Are T4R brake lines the same as on the FJ?

[GrantK]

With all the shared parts between the T4R and FJ I was wondering if anyone knew if the flexible portions of our brake lines are interchangeable? I'm thinking about swapping mine out for braided stainless for both durability and to give a little extra slack to compensate for the extended travel lift on the front.

 

[Ducmonsta]

You should ask Mark at Metal Tech. They'll have the experience with both. On second thought, they are most likely the same. The Total Chaos long travel kit is the same for both and they come with brake lines.

 

[gadgetguy1288]

What common parts interchange between the two? I had no idea anything but the wheels did.?

 

[harper7]

With all the shared parts between the T4R and FJ I was wondering if anyone knew if the flexible portions of our brake lines are interchangeable? I'm thinking about swapping mine out for braided stainless for both durability and to give a little extra slack to compensate for the extended travel lift on the front.

Not sure if all the brake lines are interchangeable with FJ's but the rears are according to Metaltech.

Goodridge makes a SS brake line kit that replaces all 6 lines that supposedly fits our 5ths and I've had my eye on for a while now.:tongue:
They are pretty expensive but they make top quality stuff and I've bought many brake and fuel lines and fittings from them in the past on my sports and race cars. Goodridge Fluid Transfer Systems

There are 3 different kits
standard length(21186)
+2 inch length(2-21186)
and +4 inch (4-21186)

I planned on getting the 2 inch extended length ones.I take it you've changed brake lines before and as you know it can be a real PIA on some vehicles(M3's). I've never bled a 4Runner.......yet!
Here is the +2" kit on feebay Goodridge 2 21186 SS Brake Line Kit Toyota 4Runner 03 11 | eBay

a little cheaper............ Goodridge G-Stop Brake Lines TOYOTA 4RUNNER 2003 - 2011 2-21186

 

[GrantK]

Not sure if all the brake lines are interchangeable with FJ's but the rears are according to Metaltech.

Goodridge makes a SS brake line kit that replaces all 6 lines that supposedly fits our 5ths and I've had my eye on for a while now.:tongue:
They are pretty expensive but they make top quality stuff and I've bought many brake and fuel lines and fittings from them in the past on my sports and race cars. Goodridge Fluid Transfer Systems

There are 3 different kits
standard length(21186)
+2 inch length(2-21186)
and +4 inch (4-21186)

I planned on getting the 2 inch extended length ones.I take it you've changed brake lines before and as you know it can be a real PIA on some vehicles(M3's). I've never bled a 4Runner.......yet!
Here is the +2" kit on feebay Goodridge 2 21186 SS Brake Line Kit Toyota 4Runner 03 11 | eBay

a little cheaper............ Goodridge G-Stop Brake Lines TOYOTA 4RUNNER 2003 - 2011 2-21186

I was looking at the Goodridge along with the Crown Brake Lines. I've changes lines on old classic American iron and a Fiat 850. The only problem is routing them and making sure they aren't going to rub. Front brake lines and suspension parts seem to have a mutual attraction and love to rub against each other. I hate bleeding lines, It's not hard but annoying unless you've got a one-man bleeder or a good helper

 

[homeyclaus]

Realize that according to the FSM, if you get air into the ABS unit you need a Techstream to drive the bleed.

Apparently this is also important because if you open the lines with your battery connected the system will happily pump out all the fluid. As in auto-bleed.

Just going by memory, but it's worth a double-check.

And other than really, really needing the extra length, why fix what ain't broke?

 

[GrantK]

Realize that according to the FSM, if you get air into the ABS unit you need a Techstream to drive the bleed.

Apparently this is also important because if you open the lines with your battery connected the system will happily pump out all the fluid. As in auto-bleed.

Just going by memory, but it's worth a double-check.

And other than really, really needing the extra length, why fix what ain't broke?

Thanks for pointing out that Techstream is needed. That will probably rule this mod out for me. The reason for doing the mod is two fold. The lines should be longer since the truck is lifted and they are the weak point in the system. I guess for now I'll just see if I can get tweak the guides a little to provide a little more slack.

 

[homeyclaus]

Thanks for pointing out that Techstream is needed. That will probably rule this mod out for me. The reason for doing the mod is two fold. The lines should be longer since the truck is lifted and they are the weak point in the system. I guess for now I'll just see if I can get tweak the guides a little to provide a little more slack.

You don't need a techstream unless air gets into the system from the master cylinder, like when you're bleeding and forget to top up. Then you do need a techstream.

The only other thing I'd like to point out is that the brake lines are all steel braid inside as it is, with an additional rubber coating on the outside to protect that. For some reason when people talk about replacing brake hoses I always seem to get the impression that they think they're just rubber.

From the FSM, sorry about the cr** copy/paste job:

1. BLEED BRA KE LINE
(a) T urn the engine s witc h on (I G ).
(b) Remove the brake mas ter c ylinder res ervoir filler c ap as s embly.
(c ) A dd brake fluid until the fluid level is between the M I N and M A X lines of the res ervoir.
(d) Repeatedly depres s the brake pedal and bleed air from the bleeder plug of the front dis c brake
c ylinder RH .
(e) Repeat the s tep above until the air is c ompletely bled, and then tighten the bleeder plug while
depres s ing the brake pedal.
Torque: 11 N·m (110 kgf ·cm, 8f t ·lbf )
(f) Bleed the air from the bleeder plug of the front dis c brake c ylinder L H us ing the s ame proc edure as
for the RH s ide.
(g) With the brake pedal depres s ed, loos en the bleeder plug of the rear dis c brake c ylinder RH ,
c ontinue to hold the brake pedal and allow brake fluid to be drained from the bleeder plug while the
pump motor operates .
HINT:
A ir is bled as the pump motor operates while the brake pedal is being depres s ed.
Be s ure to releas e the brake pedal to s top the motor after approximately 1 0 0 s ec onds of
c ontinuous operation.
A s brake fluid is c ontinuous ly drained while the pump operates , it is not nec es s ary to repeatedly
depres s the brake pedal.
(h) When there is no more air in the brake fluid, tighten the bleeder plug, and then releas e the brake
pedal.
Torque: 11 N·m (110 kgf ·cm, 8f t ·lbf )
(i) Bleed the air from the bleeder plug of the rear dis c brake c ylinder L H us ing the s ame proc edure as
for the RH s ide.
(j) T urn the engine s witc h off (I G ).
(k) I ns pec t for brake fluid leaks .
(l) C hec k and adjus t the brake fluid level

 

[ArcticEd]

Resurrecting this old thread...

Changing the pads & rotors on my 2010 tomorrow and read the same passage in the RM. I was thinking about flushing the lines with a one-man vacuum pump so the fluid is new (whether needed or not), but don't want to run into any problems. The idea was to keep the master topped off and pull old fluid through the bleeders.

As long as the master is kept full and no air is pulled into the system is there any need for TechStream?

Other than having ignition on (engine started?) is there anything else unusual about "flushing" the brake fluid? I've done it on other cars with no need to have ignition on, but I gather the T4R system is different.

 

[Lester Lugnut]

Artic Ed:

See post #7 in this thread:

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/206178-2010-4runner-brake-pad-replacement.html

 

[MONST4R]

I did my brake lines with Goodrich lines and they worked out fine. I wold however go with +2 like harper.

 

[ArcticEd]

Artic Ed:

See post #7 in this thread:

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/206178-2010-4runner-brake-pad-replacement.html

Thanks Lester, that was the part of the manual that concerned me. Also great info regarding the MC - I won't be buying that extra baster!

I'm still a little paranoid and may not be completely getting it - will using a vacuum pump to flush the fluid actually cause damage/potential failure or will it just throw some DTC's? I don't understand if pulling fresh fluid through the system is the same as "bleeding air" as there should be no air.

My plan was to:
1) Open/Drain the MC; top off with fresh fluid
2) Attach MityVac kit to the bleeder
3) Turn IG to on
4) Pull fluid through the bleeder until it's relatively clear (checking to make sure the MC stays topped off on the way)

I'll forego that process & just change the pads/rotors if it has the potential to cause an actual problem with the system.

Thanks again for the response

 

[Lester Lugnut]

ArticEd:

You may have seen this from the 4th Gen forum:

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/145716-brake-bleeding-w-abs-w-o-sst-tool.html

I would consider comments made by BlackWorksInc - a skilled dealer tech.

In one of his posts he mentions bleeding "with the ignition on". If I understand it, this is prerequisite to bleeding successfully with Techstream. With the ignition on, the system activates the solenoids and a given amount of "self-bleeding" begins. In the 2010 FSM bleed procedure I pointed to, you'll see the following as a "hint":


Air is bled as the pump motor operates while the brake pedal is being depressed.
Be sure to release the brake pedal to stop the motor after approximately 100 seconds of continuous operation. As brake fluid is continuously drained while the pump operates , it is not necessary to repeatedly depress the brake pedal.


I have a gut feeling that a person working alone w/o Techstream AND the ignition on - is going to be running uphill and against the clock(100 secs?). This may be where people are getting into trouble. Not sure.

I may pursue Techstream one of these days, but the "affordable" version is pirated Chinese software. How complete is it? Does the included bleeding process work(if it's even included)? I've read enough Techstream anomalies on a half dozen Toyota forums to keep my head spinning for a month.

This is just my 2 cents, but if I were going to bleed/flush the brake fluid, I would leave the ignition off and "gravity" bleed all 4 calipers at once. Get hoses attached first on all 4 wheels, each one inside a bottle with fluid above the open end of each hose at the bottom of each bottle, then crack open each bleeder. Continuously monitor fluid level in reservoir and have plenty of it available. Close down all 4 bleeders when you think you've passed enough fluid through the system.

What I don't know about gravity bleeding/flushing this type of system is what part if any is "bypassed" using this method and does a flow even begin.

 

[ArcticEd]

Thanks again - I think I'm going to skip the flush/bleed process. Not sure I completely understand everything that's going on with it & don't want to mess something up. It was nice to be able to do this myself on past cars; MityVac worked like a champ.