Bilstein 5100 vs 6112

[honda250xtitan]

OK, here's what puzzles me: Evidently the 6112 is a firmer, larger shock than the 5100. Yet it seems owners are mixing the two, front 6112 and back 5100.

Somehow this seems contradictory to me ... and that you would want shocks with the same attributes all around.

Comments?

its still bilstein with Bilstein valving that is tuned for the 4runner. you won't notice a difference until you thrash the vehicle and the 5100 series shock blows out but the 6112 just keeps on going. Now if you ran ICON up front and king in the back you may "feel" a difference because ICON runs digressive valving and King is progressive....but is anyone really gonna notice? also what kind of a heathen would dirty their Kings up with Icons?

 

[borfoo3]

OP, Any of the monotube shock options mentioned will be a good step up in feel and control from the OEM twin tubes

Found a good deal? Worried about buyer remorse? Already decided but still waiting for everyone to say 'go'? Get the 6112

If not, and highly concerned with best $/gain that still gets you a good shock with adjustability --> get the 5100

I'm happy with my 6112/ 5160 for all 2 years worth of trouble-free ownership so far. Haven't been nice to them either..

 

[Bumbo]

OK, here's what puzzles me: Evidently the 6112 is a firmer, larger shock than the 5100. Yet it seems owners are mixing the two, front 6112 and back 5100.

Somehow this seems contradictory to me ... and that you would want shocks with the same attributes all around.

Comments?

Personally I felt the 5100 had firmer valving... it feels more street-centric than my 6112.

If Bilstein actually made a large body 6112 for the rear I would have bought it, but they don't.

Most pair with a 5100 or 5160 because its the two most logical cost effective options with close enough valving with the 5160 being the better pairing between the two.

The only off the shelf large body options are the ones from King/ICON/Fox or whoever else makes these things... Radflow...

I am one of those people who run a 5100 in the rear, and personally I would like to upgrade to a large body shock, but the next step up for me really is a $1200 shock and I just don't feel like spending it yet.

Maybe when the thing finally dies I will upgrade, but even with abuse the thing is holding up. Its a good shock, its done what I asked it to do, but to be honest I still think I run out of headroom with the front even before I do in the rear.

I just don't think the rear needs to work as hard... ill bottom out the fronts before I do the rears with my setup... perhaps I need a spring rate increase up front.

 

[ToolUser1]

5100 experience

I just installed the 5100s all around on a 2011 trail edition. I'd recommend the 6112s if the goal is to reduce nose diving and body roll. The 5100s are far far better than stock, but didn't get me quite to where I wanted to be.

Warning on the installation - when reinstalling the front struts the service manual describes the correct orientation for the lower spring platform. I almost forgot to get the orientation right. Maybe it makes a difference, maybe it doesn't, but can't hurt to do it the "correct" way.

Good luck.

 

[DesertFish]

I've been looking into upgrading from the stock suspension on my KDSS equipped 4R, I've hated how firm it is over potholes and bumps in the road from day 1. I test drove a 3rd gen trd off road Tacoma before deciding on the 4R and the Tacoma was night and day better at soaking up the bumps on road which was disappointing. I've been looking into the 6112/5160 setup for a bit now as I really don't want to get into rebuilding shocks. Biggest thing keeping me from pulling the trigger is the all over the place opinions people have on how much more dampening the 6112/5160 setup has over stock vs say one of the rebuild-able options. I'm not worried about body roll or nose dive, I just want compliance that soaks up bumps.

 

[Bumbo]

I've been looking into upgrading from the stock suspension on my KDSS equipped 4R, I've hated how firm it is over potholes and bumps in the road from day 1. I test drove a 3rd gen trd off road Tacoma before deciding on the 4R and the Tacoma was night and day better at soaking up the bumps on road which was disappointing. I've been looking into the 6112/5160 setup for a bit now as I really don't want to get into rebuilding shocks. Biggest thing keeping me from pulling the trigger is the all over the place opinions people have on how much more dampening the 6112/5160 setup has over stock vs say one of the rebuild-able options. I'm not worried about body roll or nose dive, I just want compliance that soaks up bumps.

I understand the 6112 can also be re-built and that should be a selling point to some degree.

I considered it a selling point over a 5100. I installed a serviceable part into the truck vs a consumable part. That said rebuilding probably cost about what you would pay for a 5100.

Here is my opinion on the bold...

People buy "those" types of shocks for a reason... and I don't think its dampening that is on the forefront of the decision making.

I would buy those shocks because I want more control over ride height.
I would buy those shocks because I want more control over dampening
I would buy those shocks because I want a remote rez for better thermal envelope.

If none of those things interest you, then the 6112 is the ticket.

If you want simplicity, then the 6112 is for you.

The point of those more "expensive" shocks are the fact you have way more granular control over setup and application and because they last longer or can have a better service life under hard use.

I don't want to use the word investment, but at that price level you are buying something that can be tuned for an application vs a shock that can't.

Because the 6112 exists... I would not buy one of "those" other higher end shocks unless I was buying adjustable clickers, and a remote rez. Without those two items, it's going to perform very close to the 6112 assuming the valving is similar between the two in comparison.

Remember... its not some magic device, its a tube filled with oil with a valve in it. Theoretically two physically similar shocks are going to be capable of a very similar duty...

 

[DesertFish]

Remember... its not some magic device, its a tube filled with oil with a valve in it. Theoretically two physically similar shocks are going to be capable of a very similar duty...

I just can't shake how different the Tacoma was compared to the 4R, with the Tacoma just feeling like it took any pothole/bump/train track like a Cadillac. Sure the 4R has KDSS and corners flat unlike the Tacoma that had body roll for days, but there must be some middle ground. I guess what I'm looking for is as much dampening as possible, even if excessive, as I expect KDSS to make up for some of it. There has to be some option out there, if the TRD Off Road Tacoma can do it from the factory...

 

[Bumbo]

I just can't shake how different the Tacoma was compared to the 4R, with the Tacoma just feeling like it took any pothole/bump/train track like a Cadillac. Sure the 4R has KDSS and corners flat unlike the Tacoma that had body roll for days, but there must be some middle ground. I guess what I'm looking for is as much dampening as possible, even if excessive, as I expect KDSS to make up for some of it. There has to be some option out there, if the TRD Off Road Tacoma can do it from the factory...

Ya I can't help you there... I haven't driven both side-by-side and have little to no seat time with a KDSS variant.

Perhaps it's the KDSS that's flavoring your experience.

Remember, tires matter a lot too. My thinner lighter road tires feel a lot different than my beefy side-walled off-road set. The stiffer tires work the suspension harder. You have KO2s, that could be what you are feeling.

If it is a genuine dislike for the shock on your truck, then I think you would be pleasantly surprised to how graceful that 6112 runs. Its really is smooth and its just eats up what the road throws at it.

Alternately... you might just be really picky and very difficult to please. Maybe a shock with adjustable dampening is right for you... I still think a 6112 would satisfy what you are looking for, but if you want to be able to tune the setup to your preference then just go for gold.

 

[Javin028]

I just can't shake how different the Tacoma was compared to the 4R, with the Tacoma just feeling like it took any pothole/bump/train track like a Cadillac. Sure the 4R has KDSS and corners flat unlike the Tacoma that had body roll for days, but there must be some middle ground. I guess what I'm looking for is as much dampening as possible, even if excessive, as I expect KDSS to make up for some of it. There has to be some option out there, if the TRD Off Road Tacoma can do it from the factory...

That's odd, I have a 2016 with KDSS, and from my experience, it rides much better on the road than non-KDSS. As [MENTION=144483]Bumbo[/MENTION] said above, tires make a big difference. I have the same tires as you and noticed an immediate difference when I got them mounted. BFG ko2s in 275/70/17 only come in E rating so they're much heavier and stiffer than stock. Before the BFGs, steering was really like and the ride felt like a Cadillac over bumps. After mounting, steering feels more solid and overall ride feels more like the truck that it is.

I recently got the 6112/5160 combo and I love it. It counteracted some of the effects of the BFGs, but is still stiffer than stock which is expected. A little bit of on road sacrifice for A LOT of off-road gain.

Here's a post I have about my Bilstein 6112/5160 setup:
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-g...-everyone-using-6112-setup-3.html#post2779951

 

[DesertFish]

That's odd, I have a 2016 with KDSS, and from my experience, it rides much better on the road than non-KDSS. As [MENTION=144483]Bumbo[/MENTION] said above, tires make a big difference. I have the same tires as you and noticed an immediate difference when I got them mounted. BFG ko2s in 275/70/17 only come in E rating so they're much heavier and stiffer than stock. Before the BFGs, steering was really like and the ride felt like a Cadillac over bumps. After mounting, steering feels more solid and overall ride feels more like the truck that it is.

I recently got the 6112/5160 combo and I love it. It counteracted some of the effects of the BFGs, but is still stiffer than stock which is expected. A little bit of on road sacrifice for A LOT of off-road gain.

I knew going into the E rated Ko2s, things would be stiffer, but even on the stock tires, things were harsh. I just figured I'd upgrade suspension anyways down the road. I'm hoping the 6112/5160 combo will do the trick.

 

[cdiset]

I knew going into the E rated Ko2s, things would be stiffer, but even on the stock tires, things were harsh. I just figured I'd upgrade suspension anyways down the road. I'm hoping the 6112/5160 combo will do the trick.

Tire pressure! I run my E rated KO2's and 5100's on the street at 32psi cold and it makes potholes not as teeth chattering. Will my tires, brakes, and transmission last? Who knows.

 

[Bumbo]

Tire pressure! I run my E rated KO2's and 5100's on the street at 32psi cold and it makes potholes not as teeth chattering. Will my tires, brakes, and transmission last? Who knows.

I tend to run about that... 32 front and 30 rear. I think it rides pretty good.

That said, in comparison to my michelin ltx m/s2 road tires, it feels like im driving an aired down michelin man. It's like marshmallow in a good way. It does add a lot of comfort and compliance. Its actually a really nice tire. I prefer it over the KO2 on the street which is why I maintain a second set for off-road.

 

[zerodaydave]

Can't tell you which one is better since I'm still a newbie, but so far this place has the cheapest set of the 5100s i think so far..

4Runner5thGen5100Set - Bilstein 5100 Complete SET - Total Automotive Performance - Your Source for Auto Parts and Accessories

New to the forum. I just bought a 2017 TRD Off Road Premium. I apologize if this question has already been answered but I would like to lift my truck 2.5" in the front and 1.5" in the back. With this complete set do I still need to get the daystar spacer for the rear or does the rear 5100s lift up to two inches as well? I would like to keep the truck as level as possible. Also do I need to order UCAS as well or just this kit?

Thanks!

 

[bsdoig]

New to the forum. I just bought a 2017 TRD Off Road Premium. I apologize if this question has already been answered but I would like to lift my truck 2.5" in the front and 1.5" in the back. With this complete set do I still need to get the daystar spacer for the rear or does the rear 5100s lift up to two inches as well? I would like to keep the truck as level as possible. Also do I need to order UCAS as well or just this kit?

Thanks!

You will need a lift spring or spacer to get any lift out of the rear. The rear 5100 alone gives no lift.

 

[Wags1968]

Just installed last week. 3" lift with (4) 5100's... Ride quality same as stock shocks. Stainless look, GREAT Quality . VERY Happy......

 

[Bumbo]

Just installed last week. 3" lift with (4) 5100's... Ride quality same as stock shocks. Stainless look, GREAT Quality . VERY Happy......

Are not the specs of that shock 0-2.5 Front and 0-2" rear?

If you did install a 3" lift, you might be exceeding the operating range of that shock fully extended.

Most people who use a 5100 for any lift higher than 2-2.5" generally say the shock doesn't ride as well.

 

[FZRunner]

Interesting stuff. I'm currently running 5100's all around on my 4th gen, with Eibach/Toytec springs front and rear. Like 'em, but since I may buy a 5th gen model soon, I was very interested in your opinions of the 6112's. I guess you're all lifting the front a bit, for leveling or whatever, but nobody mentions UCA's. Does that mean the stock ones suffice? It's always a weird one with my truck. Nobody would say yes or no, so I left them stock when I did the install. Cheers, G.

 

[Bumbo]

Interesting stuff. I'm currently running 5100's all around on my 4th gen, with Eibach/Toytec springs front and rear. Like 'em, but since I may buy a 5th gen model soon, I was very interested in your opinions of the 6112's. I guess you're all lifting the front a bit, for leveling or whatever, but nobody mentions UCA's. Does that mean the stock ones suffice? It's always a weird one with my truck. Nobody would say yes or no, so I left them stock when I did the install. Cheers, G.

The answer is it depends...

it depends on your trucks setup
it depends on how much lift
it depends on your alignment numbers

Most people just take the lift height as a guide when it comes to making a decision on UCA.

I have a 6112 on my 4th Gen, it's one down from the highest settings. My caster is a little out of spec, I could benefit from a UCA, but the truck is still pretty well behaved and doesn't dart around from the caster... but it doesn't track as well as a stock setup.

Any higher and I would pretty much NEED a UCA to get those alignment numbers back in check. I bet if I had a UCA right now I could feel the caster improvement but i'm lazy and cheap so I left it alone.

On my 4th Gen truck, anything 2" or lower you can get away with it. Anything higher is a recommended to required depending on what you see at the alignment shop.

 

[FZRunner]

I was just looking to see what 5th gen.'s did with this particular set up. Like I said, a lot of combo things are mentioned, but nobody spoke about adding UCA's with their lifts. I didn't bother with mine, kept the front at the lowest setting. Cheers.

 

[tacoyota]

So the front cv angles are okay with 3 inch lift? I am just curious because most Tacoma folks say 2.5 is max and that the cv boots/axles will last about 80-100k. Curious of the 5th gen 4runner is different?