4th Gen Rear Door Window Madness: I need Help

[werminghausen]

Rear Door Window Madness

Its summer again and we have an awful lot of rain and high humidity...


New behavior:

During driving all of a sudden the rear window is going down (no button pressed).
The window can go down all at once but most of the times
the window is lowering 4-6 increments
It starts opening an inch.... then a few seconds later it is lowering another couple of inches, then a few seconds after another 4 inches and so on until the window is entirely open. Once down chances are high that I cannot close the rear window with the button (button not operational)

First I experienced the auto lowering during driving. But it can happen also after the car is parked successfully (with the window back up.... in case I was lucky and managed to close the door before I park... which I will describe later).
When I come back the window is (most possibly) fully open.

The auto opening of the rear window is always accompanied by wild clicking action of all 5 door locks. The clicking is not in a regular frequency but a wild irregular pattern. The clicking can go away after a certain time but it goes on for a long while (I have not figured out what might stop the clicking)

I have experienced this madness since 10 days now and nothing has improved (as it did 2 years ago) or stopped.

After the rear window is down the push button for rear window up is typically not working. The button may work after some minutes again.... or I need to turn the engine off and restart and then the window will be able to close with the button.... then the game is starting again.


I need help!
Either I can solve the issue somehow .... Or I am going mad as well....
Or I am dumping this otherwise great car.

Martin

(only caveat of the Toyota in the North East is the rust- as you know-... but rust I can understand and handle .... now that electrical madness is something else...)

 

[xtremewlr]

My first suspect would be the control module for the rear hatch, which is located ON the rear hatch. It possibly got wet somehow or has corrosion on the circuit board. I'm totally guessing tho.

This is the part I'm talking about - 2003-2009 TOYOTA 4RUNNER Tailgate Liftgate Multiplex Control Module 89222-35010 | eBay

That shows a picture of it and the OEM part #. It is not mine.

 

[gaber6]

If it's not a control module, check your battery. When mine started to go bad, I'd have dash glitches and radio glitches but the car would otherwise run fine.

 

[Bluesky 07]

If it's not a control module, check your battery. When mine started to go bad, I'd have dash glitches and radio glitches but the car would otherwise run fine.

I was coming here to suggest the same. Can't count how many stories of electrical gremlins were resolved with a new battery. It's a bit odd b/c you'd think the symptoms would always be the same but they're not. Maybe the low voltage affects different parts of the various electronics boxes? In any case, definitely check the battery & charging system. Most auto parts stores have a gizmo that does this.

 

[TTucker]

Battery going bad caused this to happen to my '04 4runner.

 

[werminghausen]

Thanks everyone for your suggestions and sharing similar issues.

I'll check the age of the battery....and measure voltage.
If I recall correctly I installed a new battery 2 years ago.
I think my problem is clearly related to high degree of moisture or water.
it is plausible that the tailgate ECU as suggested (2003-2009 Toyota 4Runner Tailgate Liftgate Multiplex Control Module 89222-35010) could be the trouble maker.

Since I was starting the thread the cars has mostly calmed down.
The back door window rolled down a few times since then but the problem faded mostly.

What I have seen on the highway however: The light for the locked differential was starting flickering at higher speeds.
I am not sure what this might be. So far I guessed it is another gremlin.

Has someone seen this flickering as well? It is the diagram for the front and rear axle with the driveshaft that lights up only if the differential lock is engaged. It would light up or not... I have not seen a flicker ever before.

Martin

 

[Bluesky 07]

Thanks everyone for your suggestions and sharing similar issues.

I'll check the age of the battery....and measure voltage.
If I recall correctly I installed a new battery 2 years ago.
I think my problem is clearly related to high degree of moisture or water.
it is plausible that the tailgate ECU as suggested (2003-2009 Toyota 4Runner Tailgate Liftgate Multiplex Control Module 89222-35010) could be the trouble maker.

Since I was starting the thread the cars has mostly calmed down.
The back door window rolled down a few times since then but the problem faded mostly.

What I have seen on the highway however: The light for the locked differential was starting flickering at higher speeds.
I am not sure what this might be. So far I guessed it is another gremlin.

Has someone seen this flickering as well? It is the diagram for the front and rear axle with the driveshaft that lights up only if the differential lock is engaged. It would light up or not... I have not seen a flicker ever before.

Martin

With respect, that doesn't mean it's good. Earlier this year I had to replace a one-year-old Toyota battery that was bad. Alternator issues can ruin the battery or you could have just gotten a "bad apple" when it was replaced. The ideal would be if you have another vehicle with a similar type battery that you could swap in for a few days to see what happens.

 

[werminghausen]

Thanks Bluesky,

i hear what you are saying.

Is it that the battery does not have or keep the proper voltage?
Any good method to 'measure'?
Is measuring the voltage enough?

 

[werminghausen]

Thanks for all your suggestions.

To sum it all up it seems that the main trouble maker could be
in this order?

#1 battery is compromised (Voltage too low/charging problems). Install new battery

#2 Install new Voltage regulator or new alternator

#3 back door ECU module being bad/corroded.

exchange Tailgate Liftgate Multiplex Control Module 89222-35010

Martin

 

[Bluesky 07]

Thanks Bluesky,

i hear what you are saying.

Is it that the battery does not have or keep the proper voltage?
Any good method to 'measure'?
Is measuring the voltage enough?

Most auto parts store have a device that checks the battery and charging system. I think you get a better result than just checking voltage.

 

[werminghausen]

Thanks,

I was measuring voltage today and the reading was 12.5V.

Then starting the engine i could read 14.0V.

I don't know what the autopart stores might be able to do I'll check it out.
This was what I found in the Haynes Toyota manual.

Ah... the battery I have is a AAA, year 2022, one year old... but that possibly does not mean much as people mentioned.

Best, Martin

 

[Jakeepoo3]

Thanks,

I was measuring voltage today and the reading was 12.5V.

Then starting the engine i could read 14.0V.

I don't know what the autopart stores might be able to do I'll check it out.
This was what I found in the Haynes Toyota manual.

Ah... the battery I have is a AAA, year 2022, one year old... but that possibly does not mean much as people mentioned.

Best, Martin

Your battery is perfect and alternator is functioning properly based on those values. So you do have a multimeter? If you have one then test the rear window circuitry in sections to find the issue.

 

[werminghausen]

Your battery is perfect and alternator is functioning properly based on those values. So you do have a multimeter? If you have one then test the rear window circuitry in sections to find the issue.

Thank you Jakeepoo
I have a good multimeter, and I had the rear window door apart, had the Multiplex Control Module 89222-35010 removed, then installed again.

I simply don't know how to test the circuitry and find the issue.
I even don't know what the issue might be.
If you could give me some hints I'd appreciate it very much.

Right now the window stays closed but the door clicking is still active...very annoying... but this does not mean that the window will roll down when I am driving on the highway at 60 mph and rain....

Martin

 

[Jakeepoo3]

Thank you Jakeepoo
I have a good multimeter, and I had the rear window door apart, had the Multiplex Control Module 89222-35010 removed, then installed again.

I simply don't know how to test the circuitry and find the issue.
I even don't know what the issue might be.
If you could give me some hints I'd appreciate it very much.

Right now the window stays closed but the door clicking is still active...very annoying... but this does not mean that the window will roll down when I am driving on the highway at 60 mph and rain....

Martin

Does the rear wiper and defrost work? I believe the module would be good if they do. What year and model is it, I'll look at the schematic if I can find one. Sounds like an easy fix but finding the culprit is the tricky part. That back window is a must have working!

 

[werminghausen]

Thanks, Jakeepoo

I have a crazy clicking 2003 T4R , V8.
I was disconnecting the board in the rear door multiple times and when removed the crazy clicking of the door locks stops. When I reconnect the 2 plugs to the board the clicking starts again.
This means the clicking must have to do with this board?

Best, Martin

 

[mesohuanny]

my rear window only opens when the hatch is open

 

[werminghausen]

Does the rear wiper and defrost work? I believe the module would be good if they do. What year and model is it, I'll look at the schematic if I can find one. Sounds like an easy fix but finding the culprit is the tricky part. That back window is a must have working!

Hi Jakeepoo,

Back Window is a must have working!
Agreed.

I had the board out and looked at it. All electronic parts and solders looked good from the outside.

There are 2 plugs into the board. A smaller plug that is providing power.
A red cable in the smaller plug was pulsing showing some Voltage on and off at all times (ignition was off). What might that be?
Again my car is a 2003 T4R , 8 cylinder.
If you can give me some hints on how to test this board I'l definetely do this.


Any help is welcome.

Thanks, Martin

 

[Jakeepoo3]

Hi Jakeepoo,

Back Window is a must have working!
Agreed.

I had the board out and looked at it. All electronic parts and solders looked good from the outside.

There are 2 plugs into the board. A smaller plug that is providing power.
A red cable in the smaller plug was pulsing showing some Voltage on and off at all times (ignition was off). What might that be?
Again my car is a 2003 T4R , 8 cylinder.
If you can give me some hints on how to test this board I'l definetely do this.


Any help is welcome.

Thanks, Martin

Sounds like you have an issue within the circuit not the board. If you're getting pulsing battery voltage on the red cable. Check the circuit in sections. The boot that contains the wire harness from the body to the rear hatch is a good place to start your check as it gets wear and tear from all the motion. Also rear window hatch up and down relays. A bad relay could allow that pulsing power through. Check the grounds on the circuit. Also a faulty switch, bad contacts. Check from relays to back hatch. The mission is to find where the voltage begins pulsating in the circuit with your multimeter. Maybe try swapping out the relays with another of the same prong layout. I didn't look for a diagram, I'm too lazy, but you can find it yourself. This can all be done and tested with the multimeter and a test light if you have one but it's not necessary.

 

[werminghausen]

No diagram- Lazy Jakeepoo! :boink:

There are 2 boots at the top of the back door.... would you open both and check?

I have a multimeter and a test light, no problem.

Where are the 2 relays for the rear window located?
Faulty switch would be the window switch in the center of the dash?

I'll check all these components if I can find them.

(I have the T4R on the lift at the moment because if a bad brake system failure. Need to change the booster motor and accumulator. My dash lit up like a christmas tree the other day... the "bells" were not very nice as well)

I have no electrical experience but I can look around if I know where and what to search for.

Any hint where to find the el. diagram?

Martin

 

[werminghausen]

I bought the 2003 T4R Electrical Book EWD514U in order to try
understanding the electrical gremlin of my rear door. I have to say I am not an electrical engineer.... but I try my best to understand with my simple mind.

I think I found the red wire that had this weird pulsing (12V) at the smaller connector at the Rear Door ECU

The connector I am talking about is called B8(A) and it is connected to the
ECU. It has 4 wires at Positions 1,6,5,4. 1 is the red wire.
Disconnecting this plug B8(A) from the ECU will stop the clicking of the locks but also it will disable the rear door functions (window, lock etc).

Wires inside the Boot to the rear door are the problem?

Now the problem always get better during dry weather and it is becoming worse during heavy rains in summer....as Jakeepoo mentioned the rubber boot on the upper left side feeding the wires into the rear door might cause the problem as there are 4 wired passing through that are moving with each opening movement of the rear door..and wires might be rubbing against each other and cause a problem when wet. And this place is always wet in rainy weather with the car being parked outside (yes, no garage).

Door Relays
Jakeepoo said I should find the 2 rear door window relays (there might be a problem with them if the rear window is opening on its own....) But I still did not find the relays.
As far as I could understand all window and lock functions- and a lot more are part of the 'Multiplex Communication System'. In the book this is the blue ribbon on the diagram I show. I don't know what this blue ribbon physically is...probably a bunch of ECU that are connected by cables.
So where are the relays for the windows? I don't know. I see some external relays (for defog, horn, head light , stop light and dome light for instance) but not for window motors. Window motors are controlled by P11, P10, P12 ..called Power window control. Does this mean there are no ordinary relays for the windows... probably.

Best, Martin