3rd Gen Alignment Qs with aftermarket UCA and 33s

[UnderFire]

I owe you one- exactly the info I needed. I think, to your point, alignment techs are seeing the computer show "all green", but it kinda goes all out of the window when suspension geometry is not OEM. Thank you sir.

No problem.

There is a lesson to be learned by all participants in this thread. It is important to take a step back and learn how the suspension functions completely before delving into aftermarket geometry and adjustable suspensions.

You can waste quite literally thousands of dollars chasing your tail if you don't take the time to learn and understand the functions of the OEM suspension components and exactly what these aftermarket parts are modifying. This goes for anything from the most simple drop-in mod like a set of lift shocks way up to the dampening adjustable coilovers, long travel kits, solid axle swaps etc.

No matter how much money you spend on it, improper setup will lead to poor results. Being a modified vehicle, it's on you to know what you need and you cannot expect anyone else to be as well versed as you should be.

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[Pj Benn]

Yes, exactly what I suspected. Your cams are basically the exact opposite of where they should be. The front cams being all the way out pushed the tire back towards the fender and the rear cams being relatively neutral doesn't help that matter either. Have it realigned the other way and your problem should be cured. If you wanted, you could also adjust the cams yourself, pushing the rears all the way out and the fronts to slightly inward and have a shop do a toe set for you without adjusting the cams.

The numbers may not look right on the machine but you've got aftermarket geometry so it doesn't matter. Just watch out for camber in excess of about 1 degree and you're golden.
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Forgive me for the dumb question but is it just because of his after market uca that are changing his geometry to where it may not be the best to have alignment all green? I have a similar height lift but on stock uca and notice some weird feeling stuff after getting alignment. Wondering if I should take it back and get alignment that’s better for geometry than what the computer is telling the tech

 

[Dieselchessy]

good to know. thank you.

i have seen threads in the past with people bashing on the OEM LBJ design, although they provide zero proof why the design is a 'bad' design. i think they're just angry toyota didnt design it the way they wanted it to be designed.

The design is bad because the ball is being ripped out of the pocket rather than pushed into the pocket.
The orientation of the ball joint used on these trucks would only be used on vehicles where the strut mounts to the knuckle.
On vehicles where the strut mounts to the lower A-arm the ball joint is flipped and the A-arm interfaces the knuckle from above.

Force pushes up on the tire and knuckle. This in turn pulls up on the lower ball joint and A-arm. The strut pushes down on the A-arm counteracting the up force.

Proper orientation of the ball joint would have the knuckle be below the A-arm and be pushing the ball joint up into the A-arm.

This design flaw gets explained in pretty well all of these threads. Not sure how you could have missed it.

 

[mesooohoppy]

The design is bad because the ball is being ripped out of the pocket rather than pushed into the pocket.

under static load the ball is pushing into the 'pocket'. i guess i fail to see what you are saying here?

 

[Hopeless Diamond]

under static load the ball is pushing into the 'pocket'. i guess i fail to see what you are saying here?

Nope, the lower control arm with the ball joint sits below the knuckle. The LCA is being pushed down by the spring and the knuckle is being held up by the tire on the ground. The ball joint is in tension, not compression.

 

[Dieselchessy]

 

[UnderFire]

Forgive me for the dumb question but is it just because of his after market uca that are changing his geometry to where it may not be the best to have alignment all green? I have a similar height lift but on stock uca and notice some weird feeling stuff after getting alignment. Wondering if I should take it back and get alignment that’s better for geometry than what the computer is telling the tech

Not necessarily, even a change in ride height and tire size will change where the alignment should be set. Define your weird feeling stuff, once you lift your truck (even a moderate amount, say 2") your alignment specs should change to a point where you can feel it.

But even at 3" the truck can still drive very well if aligned properly, with the one sacrifice being the steering will feel different. If aligned properly the steering should not follow divots in the road, it should drive straight down the road without any input from you and should not have in excess of about 1 degree of camber.

The thing you'll notice that should change is the steering should feel much tighter and have a strong tendency to return to center, even fighting you as you make tight corners to an extent. This is what the aftermarket UCA's really cure, and once you have a proper alignment and UCAs set up to correct the caster you shouldn't be able to tell the difference between a stock truck and a truck with 3" of lift.

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[mesooohoppy]

Nope, the lower control arm with the ball joint sits below the knuckle. The LCA is being pushed down by the spring and the knuckle is being held up by the tire on the ground. The ball joint is in tension, not compression.

very helpful picture

thank you both, the picture really helps clear it up for me!