2014 Engine Toast - Rebuild vs Replace

[DAW89446]

I have been a mechanic for over 45 years and the T4R oil filter location (under skid plate on later models) and plastic housing is one of the worst I have seen. Several reports of Toyota shops not changing the filter on the "free" oil changes due to the skid plate drop, as well as all of the stripped out skid plate bolts.

When I purchased my '18, after my free oil changes expired, I started taking it to my small town, family owned lube shop. They swapped out the original plastic filter housing for a metal one themselves, no charge. He kept a small supply of them due to occasional failure upon tightening.

My '02 Tacoma TRD was always maintained by an auto club approved shop in a small town I used to live in prior to '08. When I moved to my current location, I took the truck to a small Walmart for an oil change. I asked for and paid for a complete service. Months later, after selecting the small, family owned lube shop, the owner came to the waiting room and asked me into the shop. There my truck was rolled back, the skid plate laying on the floor. It was filled with dirty oil with debris along with a box with a new oil filter. He laughingly asked if Walmart had changed my oil. Never took my vehicles to Walmart nor another shop but the family owned shop since.

 

[BTO]

The car care nut weighs in on the oil filter housing:

 

[axel1]

I appreciate everyone's input! Yes, the metal upgrade was because my plastic filter had been damn-near impacted on by the dealer originally and was fairly stripped around the flutes. It was a dumb mistake that I didn't double-check the instructions online to remember swapping the inner filter tube, but at least it had one and wasn't running totally unsupported.

Like people have said though, that may or may not be the issue. Could just be bad luck with a headgasket, could be some other strange failure, who knows. The fact that the coolant level was low when I pulled over also makes me suspicious that that's the "fluid" the dealer saw with their borescope, though there wasn't and still isn't smoke in the exhaust whenever it's started.

I'll be towing the truck to a local shop here in Chicago tomorrow. They've been super good about communicating to me the different engine options, warranties, etc that they can get from the various yards around town and their estimate was reasonable ($9k). TCCN would be awesome but I imagine they're fully booked for a while and I want to get the truck back into driving condition ASAP.

 

[AuSeeker]

I appreciate everyone's input! Yes, the metal upgrade was because my plastic filter had been damn-near impacted on by the dealer originally and was fairly stripped around the flutes. It was a dumb mistake that I didn't double-check the instructions online to remember swapping the inner filter tube, but at least it had one and wasn't running totally unsupported.

Like people have said though, that may or may not be the issue. Could just be bad luck with a headgasket, could be some other strange failure, who knows. The fact that the coolant level was low when I pulled over also makes me suspicious that that's the "fluid" the dealer saw with their borescope, though there wasn't and still isn't smoke in the exhaust whenever it's started.

I'll be towing the truck to a local shop here in Chicago tomorrow. They've been super good about communicating to me the different engine options, warranties, etc that they can get from the various yards around town and their estimate was reasonable ($9k). TCCN would be awesome but I imagine they're fully booked for a while and I want to get the truck back into driving condition ASAP.

Hopefully you will get this new garage to confirm the diagnosis of the engine being shot!!

 

[CutthroatSlam]

I’ve let the mechanic on our loop road in Montana do work on our 4Runners and my K2500 Suburban, but that was mainly due to the fact that I was down south working in Los Angeles and couldn’t get to it. Have let him install transmission the 2014 4Runner and ‘99 K2500 Suburban, because his price was reasonable vs my estimate for the time it would take me to do it. I handle just about everything else.

 

[axel1]

News news news!

The new shop spent the day looking at the engine and running the full gamut of tests. Their findings were:

• coolant pressure test passed, no coolant leakage. Headgasket is OK
• cylinder 1 has 0 compression. Borescope showed one of the intake valves wasn't closing all the way. Opened up the valve cover, and its spring was broken
• cylinder 3 has 130 PSI compression. The shop manager thought this might just be due to washdown and was waiting on the tech to run a wet compression test 160 PSI wet test compression and is probably fine per the shop
• cylinder 5 (thankfully) had 190 PSI of compression and was totally fine

They gave me two options based on this diagnosis:

1. pull and teardown the bank 1 valvetrain and replace all the valve springs, gaskets, seals, etc, button everything back up, and do an oil & coolant fill. Total estimate for parts & labor: $4500
2. a reman engine replacement. 120k miles engine with a 6 month warranty. Parts & labor installed: $9500

I gave them the go-ahead for option #1 since it's less than half a new engine. I'm curious though, what could cause a broken valve spring on a 1GR-FE? I see basically no results on google. I'm thinking it must just be bad luck.

 

[premise]

News news news!

The new shop spent the day looking at the engine and running the full gamut of tests. Their findings were:

• coolant pressure test passed, no coolant leakage. Headgasket is OK
• cylinder 1 has 0 compression. Borescope showed one of the intake valves wasn't closing all the way. Opened up the valve cover, and its spring was broken
• cylinder 3 has 130 PSI compression. The shop manager thought this might just be due to washdown and was waiting on the tech to run a wet compression test 160 PSI wet test compression and is probably fine per the shop
• cylinder 5 (thankfully) had 190 PSI of compression and was totally fine

They gave me two options based on this diagnosis:

1. pull and teardown the bank 1 valvetrain and replace all the valve springs, gaskets, seals, etc, button everything back up, and do an oil & coolant fill. Total estimate for parts & labor: $4500
2. a reman engine replacement. 120k miles engine with a 6 month warranty. Parts & labor installed: $9500

I gave them the go-ahead for option #1 since it's less than half a new engine. I'm curious though, what could cause a broken valve spring on a 1GR-FE? I see basically no results on google. I'm thinking it must just be bad luck.

Springs are stressed components and are designed for "infinite life." But this is only under ideal conditions like perfect steel, etc. Any small piece of junk in the steel, nick, or other defect will create a stress concentration which can result in a fatigue failure. Examine the failed spring for evidence of fatigue failure.

 

[BTO]

Broken valve spring? That's totally out of left field. I guess it could have been a defect. Do you often redline the engine?

 

[axel1]

Broken valve spring? That's totally out of left field. I guess it could have been a defect. Do you often redline the engine?

I thought it was really weird too. I don’t think I’ve ever taken this engine to redline.

 

[02SE]

Valve springs eventually fatigue and lose some of the pressure they could originally produce. There are service limits for springs, which determine when they should be replaced. Sometimes rather than just becoming weak, they can break.

160k miles is decent service life. But most Toyota valve springs will usually last longer.

Who knows how the vehicle was used for it's first 60k. Maybe the original owner drove it hard.

At any rate get it fixed and move on. I wouldn't lose sleep over it.

 

[axel1]

Okay, another update.

Shop called me this morning and said they started tearing things down more and found significant wall scoring in cylinder 1. Because of this, the engine is beyond economical repair.

I opted to go with their replacement engine suggestion - 120k miles with a 6 month warranty which seems more than fair. Total estimated cost to install: $9k.

 

[AuSeeker]

Okay, another update.

Shop called me this morning and said they started tearing things down more and found significant wall scoring in cylinder 1. Because of this, the engine is beyond economical repair.

I opted to go with their replacement engine suggestion - 120k miles with a 6 month warranty which seems more than fair. Total estimated cost to install: $9k.

Not saying you can't trust this shop...but if you can't go there and see the damage personally, ask for at least some photos or even better a video of the cylinder damage, just good a idea for now and in the future any time you're getting work done and you can't personally see the damage.

 

[axel1]

Not saying you can't trust this shop...but if you can't go there and see the damage personally, ask for at least some photos or even better a video of the cylinder damage, just good a idea for now and in the future any time you're getting work done and you can't personally see the damage.

If this was the first shop to give me the diagnosis I'd be more skeptical, but they're the fourth place at this point to come to the same conclusion. The owner seems super upfront about everything and he apologized for giving me false hope last week.

 

[Pryme]

How’s the new engine going?