4Runner vs FJ Cruiser

[teotwaki]

FJ ground clearance is more due to it's 32" tires while 4runners make due with 31" tires.

A few advantages of FJ over 4runner:
1. Underbody clearance is slightly better...the fuel tank is shaped to improve breakover angle...to tell you the truth, the wheelbase on the FJ is not all that short to really compromise it's fore-aft balance (as seen in Jeep Wrangler SWB)
2. Departure and approach angles are slightly better...remember, the spare tire is on the rear door, not underneath...thus, departure angle is significantly better
3. Suspension has significantly more travel due to thinner anti-roll bars and possibly other minor changes
4. Rear locker (optional)
5. Much more aggressive ATRAC (optional)
6. ATRAC + rear locker synchronization (very cool!)
7. Bigger tires (32")
8. More aftermarket support
9. Frame pre-drilled for rock sliders

That is all i can think of right now....

I would buy the 4runner because you can always mod it to compensate for the above. The FJ canNOT be modded to make it more practical.

1. Interesting and a good point but when I see "slightly" with no real numbers then I have to discount a perceived advantage. Besides, the 4Runner has 4 gallons more gas so you do have to look at the entire argument, not just picking out pieces. I thought the FJ's wheelbase was a whole 3" shorter?
2. Tire is easily strapped to the roof of the 4Runner but when sticking to the "stock" rules...... agreed
3. "Significantly" = how may inches or fractions of an inch???
4. Agreed that it is a painless mod, probably cheaper than me adding an ARB
5. Subjective but would believe it to be true just knowing how good my ATRAC is
6. Huh? When you have an ARB locked ATRAC is effectively washed out to only the front wheels. Why is Toyota's e-locker any different/better?
7. Advantage to FJ in stock form
8. Finally changed: rear tire carriers, suspension, front and rear bumpers, sliders (not considering useless aftermarket fluff)
9. Wash. I have bolt on sliders. At least 3 companies make them now.


Again, I am not simply defending the 4Runner. I do see the FJ's advantages but they do not sway me away from my path. I just completed a multi-day Death Valley trip, totally self contained with an additional 20 gallons of gas on the roof and everything else inside. The FJ in the group was pulling a trailer to be able to carry enough expedition supplies.

After actually driving an FJ I felt as if I was driving a 4Runner that had a different body (fat/short) and wheelbase.

 

[Thai]

Jim, i am confused...are you comparing YOUR 4runner with FJ Cruiser OR are we comparing stock vs. stock??

1. This is from Toyota's literature, not me. Since Toyota went to the extreme to reshape the gas tank, i would assume that it was for a good reason. Why would they do it otherwise (and advertise about it too)??

3. I don't know the exact inches of travel...but i do know that RTI (a more practical measure of wheel travel) of the FJ is around 490-500. 4runner is around 420. This is stock vs. stock. I would call this "significant." Every little bit helps while off-roading, esp. if you don't have lockers (stock vs. stock).

5. I can assure you that the OPTIONAL ATRAC on the FJ is a lot MORE aggressive than 4runner's system. I have off-roaded with both on several occasions. There is a reason why FJ's ATRAC is only for use in LOW range...because it's too aggressive for street use. I am not talking about TRAC that comes on every FJ...i am talking about the optional ATRAC.

6. Aren't we talking about stock vs. stock?? Therefore, FJ's synchronization is yet another advantage while off-roading, is it not??

7. Again, i am not comparing specific items here. Are you telling me that 4runner's aftermarket support is EQUAL to the FJ's??? Yes, 4runner does have aftermarket support, but it's nowhere near the variety that FJ has. FJ support is probably on-par with Jeep's. It's no contest IMHO.

8. Although your sliders are bolt-on, it's nice that FJ's frame came pre-drilled with holes from factory because that means that Toyota engineers have determined what spots are the best for attachment from a stress point of view. It's probably not a big deal, but for an anal person like myself, it's kinda gives me a peace of mind.

I agree with your last paragraph.

 

[teotwaki]

Jim, i am confused...are you comparing YOUR 4runner with FJ Cruiser OR are we comparing stock vs. stock??

1. This is from Toyota's literature, not me. Since Toyota went to the extreme to reshape the gas tank, i would assume that it was for a good reason. Why would they do it otherwise (and advertise about it too)??

3. I don't know the exact inches of travel...but i do know that RTI (a more practical measure of wheel travel) of the FJ is around 490-500. 4runner is around 420. This is stock vs. stock. I would call this "significant." Every little bit helps while off-roading, esp. if you don't have lockers (stock vs. stock).

5. I can assure you that the OPTIONAL ATRAC on the FJ is a lot MORE aggressive than 4runner's system. I have off-roaded with both on several occasions. There is a reason why FJ's ATRAC is only for use in LOW range...because it's too aggressive for street use. I am not talking about TRAC that comes on every FJ...i am talking about the optional ATRAC.

6. Aren't we talking about stock vs. stock?? Therefore, FJ's synchronization is yet another advantage while off-roading, is it not??

7. Again, i am not comparing specific items here. Are you telling me that 4runner's aftermarket support is EQUAL to the FJ's??? Yes, 4runner does have aftermarket support, but it's nowhere near the variety that FJ has. FJ support is probably on-par with Jeep's. It's no contest IMHO.

8. Although your sliders are bolt-on, it's nice that FJ's frame came pre-drilled with holes from factory because that means that Toyota engineers have determined what spots are the best for attachment from a stress point of view. It's probably not a big deal, but for an anal person like myself, it's kinda gives me a peace of mind.

I agree with your last paragraph.

Okay and in the name of fun (which this is!) here are replies

In general, I am trying to stick to stock vs. stock unless that is so anal as to ignore the obvious

1. If Toyota literature has an exact spec that is one thing but we all know it is also a sales document.

3. C'mon, a 96 Kia Sportage has an RTI of 471 and it is better than a 4th Gen 4runner too?? If you want to say the FJ has "more travel" than stick to that and give me numbers but switching to RTI mid-argument doesn't work.

5. a 4WD 4Runner comes with ATRAC whether you want it or not. Are you saying that a 4WD FJC can be ordered without ATRAC because it is "optional"? Are you talking about old 4RUnners or 4TH gens as I think that FJC and 4th Gens ATRACs are the exact same.

6. Look, if any locker is engaged then ATRAC will sense no wheel speed difference and be effectively shut off on that axle. That is not an advantage, that is just the reality of the combination.

7. I never said on par, but I did say that the 4th Gen 4runner has many choices now of quality parts. The FJ does have more, but a lot of those are dubious such as the aftermarket Johnny Joint front links that fall off. Besides, almost all FJC skids, suspension and so on all fit the 4Runner. Body specific items such as bumpers and roof racks will not but their are very good ones for just the 4Runner anyhow.

8. If you really wanted peace of mind you would weld on the sliders. An FJC has bolt on sliders factory engineered to bolt on. A 4th Gen can also have sliders engineered to bolt on. So Toyota engineers are better at all things. Tell that to folks whose engine bay sheetmetal is ripping...


Gotta run to work! Type to you later...

 

[Thai]

Jim,

You call the game...i only follow the rules.:

1. Then, can you explain to me why Toyota went great length to document the fact that they redesigned the gas tank?? Why did they do that when they could have just stuck to original 4runner tank?? Is it to improve breakover angle...or more like, to justify the bloated breakover angle of 28 degrees?? BTW, your 4runner does NOT have 28 degree breakover. I am not sure if the FJ has it either, but at least, Toyota is doing something to get to that number realistically.

3. Ok, i am confused here. RTI is a measure of the overall vehicle's suspension travel and frame flex, right?? And both the FJ and 4runner frames are more or less equivalent...thus, RTI scores between the two vehicle reflect suspension travel, right?? So, if a rig has more wheel travel, then it usually has better RTI, right?? I can dig up FJ brochure to see if i can get some "wheel travel inches" for you later when i get home.

5. I am talking 4th gen 4runner vs. FJ. You better look again...ATRAC is a common nomenclature...it does not mean that ATRAC on 4runner is same as ATRAC on FJ. FJ has TRAC from factory. ATRAC is an OFF-ROAD option on the FJ. And from two off-road trips where i had the chance to compare the two system, it's not even close. ATRAC on the FJ is super aggressive...stopping a tire spinning quickly. ATRAC on 4runner allowed a lot more wheelspin. Remember, this is why ATRAC on FJ can ONLY be activated in LOW range. It is an off-road tool. It is calibrated much more aggressively than 4runner's system. YOUR ATRAC system works more like an all-season all-terrain system.

6. Previously, Toyota shut off ATRAC when the rear locker is engaged. The fact that FJ has a rear locker gives it an advantage. Agree? In the past, some have criticize the FJ because once you lock the rear, you lose traction up front (due to ATRAC shutting off)...thus, some have argued that the rear locker's advantage is small. So, now, the newer FJ comes from factory with ATRAC and rear locker synch...thus, making the advantage gap that much more.

7. And this is exactly what i meant. I never said the 4runner had no aftermarket support. I just said that the FJ had more choices...thus, my original statement about AFTERMARKET SUPPORT advantage of the FJ.

8. Good point. As more people take the 4runner off-road, i wonder if it's only time before we see this?? The body rip on the FJ is seemingly due to stress from off-roading. And there are a lot more people off-roading in the FJ than 4runner. The question is...what did toyota do differently in the FJ/Prado than in the 4runner??

Talk to you later.

 

[RonMAIDEN]

Also in the next two years the gap will be bigger since the FJ will always be a solid vehicel for off roading while the next gen Runner will be closer to a larger Highlander and this argument will be a moot point.

 

[JB.]

Daily driver with impressive off-road capability and good cargo space = 4runner.
Recreationl obstacle crawler = FJ.

When considering stock vs stock, I don't think tires should apply except for what is the largest that can be fitted stock.

I suppose my particular usage is fairly uncommon, but I sleep in the 4runner all the time. That right there completely eliminates the FJ for me. The type of off-roading I do is destinational not recreational obstacle hunting. For the latter you'd want every advantage the FJ offers. Now, being able to sleep in the back is of limited value if you can't go anywhere. As a benchmark for those familiar, my 4Runner can do everything in Death Valley in its usual condition in nearly stock form. DV is certainly not known for its obstacles, but there are a fair number of gnarly spots to be negotiated just to be able to get around and getting around - in spacious comfort - is what I want to do. So in Death Valley, to pick a typical example, an FJs capability is mostly overkill while the offsetting space and comfort compromizes are with you constantly. It's just one example - and Jim has already pointed it out - but I think it adds a little clarity to the discussion.

Consumer Reports describes a large difference in road handling between the two so one way to break this down would be to ask: Where do the lines of road and off-road suitability converge - vs FJ - if you modify a 4runner? I tend to think the 4runner wins, but it does start out with a disadvantage in that the body overhangs serve no on-road purpose.

 

[Thai]

Daily driver with impressive off-road capability and good cargo space = 4runner.
Recreationl obstacle crawler = FJ.

JB, i think that Jim and I are on the same page as you on this one. The 4runner is simply more practical.

 

[GatorGreg]

The FJ is a great vehicle and I love the looks but the two major gripes I have about it are:

1) lack of moonroof - I can't understand why they didn't make this at least an option. To me this is unforgiveable for a vehicle intended to be driven off-road enjoying nature, etc. I checked with a local sunroof installer and they said they couldn't even put in an aftermarket one cuz of the weird shaped roof.

2) the back seat is claustrophobic in size and the rear passenger windows don't open - no way GG Jr. would be happy back there.

Now if I was a single guy with no kids I think I'd seriously consider the convertible version

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/showthread.php?threadid=29688

 

[Thai]

1) lack of moonroof - I can't understand why the didn't make this at least an option. I checked with a local sunroof installer and they said they couldn't even put in an aftermarket one cuz of the weird shaped roof.

I think that you asked and answered your own question there.

 

[GatorGreg]

I think that you asked and answered your own question there.

Yes, but I don't undertand why they felt the need to shape the surface of the roof the way they did, it's got big giant ridges in it for no apparent reason. All it does is prevent you from adding a freaking sunroof

 

[chip4]

. 2 out of 2 Labrador Retrievers prefer my FJ over my 4Runner.

My lab loves the runner -thinks he's flying

 

[elemint]

The concept Fj that I saw at the auto show was the coolest vehicle I had ever seen and I was very excited when I heard it was going into production. However the deal breakers for me are, 1) Rear window does go down. 2) The rear tire mount blocking the window. 3) Loss of the 5" in length. If they made the FJ Longer with a flat floor and power rear window I would get one tomorrow. But without these utilitarian features it is more of a coffee cruiser that a useful vehicle. I just hope the 2010 T4R Goes the FJ route and NOT the land cruiser a.k.a highlander route.

 

[webshot]

Well Now I can say I've owned both. I traded my long in the tooth 03 V8 4x4 4runner Limited in for a 07 FJ Cruiser. First let me say "I loved my 4runner! It was an incredible vehicle!"

4runner (luxury) vs. FJ (practicality):

 

[steezemcqueen]

if the 4runner came with a manual trans, it would be no contest for me

thats why i drive a 3rd gen.

 

[storm4]

why not have your cake and eat it at the same time?


http://www.autoblog.com/photos/toyota-fj-runner/464441/

 

[storm4]

the more i look at the runner in the above post the more it start growing on me,...

 

[JB.]

I somehow, only now, realized the automatic FJs are part time 4WD (in the sense of a locked center). ...I had just assumed.....

Wow. Score another big hit for 4runner if you like automatics. Being able to drive on or off road in 4WD, high or low, without being center locked is huge. After having the Torsen in the center, I wouldn't live without it.

 

[webshot]

I somehow, only now, realized the automatic FJs are part time 4WD. I had just assumed...

Wow. Score another big hit for 4runner if you like automatics. Being able to drive on or off road in 4WD, high or low, without being center locked is huge. After having the Torsen in the center, I wouldn't live without it.

Huh? You can drive on or off road in 4wd in a AT FJ. You just shift it to 4 hi.

90% of the time you dont need 4wd so having it in 2wd saves fuel big time. Either way, the FJ still has traction control like the 4runner and even better, it has A-Trac and locking rear diff for the hardcore stuff.

http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/minisite/fjbulletin/index.html?section=1.2.1

 

[Falls]

1. A moon roof would be nice as well it would de in a Tacoma DC

2.I really thing the FJ needs to get a 4dr version to broaden the buy's market.

3. As the FJ grows I think there will be more and more options available and you will be able to get a more refined interior.

I used to hate the FJ but would love one as a toy to play with as well as a Tacoma DC 4x4 Sport along with the 4R in my garage . I better build a bigger garage.

 

[Thai]

Huh? You can drive on or off road in 4wd in a AT FJ. You just shift it to 4 hi.

Yes, you can but only in a straight line on dry pavement. It's a part-time system...therefore, it canNOT be used on dry pavement unless you're just going straight. It is the same system that you see on the Tacoma. It is NOT the same system as you see on the 4runner. The manual tranny FJ has a similar system to the 4runner's.