Alignment Tips -- OEM UCA
- Thread starter NinjaOne
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mrpurplepenguin
New member
Looks like they didn't even try to mess with camber or caster, they just set toe for you and gave it back. Did they say they couldn't do any more?
At that lift height with stock UCAs, you won't be able to get much caster at all. Nothing can be adjusted enough to fix it, the solution is to get aftermarket UCAs with a few degrees of caster built in. That will also solve your problem with the coil hitting the UCA.
So...yeah. Drive it and determine if you're okay with the handling (since the toe is good and the camber is okay, you won't be tearing up tires). If you don't like how darty it is now: UCAs.
At that lift height with stock UCAs, you won't be able to get much caster at all. Nothing can be adjusted enough to fix it, the solution is to get aftermarket UCAs with a few degrees of caster built in. That will also solve your problem with the coil hitting the UCA.
So...yeah. Drive it and determine if you're okay with the handling (since the toe is good and the camber is okay, you won't be tearing up tires). If you don't like how darty it is now: UCAs.
NinjaOne
New member
Still a bit of a noob, how do I know if they've been maxed? I'd rather look myself than trust the shop
NinjaOne
New member
Looks like there is still some room for adjustment, right? Maxed would be even with the control arm?
07V8
Member
Looks like there is still some room for adjustment, right? Maxed would be even with the control arm?
Yes. Those don't look touched at all. They also might be seized.
NinjaOne
New member
Anybody use these? Says it provides extra adjustment, true?
https://toyteclifts.3dcartstores.com/25435-Toyota-Cam-Bolt-Kit-_p_752.html
https://toyteclifts.3dcartstores.com/25435-Toyota-Cam-Bolt-Kit-_p_752.html
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Hi. I want to increase the height of my Bilsteins from 1.75 to 2.50 lift with my current stock shocks. Willing to try to do this myself but would feel more comfortable knowing if I can get my caster close to factory specs.
Right now with 1.75 lift caster is 2.0/2.3 which is a little lower than 2.6 min each side.
I don't quite understand how you read the cam bolts to see if I have any adjustment left. I'm not seeing what you are in these pictures.
thanks.
Right now with 1.75 lift caster is 2.0/2.3 which is a little lower than 2.6 min each side.
I don't quite understand how you read the cam bolts to see if I have any adjustment left. I'm not seeing what you are in these pictures.
thanks.
I can only imagine how bad that must drive. I bet you can't let your hands off the wheel for more than a second.
As for adjustment, I doubt you can get much back. Even if you do, it still will be bad. Most techs won't even bother. They kind of have the mindset along the lines that if your arm is broken, it doesn't make sense to straighten some of it if you can't straighten it all the way. It also makes them look bad if you take it somewhere else and someone sees the less than perfect work.
The toe looks good. At least your tires won't wear.
As for adjustment, I doubt you can get much back. Even if you do, it still will be bad. Most techs won't even bother. They kind of have the mindset along the lines that if your arm is broken, it doesn't make sense to straighten some of it if you can't straighten it all the way. It also makes them look bad if you take it somewhere else and someone sees the less than perfect work.
The toe looks good. At least your tires won't wear.
NinjaOne
New member
It drives well overall, drives straight even w/out hands. Biggest concern is the UCA touching the springs on droop and steering locks more easily on quick cornering.
It looks like there is a fair amount of adjustment left, they didn't mention anything about the front ones being frozen. Looking at the printout again, looks like they only adjusted the back to get the toe to spec. May stop by the shop again and complain and see what they do
Anybody have experience with 4x4 Parts? Considering having them doing the alignment since they work more with lifted rigs.
Look at the second picture. Look at the marks on the cam bolt (washer), you can see that from the top center there are marks on either side. Those marks indicate the adjustment range. That, at least, is my still learning understanding of it
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mrpurplepenguin
New member
You can't just look at the front adjusters on the lower control arm, you have to look at the rear ones too...
Moving the LCA in/out (turn both front/rear adjusters the same direction) affects the camber by tilting the wheel vertically.
Pivoting the LCA forward/aft (turn the front/rear adjusters opposite each other) affects the caster by changing the steering axis angle for the wheel (the lower ball joint moves towards the front/rear with respect to the upper ball joint).
You'll have to inspect the rear adjustment cams as well to really see how much adjustment room you still have (if you just mess with the fronts, you'll change both caster and camber simultaneously).
I agree that those bolts look like they haven't been touched, which is validated by the lack of caster/camber difference on your before/after printout. I'd head back to the shop and ask why they didn't even attempt to improve your caster numbers (since those are clearly outside the acceptable level).
Moving the LCA in/out (turn both front/rear adjusters the same direction) affects the camber by tilting the wheel vertically.
Pivoting the LCA forward/aft (turn the front/rear adjusters opposite each other) affects the caster by changing the steering axis angle for the wheel (the lower ball joint moves towards the front/rear with respect to the upper ball joint).
You'll have to inspect the rear adjustment cams as well to really see how much adjustment room you still have (if you just mess with the fronts, you'll change both caster and camber simultaneously).
I agree that those bolts look like they haven't been touched, which is validated by the lack of caster/camber difference on your before/after printout. I'd head back to the shop and ask why they didn't even attempt to improve your caster numbers (since those are clearly outside the acceptable level).
mrpurplepenguin
New member
Those definitely look like they could be seized! However, I don't see any tool marks on there (indicating the technicians never even tried to adjust them).
Go to the shop with your alignment sheet and pictures. Ask why they didn't correct the caster. If they tell you there's no more room to adjust, show them the pictures and point out that there is indeed room to adjust. If they tell you the cams were seized, show them the pictures and ask them to point out where they wrenched on them; those look like they haven't been touched in years. Unless they charged you less for only adjusting the toe, it looks like they've done an incomplete job.
Go to the shop with your alignment sheet and pictures. Ask why they didn't correct the caster. If they tell you there's no more room to adjust, show them the pictures and point out that there is indeed room to adjust. If they tell you the cams were seized, show them the pictures and ask them to point out where they wrenched on them; those look like they haven't been touched in years. Unless they charged you less for only adjusting the toe, it looks like they've done an incomplete job.
NinjaOne
New member
Thanks, I'll do that
So it looks like (in the ideal situation where nothing is seized) I have room for additional adjustment on both front and rear cams, right?
I see two scenarios
1) Tech was lazy and only adjusted toe
2) Cams are seized and tech couldn't adjust them further (and didn't tell me)
Assuming it is seized, what is the dealer likely to recommend as the fix? New LCA? Cut bolt and do new cams?
mrpurplepenguin
New member
Yeah, it looks like you have some wiggle room on both the fronts and the rears; that means your camber/caster numbers could be slightly better, but at your lift height you'll probably still be lacking on caster once the cams are maxed out.
If those bolts are seized, penetrating lube / impact / torch / cut to remove the bolts and replace them with new. You shouldn't need a new LCA unless the bushings get melted from torching out the bolts. Even then, it should be possible to press out the old and press in new bushings.
If those bolts are seized, penetrating lube / impact / torch / cut to remove the bolts and replace them with new. You shouldn't need a new LCA unless the bushings get melted from torching out the bolts. Even then, it should be possible to press out the old and press in new bushings.
NinjaOne
New member
Long as I get additional caster and the UCA clears the springs on both sides (clears on driver side atm), I'll be mostly happy. Eventually I'll replace the UCA, but I don't want to do that as a work around for a poor alignment job.
Can you replace the cams with the shocks still mounted?
mrpurplepenguin
New member
I've never done it before, but I would think yes. I'd try only pulling the cam bolts first and see if you can do it real easy- especially replacing them one at a time, everything else should hold it's position fairly well. At most, you'd have to remove the lower shock mount bolt and the 2x bolts holding on the lower ball joint, but I'd think you could easily leave the shock in the truck during the operation.
