5th Gen Performance Mods

[bimrunner]

reliable, fast, and cheap. Can be two of those three, but never all three.

It can be cheap and reliable, but not fast.
fast and reliable, but not cheap
and it can be cheap and fast but not reliable.

Pick yer poison.


In my opinion, the best bang for your buck is the regear followed closely by a forced induction system. I guarantee Toyota ecu can handle 5-7psi all day long, but for overland offroading, adding a turbo/supercharger only complicates things further.

Yes. If we had the supercharger there would be more threads about torn up front ends out wheeling... If we had a supercharger, we would want axles and tie rods (perhaps stronger boots). If we had those, we would want a 9.5 diff. Then manual hubs and DC driveshafts. Then we'd want lower crawl ratios... it will never end. It is the life of vehicle "improvements." Lol

 

[Ron4RNevada]

- - don't mod it, leave it stock, add some good tires and just drive it as it was designed.

:drummer:

 

[wfo9]

1. You want fast? Two examples: One is just brute force (Challenger Hellcat) and the other is a drivable slot car (Nissan GTR)

Funny you picked my two least favorite performance cars. I know it is personal preference, but....
1. The overweight brick (the hellcat).
2. The what he hell are these electronics driving this car doing. (GTR)

 

[Jayhawk5G]

When you think of performance mods for the 5th gen. think of suspension and not powertrain and you should come out ok.

 

[Jetboy]

My biggest question is why - if you all know that adding 100hp means 13mpg - don't you just buy a used 200? It's pretty much what you want and used models are the same price as a modified 4runner. With a supercharger it's mid 5's 0-60, and very low mpg (although oddly there is a note on canadian TSBs about improving as much as 3mpg with the supercharger due to the ecm flash). There is no way that you'll get even close to that with a 4runner for the cost of swapping into a land cruiser.

Or for that matter a 3rd gen with a 3.4L has a number of turbo and supercharger options. All of which will smoke a 5th gen in performance - for probably under $8k including the 4runner.

For me the mpg was a very important part of the equation.

 

[bpwwer]

So there you have it: Fast and powerful, tiny and efficient and tough and strong. All of these vehicles are targeted to a specific consumer and are not nearly as compromised as our 4Runner. I just posted these pics as an example of what power, speed, efficiency and tough looks like. None of them look like a 4Runner.

Which is why you need to own a minimum of 7 vehicles. Trying to make 1 or 2 do is just too many compromises.

 

[Chipper78]

Which is why you need to own a minimum of 7 vehicles. Trying to make 1 or 2 do is just too many compromises.

I just can't seem to get my wife on board with this idea.........

 

[bimrunner]

I just can't seem to get my wife on board with this idea.........

See, you have to have a plan. Think through all contingencies and have a long range plan in mind... I'm only at 3 so far but need more... Here is where the stable sits now... I have plans though. It will take me about 5 years to get it all done, but most likely with nearly no complaints from the wife. :hungry:


Figured I'd give a little update as time has gone on: sold the Acura and added these beauties!

 

[bpwwer]

I just can't seem to get my wife on board with this idea.........

My wife had 2 cars before we married and I had 3. Somehow we've manage to keep that same number since then. It helps that she likes cars and driving. We have quite a few categories covered:

4Runner for hauling and off-roading
BMW 335i for cruising
Miata for top down cruising
Miata for track days
'71 Buick for dumping oil on the driveway

I think the only thing that prevents us from buying more cars is lack of space to keep them, and well, time to maintain them.

 

[JeremyB]

The biggest problem with the 4runners performance and ability to improve on it is the locked ECU. The motor itself has some real chops lurking in it (even in NA form). They just made it completely inaccessible, Toyota SOP.

Toyota ECUs have been 'hacked', but not sure why nobody has offered a product. Will try and ask the source when I see him, hopefully in a few weeks.

 

[Chipper78]

See, you have to have a plan. Think through all contingencies and have a long range plan in mind... I'm only at 3 so far but need more... Here is where the stable sits now... I have plans though. It will take me about 5 years to get it all done, but most likely with nearly no complaints from the wife. :hungry:
[/QUOTE

Well, we did just decide that it was time for me to get something a little more reliable than my 96 Bronco, and during that discussion I managed to convince her that I should keep the Bronco as a long term project. So between the new T4R and my Bronco and whatever vehicle I end up with(leaning towards a 4X4 Taco) that'll make three so i guess Im working in that direction as well. She drives fifty miles round trip three days a week for work so I've also planted the seed about getting a little civic or corolla for her to drive back and forth to work, so i kinda have a plan.....

As far as performance mods go, most people put these types of superficial mods on as more of a "status" symbol anyway, serious tuners typically do those mods in conjunction with ECU work as well.

 

[5ontheFloor]

So true. I did a CAI not so much for the performance but I do like the way my truck growls when I plant the gas. There is def truth in driving habits affects mileage. First time I've seen 20MPG in a while and you know how I did it? Easy on the accelerator, shedding extra weight and not driving as aggressively as I want to. Will that stop me from getting my catback system when Im good and ready? NO!

 

[flyrv9]

Probably the cheapest thing you can do to increase mileage is to keep your 4Runner clean and waxed. Reducing parasitic drag on a box on wheels is probably worth at least 1 MPG! Maybe 2!

If you want increased power - then get a different vehicle. Not sure why people mod 4Runners to make them faster - who are you going to beat?

On a 4700 mile road trip last fall I compared mileage between the dash display and actual calculations. At times there was a noticeable difference and times where they were pretty close. So, I suggest you do the math to get more accurate results.

As 1Engineer said - you need real, accurate data under controlled conditions to get dependable, repeatable results. Butt Dynos are cheap though. You may also find that a mod or a change has the opposite result as intended.

I just retired last year from 20 years in a flight test environment. In flight test you have to prove (hard recorded data) the airplane will perform as designed to achieve certification. In order to accomplish this, a number of (data gathering - reporting) devices are used and independently calibrated. Often results are different than expected (one of the reasons for testing) resulting in changes and further testing.

So, you may feel good about some change you made to make things better, faster, etc. when you may have actually spent time and money for meager results. It's your money, so have at it. Remember though, those engineers at Toyota aren't stupid; so before you start changing things, consider the unintended consequences and error on the side of safety.

 

[MasonCO]

I found the best way to get a 10% increase in MPG is to let my wife drive her 4Runner.

It might take 30 minutes longer to get there, she might sit behind the 18-wheeler on the highway for 5 minutes before deciding it is safe to pass, and she might never go over the posted speed limit, but I'll be damned if she doesn't get a lot better MPG than I do.:hug:

 

[Friggin Idiot]

Best way to make your T4R go faster! +50hp!!!!!

 

[Lindenwood]

Has anyone further analyzed the whole timing advance thing? On paper, it doesn't seem unreasonable. But, it also sounds like one of those electronics myths.

I don't care about the power increase and don't really think it would save me any money. It just occurred to me that, for overlanding and general travel, if I could increase my range by 5-10% it would be basically like carrying a 2gal rotopax, but actually in the gas tank!

 

[1engineer]

Has anyone further analyzed the whole timing advance thing? On paper, it doesn't seem unreasonable. But, it also sounds like one of those electronics myths.

I don't care about the power increase and don't really think it would save me any money. It just occurred to me that, for overlanding and general travel, if I could increase my range by 5-10% it would be basically like carrying a 2gal rotopax, but actually in the gas tank!

There is an actual Toyota article out there ( i read it and didn't save it) talking about this subject. It is for a Prado and it talked about 91 versus 87. If i remember correctly timing will change when you run 91 over several thousand miles. The timing change will give you a power increase between 3-10 percent depending on elevation of course. Thing is you must continue to run 91 forever or it changes back. So around $4 additional a tankful or around $200 a year for an average guy.

The problem is someone who would do this will also hang 1K in steel and run oversize tires too. So in the end they still net a loss.

The absolute best performance mod is skinny tires and lose weight.

 

[rochmpr]

There is an actual Toyota article out there ( i read it and didn't save it) talking about this subject. It is for a Prado and it talked about 91 versus 87. If i remember correctly timing will change when you run 91 over several thousand miles. The timing change will give you a power increase between 3-10 percent depending on elevation of course. Thing is you must continue to run 91 forever or it changes back. So around $4 additional a tankful or around $200 a year for an average guy.

The problem is someone who would do this will also hang 1K in steel and run oversize tires too. So in the end they still net a loss.

The absolute best performance mod is skinny tires and lose weight.

Or realize it's not a Prius and a sport car combined. Power and speed is what it is not. Get over it, fill the tank, drive the beast and have fun. I have never been stuck due to lack of power, even with a 22R.

 

[Randyman...]

I beg to differ. My '13 that has run 92-93 octane since the first fill-up at a few hundred miles on the odometer (and now at 120K) seems very peppy to me. Even with BFG AT C-Load stock-sized tires (a few extra lb's each) and a fairly massive stereo including well-braced MDF sub box and HEAVY subs, amps, and lots of sound deadening seems to pull away from other 5th gen's I encounter (but I might just be willing to mash the throttle more than most mere 5th gen mortals?). Spec'd at 7.9sec 0-60, it is not a slouch even by sedan standards. But requires an aggressive throttle (and maybe 92 octane? Is fuel octane spec'd in the published 0-60 specs?) to get there...

Premium fuel for me - ALWAYS!!! It might be a "performance mod" you pay for at every fill-up, but one I wholehearted buy into (and I consider myself an overly objective dude with roots in reality). I also don't mind paying for extra fuel system cleaners/detergents that seem to be integral to the premium grade fuels. A bottle of BG44K runs around $20...

1E - Blast away! :gossip:

 

[Lindenwood]

seems to pull away from other 5th gen's I encounter (but I might just be willing to mash the throttle more than most mere 5th gen mortals?).

I am only slighty surprised to hear of somebody regularly trying to drag race their 4800lb V6 SUV, though I am honestly much more surprised that you also found other people willing to race you in theird . Though, you might have answered your own question with respect to them not likely actually trying.

Spec'd at 7.9sec 0-60, it is not a slouch even by sedan standards.

In my mind, I honestly thought people stopped counting once you got much above 6.0 .

Premium fuel for me - ALWAYS!!! It might be a "performance mod" you pay for at every fill-up, but one I wholehearted buy into (and I consider myself an overly objective dude with roots in reality). I also don't mind paying for extra fuel system cleaners/detergents that seem to be integral to the premium grade fuels. A bottle of BG44K runs around $20...

Well, people waste billions per year on premium fuel when it doesn't do anything at all. Having a pretty decent understanding of ignition timing and knock resistance works, I am still skeptical.

Also, as far as the additives go, I suppose they have to sell it to somebody .

1E, in that article, do you remember if the timing advance was applied across the entire fuel map, or only realized at high throttle openings? I ask because if there is a real 3-10% increase in HP, and if the timing advance occurs at all throttle positions (and hopefully even more at modest throttle positions), then one should see a proportionate increase in fuel economy. As I am sure to know, advancing timing essentially extracts more mechanical energy from a given mixture rather than simply sending more heat out of the exhaust.

Even while gas is cheap (hah! 10 years ago I would have never called $2.25/gal "cheap"), premium is only about 10% more. So, if going with premium would add 10% to one's fuel economy, that is about 40 miles extra per tank, with no overall increase in fuel costs. When OPEC stops acting up and fuel prices jump back into the $3+ range, premium will then only be 5-7% more than regular so, if one gained 7-10% more HP then technically one could theoretically save money on fuel by going with premium.

Of course, this all depends whether our ECU is programmed per that article will actually permanently adjust timing based on real-life feedback, as well as if that adjustment is really as large as even 5%, let alone 10%.