And the FJ is now Dead

[LandCruiser]

Funny! You had an FJ that was "badass", so you traded for an SR5 with Navi and leather? Not even the TE? And now you're disappointed? Test drive?

My TE goes where my FJ did.

It's just more expensive and that nice screeching sound of tree branches clawing their way along the body panels now makes me cringe.

 

[RAD4Runner]

The Proper FJ

It was screwed up from the beginning. IFS, non removable top, horrible visibility, just nothing even close to the original. The Jeep Wrangler has kept its basic features for decades and that's why they can't build them fast enough. Toyota screwed the whole FJ thing up from day 1. It had so much potential...but...

Exactly. Horrible C Pillar.

Never really liked the look of the FJ

I never liked the look of the FJ Cruiser. Period. Too funky and toy-like.

This is the proper FJ.

 

[Jmdwifi]

Funny! You had an FJ that was "badass", so you traded for an SR5 with Navi and leather? Not even the TE? And now you're disappointed? Test drive?

I did test it. Fits the kids and the dog. Mechanically, it's the same. I just like the FJ more. I didn't realize how much more until having this 4runner for a month. I don't hate the 4runner. I should researched more and looked at a TE but it was a perfect storm in conjunction with my ADHD. Never go to the dealer when your in a Prius (rental they gave me) your FJ is in for a seatbelt recall and they don't know when the parts are coming AND you love your kids and dog. Bad combination.
The 4runner is a very nice normal SUV and there are 1 go zillion of them out here on the road.

 

[Snowdogyyz]

I loved my FJ! I miss it. I do love my 4runner and I'm on my way to making it "mine". The only reason I traded it for the 4runner was for child reasons. The rear facing convertible child seat was impossible with the suicide doors on the FJ. The blind spot was no biggie if you know how to use mirrors and you're mindful of what's around you. I know many were upset that it wasn't a modern 40, but I thought it was cool in its own way and very capable off road. It was peppier than my 4Runner- the 4R feels a little sluggish to me. The 4R has more creature comforts though!

 

[Biggcrisp]

I loved my FJ

However, the 4runner is a better vehicle for me. The only thing I didn't like about the FJ was giving it a bath due to all the body pieces. The wife didn't like the half doors. I did prefere the FJ dash. We called it "THE TANK"

 

[Blacksunshyne]

Dude. Seriously?

The FJ40 had between 105 and 135 HP. It was slow. Very, very slow.

Ok, so Yes....Dude seriously :bigok:

The 2F is an inline 6 cylinder, those motors are designed with a long stroke to produce what you want in a truck that is very off road capable...torque at low RPM. It is not designed to be fast, however it is not gutless, as it produces gobs of low end torque, whereas with the SBC (small block chevy) you need a lot more revolutions to produce the desired torque.

 

[LandCruiser]

Ok, so Yes....Dude seriously :bigok:

The 2F is an inline 6 cylinder, those motors are designed with a long stroke to produce what you want in a truck that is very off road capable...torque at low RPM. It is not designed to be fast, however it is not gutless, as it produces gobs of low end torque, whereas with the SBC (small block chevy) you need a lot more revolutions to produce the desired torque.

Lots of torque at very low RPM. Those things redlined at 3800ish.

Inherently balanced engine design meant durability in the long-term.

 

[Canazes9]

Ok, so Yes....Dude seriously :bigok:

The 2F is an inline 6 cylinder, those motors are designed with a long stroke to produce what you want in a truck that is very off road capable...torque at low RPM. It is not designed to be fast, however it is not gutless, as it produces gobs of low end torque, whereas with the SBC (small block chevy) you need a lot more revolutions to produce the desired torque.

I'm a pretty major Toyota fan boy, but I try and keep a grip on reality - you honestly think a 2F will make more torque at any rpm than the Chevy small block V8's Icon is listing?

That's delusional.

Note: I didn't say the 2F was a POS, nor did I say it wasn't well suited for its application.

2F peak torque was ~210 @1800rpms, the Chevy small blocks will be producing well over 280 ft/lbs at that rpm and it's going to climb from there.

Again, 2F, good motor, well suited for its application. Anywhere close in power production to the listed Icon small block's (LM4/LS)?

Nowhere close.

David

 

[Whiplash Willy]

Exactly. Horrible C Pillar.



I never liked the look of the FJ Cruiser. Period. Too funky and toy-like.

This is the proper FJ.

That is SICK! Those have to be my favorite Factory Toyota wheels, atleast we got those wheels in the US...

 

[Blacksunshyne]

I'm a pretty major Toyota fan boy, but I try and keep a grip on reality - you honestly think a 2F will make more torque at any rpm than the Chevy small block V8's Icon is listing?

That's delusional.

Note: I didn't say the 2F was a POS, nor did I say it wasn't well suited for its application.

2F peak torque was ~210 @1800rpms, the Chevy small blocks will be producing well over 280 ft/lbs at that rpm and it's going to climb from there.

Again, 2F, good motor, well suited for its application. Anywhere close in power production to the listed Icon small block's (LM4/LS)?

Nowhere close.

David

I don't see where I made the statement that the Toyota 2F makes more torque at any RPM than a Chevy V8 motor from any series...perhaps you can point it out?

I said that the 2F is not a gutless motor as it produces very useable low end torque at a low RPM and that the original Toyota 2F motor is pretty much the "soul" ,for lack of a better word, that made the FJ40's what they are. I have owned and wheeled 40's with both motors in them and prefer the smooth delivery of torque from off idle to around 1800 RPM +/- the inline 6 produces, nothing delusional there, just an opinion based of prior experiences.

 

[Canazes9]

I don't see where I made the statement that the Toyota 2F makes more torque at any RPM than a Chevy V8 motor from any series...perhaps you can point it out?

I said that the 2F is not a gutless motor as it produces very useable low end torque at a low RPM and that the original Toyota 2F motor is pretty much the "soul" ,for lack of a better word, that made the FJ40's what they are. I have owned and wheeled 40's with both motors in them and prefer the smooth delivery of torque from off idle to around 1800 RPM +/- the inline 6 produces, nothing delusional there, just an opinion based of prior experiences.

Sure, no problem:

Ok, so Yes....Dude seriously :bigok:

The 2F is an inline 6 cylinder, those motors are designed with a long stroke to produce what you want in a truck that is very off road capable...torque at low RPM. It is not designed to be fast, however it is not gutless, as it produces gobs of low end torque, whereas with the SBC (small block chevy) you need a lot more revolutions to produce the desired torque.

You are implying that the Chevy small block may make a lot more horsepower, it doesn't make more torque where it counts - down low. The "the more you know" mime kinda hammers the point. That's incorrect. The modern Chevy small block completely outclasses the 2F in every way imaginable. As well it should - it's a much more modern design and much more expensive.

Back to [MENTION=6872]M1911[/MENTION] 's point, the Chevy small blocks in the Icon FJ's are superior in every way to the original 2F's. They are more reliable, get better gas mileage, longer anticipated service life and make more low end torque where it counts off-road and high end hp for the road than the 2F motor. In comparison, the 2F is gutless.

Doesn't mean the 2F sucks, but it is a motor lost in time and only a hopeless romantic would prefer it over numerous modern choices - Chevy small block is tops on the list. I love Toyota, hate GM (goberment motors), but props are due on the modern Chevy small block crate motors...

David

 

[M1911]

I said that the 2F is not a gutless motor as it produces very useable low end torque at a low RPM and that the original Toyota 2F motor is pretty much the "soul" ,for lack of a better word, that made the FJ40's what they are. I have owned and wheeled 40's with both motors in them and prefer the smooth delivery of torque from off idle to around 1800 RPM +/- the inline 6 produces, nothing delusional there, just an opinion based of prior experiences.

The LM4 used by Icon produces 350 ft-lbs of torque. The LM4 is a long-stroke truck engine, and it has a very, very flat torque curve. It produces a very smooth delivery of torque right from idle.

The 2F produces on 200 ft-lbs of torque. The LM4 produces more torque than the 2F at every RPM.

While I have a fondness for inline six cylinder engines, engine technology has improved dramatically in the last 50 years. The LM4 is far more reliable, requires much less maintenance, produces far more torque and horsepower, and is more fuel efficient than the 2F.

As Canazes9 says, the only thing the 2F has that the LM4 doesn't is nostalgia.

I understand nostalgia and the desire to keep a vehicle original. But that's not what the Icon is about. There is nothing original on an Icon. Nothing, nada, zippo. New frame. New custom body. New drivetrain. New custom dash and instruments. New seats. New sunvisors. New custom switches. It isn't a restoration trying to preserve the original vehicle. It is basically a new vehicle that looks a lot like the old vehicle.

If you'd rather have the old vehicle restored because it is cheaper, or just because, that is a fully valid desire. But that doesn't make the older vehicle superior, because it isn't.

 

[Blacksunshyne]

Ok, so Yes....Dude seriously :bigok:

The 2F is an inline 6 cylinder, those motors are designed with a long stroke to produce what you want in a truck that is very off road capable...torque at low RPM. It is not designed to be fast, however it is not gutless, as it produces gobs of low end torque, whereas with the SBC (small block chevy) you need a lot more revolutions to produce the desired torque.

That was not intended to be a comparative statement saying that the 2F has more torque than the V8, if it came off that way it was unintended.

And yes I was having a little fun with the "more you know" thing, the internet is such serious business...I try to keep it light.

I'm glad you both like the V8 powered 40's, that should mean less competition, as I am trying to buy another with the 2F. :frog::frog:

 

[Canazes9]

That was not intended to be a comparative statement saying that the 2F has more torque than the V8, if it came off that way it was unintended.

And yes I was having a little fun with the "more you know" thing, the internet is such serious business...I try to keep it light.

I'm glad you both like the V8 powered 40's, that should mean less competition, as I am trying to buy another with the 2F. :frog::frog:

I'm just glad there's a place where I can have a friendly argument about whether or not I would prefer a V8 or 2F powered 40! arty:

Most of the people I know started getting this glazed look in their eyes when I want to discuss such topics.... :bolt:

David

 

[Stifler]

 

[dcdude]

Not surprising. Many manufacturers release their own retro-image models that generate excitement and a halo of consideration for their entire brand. They all pull hard on the heartstrings with heavy doses of nostalgia. Witness the:

- New Beetle
- Plymouth Prowler
- Chevy SSR pickup
- Ford Thunderbird
- New Camaro...

Get in line, FJ. None of them need stick around very long or even work that well. Due to basic design constraints, many are doomed from the start. They just need to stir up interest and showroom traffic to help sell more Camrys. Besides, low volume two-doors = low profits. Perhaps the T4R will be viewed as a similar corporate liability someday?