already be some rust build up. If it makes you feel better the undercoating the dealerships use isn't the best anyways just the quickest to apply. . .and it's usually done by some 15 year old kid that doesn't care about your brand new 50k truck.

Take a weekend and prep everything and than take your time for application. This way you can assess and hit the more troubled spots. I can tell you dealerships aren't going to care on someone elses vehicle and they will try to get as many in a day done.

 

[shahsmerdis]

It's exactly this. WE would do new cars before delivering to customers, but any used or slightly used new car we would not undercoat, as their naturally would already be some rust build up. If it makes you feel better the undercoating the dealerships use isn't the best anyways just the quickest to apply. . .and it's usually done by some 15 year old kid that doesn't care about your brand new 50k truck.

Take a weekend and prep everything and than take your time for application. This way you can assess and hit the more troubled spots. I can tell you dealerships aren't going to care on someone elses vehicle and they will try to get as many in a day done.

Yep! That is why i havent even called a dealer lol.

I might have to fluid film the car to get through the winter. I will be even less inclined to do this if its below 50 outside.

If i was going to get it done at the dealer, I'd just degrease, basic scrub, and fluid film before paying the dealer...

 

[R242]

I prefer fluid film, penetrating and won't trap water, salt, etc. Just did my underside yesterday prepping for a rough winter.

 

[shahsmerdis]

I prefer fluid film, penetrating and won't trap water, salt, etc. Just did my underside yesterday prepping for a rough winter.

Yeah, I like the concept. I just want to knock out all the rust first before doing it. Add a hard shell of protection, or rust converter, then FF the crap out of what ever is left.

 

[Ol'Blue]

If a customer called and asked for that I would tell them nope! The work it takes and the big pain in the ass is not worth it. If they really wanted to have it done it would be AT LEAST 120.00 per hour and NO WARRANTY on work at all.

Blue

 

[OffRoadGuy]

Kinda hard to bring a vehicle lift in a paint booth.

 

[OffRoadGuy]

Suggest you get a quote from X-liner or Rhino liner Rep. They'll take it on $$$

 

[shahsmerdis]

its all about having the right products.


I think with the with plan i have I might be able to tackle it. I found someone who who be able to help me. lets just hope its not too cold when i try to do it!

 

[MSRP.]

POR15 is a good kit, but it's labor intensive in the prep--which is ultimately the big key to long term effectiveness.

You have to degrease, wash, use their metal prep (and reapply until no bubbling), rewash, before applying the actual rust converter coat(s).

Best in the business, but for it to do it's job, the legwork is required.

 

[cashmoney]

Not to mention the cost of POR15. Stuff is not cheap.

 

[shahsmerdis]

Not to mention the cost of POR15. Stuff is not cheap.

POR15 is a good kit, but it's labor intensive in the prep--which is ultimately the big key to long term effectiveness.

You have to degrease, wash, use their metal prep (and reapply until no bubbling), rewash, before applying the actual rust converter coat(s).

Best in the business, but for it to do it's job, the legwork is required.

I'm putting the car on a ramp this weekend, the ramp is around a foot high, so that should be plenty of clearance...going to wire wheel brush as much I can see.

Found a shop that will apply the undercoating for 200 bucks. (including the prep work)

I spoke to SEM tech support last week, they seem to have a great new product called Rust trap

Rust Trap? Products | SEM Products

Seems like its very similar to POR15 except its a moisture cure product, based on their description it seems like sensitive to prep like POR 15. Seems a heck a lot more expensive too. 25 dollars per pint! It seems like the product came out last month. I know POR15 is popular here, I just here alot of people apply the stuff, and have it peel. I Know its probably wrong prep, but SEM sells quality stuff too. How bad can it be?

guys there seem very nice and spent the time talking to me. I'll be the guinea pig here and try out their new product, and do a write up to see how it lasts...

Ill degrease the area. I'm thinking of applying rust converter where ever I can while I am there and have the shop apply the rust trap (ill decide when I get under the car how involved I want to get). it supposedly has 8-24 hour cure time, and will be rock hard once dried.

once its cured Ill fluid film the crap out of the rust of the car....

 

[MSRP.]

I'm putting the car on a ramp this weekend, the ramp is around a foot high, so that should be plenty of clearance...going to wire wheel brush as much I can see.

Found a shop that will apply the undercoating for 200 bucks. (including the prep work)

I spoke to SEM tech support last week, they seem to have a great new product called Rust trap

Rust Trap? Products | SEM Products

Seems like its very similar to POR15 except its a moisture cure product, based on their description it seems like sensitive to prep like POR 15. Seems a heck a lot more expensive too. 25 dollars per pint! It seems like the product came out last month. I know POR15 is popular here, I just here alot of people apply the stuff, and have it peel. I Know its probably wrong prep, but SEM sells quality stuff too. How bad can it be?

guys there seem very nice and spent the time talking to me. I'll be the guinea pig here and try out their new product, and do a write up to see how it lasts...

Ill degrease the area. I'm thinking of applying rust converter where ever I can while I am there and have the shop apply the rust trap (ill decide when I get under the car how involved I want to get). it supposedly has 8-24 hour cure time, and will be rock hard once dried.

once its cured Ill fluid film the crap out of the rust of the car....

If you have an airtool, there's a synthetic wheel that will strip the surface rust without gouging the metal. Would make quick work and more comprehensive clean for long term.

All depends on how much time you have I suppose. PREP is always the key to LT durability.

 

[shahsmerdis]

If you have an airtool, there's a synthetic wheel that will strip the surface rust without gouging the metal. Would make quick work and more comprehensive clean for long term.

All depends on how much time you have I suppose. PREP is always the key to LT durability.

no angle grinder, just angle grinder and heavy duty drills. can it go on an angle grinder?

edit i would be getting these

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...rue&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...rue&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_2&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...rue&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_3&smid=AS9TMMX2PSD5N

i think these should make short work of any open areas. just worried about the tighter areas.

anything else ?

 

[BlackWorksInc]

The main issues that come to mind are as follows on a Used/Aged vehicle:

-Preparation is key and the most difficult to accomplish (it'd basically come down to pulling the cab off, stripping it, stripping the frame, ect. to do it right)

-Liability from pre-existing rust and/or rot damage; this would require additional work prior to coating, this would require "vehicle modification" in the form of welding and metal work, which is additional liability and would roll into further preparation.

-Labor time that goes with the above two points and then the final coating

-Cost vs. Profit as calculated from the above two points and the cost a customer is willing to pay.

-Difficulty in maintaining quality while trying to balance affordability due to the reasons above, customers are less likely to do it right and more likely to turn around and claim litigation from a "more affordable" coating job that has neglected proper prep & repair resulting in damage to the vehicle.

~

It's not like it was in the old days where if you busted a mount you could kick some bills to the local welder have them repair a cracked frame. Now it has to be certified, inspected, ect. because of liability issues that are both warranted and overblown. Same reason that say, you bring your 4Runner to the dealer and want us to rebuild the alternator; we have to stand by what Toyota considers the "correct" repair procedure which is a new alternator, not rebuilding it (despite the FSM maybe having a section dedicated to that, they state to replace the entire component.)

 

[MSRP.]

no angle grinder, just angle grinder and heavy duty drills. can it go on an angle grinder?

edit i would be getting these

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...rue&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...rue&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_2&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...rue&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_3&smid=AS9TMMX2PSD5N

i think these should make short work of any open areas. just worried about the tighter areas.

anything else ?

I should preface by saying that each job is unique, but for the light surface rusting, I used something that looked like this:

http://www.amazon.com/Poly-X-Paint-...pebp=1447766451486&perid=03EBHZ69TDA8VG7VDE9J

And it worked magically. First time using it, and it ate paint up like I was media blasting it, leaving a very nice polished fender. Surface rust disappeared quickly too. Check out the related products on that amazon link to see if anything will fit your angle grinder.

 

[ic0517]

I used the change the oil on my 1988 Ford F-150. I moved down to Texas right after college to an apartment, and did it out on the street. So after I got done, I wiped some oil drips off of the pan and thought, hey, its not my street, and wiped used motor oil all over the frame.

Then finally got my own house in 1993, and back to changing oil again, and I noticed there wasn't a lot of rust wherever I managed to get oil on back then.

I wouldn't do this over a concrete driveway. Or just move your 4Runner where a Jeep normally parks, nobody will notice the difference.

 

[shahsmerdis]

I used the change the oil on my 1988 Ford F-150. I moved down to Texas right after college to an apartment, and did it out on the street. So after I got done, I wiped some oil drips off of the pan and thought, hey, its not my street, and wiped used motor oil all over the frame.

Then finally got my own house in 1993, and back to changing oil again, and I noticed there wasn't a lot of rust wherever I managed to get oil on back then.

I wouldn't do this over a concrete driveway. Or just move your 4Runner where a Jeep normally parks, nobody will notice the difference.

LOL jeep Hahah. yeah, my back up plan is fluid film the crap out of the car!

It seems like its getting way too cold to even apply the paint. debating if i want to postpone this or have the shop do it and get it done with.