Audiophiles Question for you...

[bigjebus]

First off, long time lurker, and as we all know this forum is the end all be all to any 4runner (namely 4th gen) question/mods. Thanks again for all the info.

My question pertains to my front two speakers. I replaced all of my speakers a while back as well as the headunit which has a built in 22 rms 4 channel amp. Up front i replaced the factory 6x9's with 3 way 6x9 pioneer's (don't blast me). It was pretty much direct plug and play and as you can imagine, the sound quality was a 1000x better than stock so I put the door panels on after a little tinkering and never gave it much thought...until the other day. Had my panel off messing with the door actuator and noticed the tweeter up top. Can't believe I didn't notice it before but it is what it is. My 3 ways of course have built in tweeters (which are currently not doing anything) in them and those are what i want to use, not the stock tweeters up top.

Tried unplugging the tweeters, disconnecting, and reconnecting the battery, and resetting the HU hoping it would automatically synchronize to the tweeters on the speaker but still no dice. How can I use the tweeters on my 3 way speakers, instead of the stock ones above???

Have searched all over and no dice. TIA.

 

[Mike07SE]

They're getting juice. There is no synching or anything like that that is going to change anything. Disconnect the upper door tweeter (which is more a mid / tweet), and listen closely to your pioneer and you'll see that it's working.

 

[bigjebus]

^Tried doing that and the speakers (6x9's) don't even come on much less the mid/tweeter???

 

[steveni70]

Do you have the JBL stock system with the amp in the back? If you just installed your new head unit with a standard wiring harness, it's probably still sending its signal to the stock amp, which I believe has separate channels for the tweeter and midbass. The midbass channel has the top rolled off, which is why you're not hearing the tweeter. You could bypass the stock amp and run wires from the new head unit to your speakers, or you can leave it how it is and use the stock tweeter. I doubt the pioneer tweeter will sound much better.

 

[bigjebus]

No JBL, to clarify, stock HU and speakers were replaced with aftermarket HU and speakers. Just meant aftermarket HU has a small four channel amp in it powering the lower fronts and rears...

When I disconnect the tweeters I don't get any power to my 3 way 6x9's for some reason??? That's the part I can't figure out...

Also saw the 3.5 tweeter mod^^ you did and that looked legit. How was the wiring with that. Direct plug and play going from the stock tweeters to the 3.5 coax's???

Thanks.

 

[EdmundGTP]

Unless your pioneer 6x9's have multiple places to hook up wire leads, the mids/tweeters in that unit SHOULD be working.

If your 6X9's stop working when you disconnect the upper OEM tweeter, that leads me to believe that the upper tweeter and the lower OEM speaker were wired in series rather than parallel. Try removing the OEM tweeter and jumping those speaker leads together.

 

[bigjebus]

Took the panel off today and looked at the wires... was going to go ahead with it but didn't want to fry anything so I figured I'd double check w/ you guys first.

Wiring harness for Tweeters

Wiring harness for 6x9's

... Sorry for the crappy pics. So you're telling me to attach the two pink and two purple wires together in the 6x9 harness?

Which begs the question as to what the blue and red wires are for in the tweeter harness. Would i still be able to install 3.5 coax's up top where the tweeters currently are just using the red and blue wires??? Thanks again for your time and knowledge.

 

[EdmundGTP]

Can't see your pics for some reason.

I have to preemptively say though that this is all just educated guessing on my part. I've never even seen the inside of a 4Runner door, let alone the specific wiring for the speakers. I do have some pretty good knowledge and experience with regard to audio systems in general though.

I'll try and explain it more clearly. There should be two wire leads going to the OEM upper tweeter (Bule and Red Im assuming). Those two leads are part of a complete circuit path, which powers both the OEM upper tweeter, and the lower door speaker. If there is no connection between those leads(i.e. no upper tweeter installed, or the wires are just disconnected and left hanging free not touching eachother) then the circuit responsible for the sound coming out of ALL of your door speakers is broken, and you won't hear anything. This is of course assuming that the door speakers are indeed wired in series.

So if you want sound to come out of your 6X9 only, try connecting the Red and Blue leads together. Even if the speakers ARENT wired in series, most headunits have short protection built in, so you shouldn't fry anything by trying this out. But obviously I make no guarantees and claim no responsibility either way.

If you want sound to come out of the 6X9 AND a 3.5" coax you can try wiring in the coax using the Red and Blue leads. There is however something else to be aware of.

The impedence rating of the OEM speakers is most likely different than what your aftermarket speakers are rated at. The entire door circuit is designed to present a specific impedence load to the head unit. Changing one or both of the speakers will change the total impedence load, and will affect how much power each speaker sees from your head unit.

For example. You take my suggestion, and simply connect the Red and Blue leads and run the 6X9 only.

Then you decide to add the 3.5" speaker into the upper spot. The overall impedence level of the circuit will go up (possibly double), reducing power from the headunit, and resulting in a significantly lower volume coming from the pair of speakers, than there was coming from just the single 6x9.

The opposite of this would be true if the speakers are wired in parallel.

There really is a good bit more technicality to all of this but I tried to keep it as basic as possible.

Try and get the pic situation fixed before taking my specific advice. I'd like to be certain of which wires (colors) are where. I'm just guessing that the blue and red were the ones originally connected to the OEM tweeter

 

[bigjebus]

thanks again for your help.

They show up on mine, but i'll try them as attachments. First one is the speaker harness, second is the tweeter harness.

 

[bigjebus]

I'm guessing pink and pink, purple and purple and put them back in the 6x9 harness?

 

[EdmundGTP]

So from the 4 wire plug, the blue and red go to the OME tweeter, and the purple and pink go to the 6X9? Is that what's going on in there?

 

[bigjebus]

No there are two seperate harnesses. The pink purple blue and red go to the tweeter, and the pink and purple on the other harness go to the 6x9.

 

[EdmundGTP]

Honestly, I think you should have somebody who knows what they're doing look at it. Those pictures really arent much of a help at all, and this is obviously significantly above your level of technical ability with regard to electronics. No offense intended.

I know I could figure it out if I was standing there looking at it, but given the rate and vagueness of information exchange going on presently, I don't think I'll be able to offer much more in the way of help on this.

I'm still fairly certan that the OEM tweeter "completes" the audio circuit for the door. If it wasn't, and you completely disconnected it, the 6x9 would still play sound. You have to either replace the OEM tweeter with another one that you want to use, or figure out a way to complete the circut with wire only, instead of an audio component. That's about all I can offer on the situation, short of tearing my own door panel off and looking at the wiring for myself.

 

[MikeInNH]

If you disconnect the top tweeters in the door you're really going to miss them. High frequency sound is very very directional. The higher the frequency the more directional. Having the high frequency coming in at your feet...you actually may not hear some of the HF sounds.

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

save yourself the headache and just run new speaker wire from your headunit.

 

[ddnww]

save yourself the headache and just run new speaker wire from your headunit.

if hes running an aftermarket head unit, he should be doing that anyway..

OP >. its best to use aftermarket speaker wire when connecting aftermarket speakers to your aftermarket deck.. and as DR Gonzo stated, it can save you a headache.

 

[earthrealm]

hope this doesnt sound silly...but y would one run new wires when installing new speakers, i replaced my stock HU with pioneer avh4400bh HU, and left my stock speakers, sound is ok..but not fantastic...now i want to replace the stock speakers with 3 way pioneer speakers..am a noob so the though of running new speaker wires scare me...wondering if i can use the existing speaker wires...so the installation will just be a simple plug n play.

 

[MrBunnyRunner]

For some reason this was the first thread that popped up when I was looking to disconnect the tweets (temporary until I can get some 6x9 components) and it just looks like there is an opportunity for some help. ;-)


I originally:
1) Added a Scion head unit (it was great for quick upgrade)... then the American rat race began....
2) Dropped in some 3-way 6x9 pioneers and 2-way's in the back... things were good.
3) Then I wanted Bluetooth and picked up a inexpensive Pioneer head unit (It's ok... wondered if I should have stepped my game up). THING SOUNDED LIKE POO UNTIL I DISCONNECTED THE FACTORY TWEETS!

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong... this is what I found out:

So from the 4 wire plug, the blue and red go to the OME tweeter, and the purple and pink go to the 6X9? Is that what's going on in there?

+ The front speakers are in series (one after the other)... with a filter on the tweeter. It's confusing because it looks like the (Purple & Pink) go "back" to the 6x9 and technically they do but on a wiring diagram they "continue" (hopefully that makes sense) to the 6x9's.

The colors are different on the Driver vs Passenger door but basically 2 (blue & red) wires come in from the HU, they are are crimped to the (Purple & Pink)... then there is a short (Red & Black) that connects the tweeter.


If you peel back the shrink wrap it will make more sense... check out the picture from [MENTION=51965]SamNavy[/MENTION]: http://goo.gl/f9TswK


And the wiring diagram from [MENTION=25373]olsen_karl[/MENTION]: 063rap3copy.jpg Photo by morbius2009 | Photobucket



So if you want to "disconnect" the factory tweeters and just power the 6x9's... all you have to do is CUT the (RED & BLACK) that next to the tweeter. You could put some jumpers in the wiring harness, but I'd suspect that most will eventually upgrade to Components (which will ultimately sound the best) so I don't think it would be worth anyone's time.

FYI the stock tweeters are horrible and very conflicting with another set of tweets (in the 2 or 3-way 6x9's)... so if you upgrade the 6x9's definitely disconnect the tweets.